Europe funds space tourism study

[ragnorak]

<br />Seems the European Space Agency is funding space tourism, but what is NASA doing on this?<br /><br />http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2007/01/16/211513/starchaser-catches-esa-tourism-deal.html<br /><br />Anybody know anymore about this Starchaser company?<br />

 

[dreada5]

ESA are probably funding this because space tourism is less developed in Europe compared to the US. ESA are most likely trying to accelerate the development of private space enterprise in europe. This is not a priority for NASA.<br /><br />Most high profile efforts in the US are funded by wealthy aerospace entrepreneurs, eg. Bigelow, Rutan, Elon from SpaceX etc. <br /><br /><br />Starchaser are a small company run by a "biker" called Steve Bennett, who also happens to be a university lecturer, don't know if he still is, but he gets support from the university and its students.<br /><br />They have a history over the past 10 or so years of launching small atmospheric rockets which have gradually grown in size. They signed up to compete in the X-prize, but were unable to have their ambitious "Thunderstar" vehicle ready in time. They have however since set-up a second office out in Mojave (last i heard), whilst temporarily stepping back from Thunderstar to further develop/mature its sub-systems. They will most likely test them within future, sub-scale "Thunderstar/Starchaser 5" rockets.<br /><br />The outspoken visionary, Steve Bennett wants to be the next major player (alongside Richard Branson) in the UK, providing manned access to space within the next five or so years. And although the british government has not shown any interest joining his sponsors in supporting him, for the first time ever a major space agency has shown support for his enterprise!<br /><br />http://www.starchaser.co.uk/

 

[space_dreamer]

Does anybody know which other company’s received funding? <br /><br />I thought the European Space Agency was offering three separate £150k study grants. <br />

 

[alpha_centauri]

Yeh, Starchaser were one of the few X-Prize competitors to have tested hardware. Steve Bennet is a university lecturer in space technology at Salford University, just down the road from mine.<br /><br />Starchaser has opened it's US branch in Las Cruces, NM and is the first company to do so, taking advantage of the planned regional spaceport being developed there.<br /><br />Currently they're working on the Skybolt sounding rocket as a commercial reusable means of providing access to space for scientific payloads. test burns of the engine are due soon. Skybolt is essentially a scale version of the larger Thunderstar vehicle.

 

[mako71]

I would like to see Europe to concentrate on space robotics rather than developing manned missions and space tourism. Yes, I'd like to go to space, but I think that the robotics is more important in long run... Only if tourism gives money for space development(*), then I would fund it <br /><br />(*) "What?" I hear you say. "Aren't space tourism space development?!?"<br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p>________________ </p><p>reaaliaika.net </p> </div>

 

[no_way]

<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p>Only if tourism gives money for space development(*), then I would fund it <p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br /><br />Thats the thing. "Tourism" has built in incentives for companies to offer more for less money. That means, that they will invest in creating better, safer , cheaper and more frequent ways of getting up there. Normal market forces at work. <br /><br />Once the price per flight becomes low enough, all sorts of different groups can afford it for different purposes ( company research groups, universities ) that will want the flights, but with their unique capabilities, which will mean that companies will have to invest more to serve them better, and if one company doesnt step in to serve that market, another will because they see untapped opportunitiy.. and so on, an on.<br /><br />The whole idea of promoting space tourism is for the purpose of getting started on that development spiral, where new market, new types of demand and new suppliers can emerge. Currently we just sort of see demand for flying rich people up there, once the development starts to spiral, at new price points new services will appear.<br /><br />Government role in here is to help speeding up that spiral in the beginning, and that exactly what ESA tries here.

 

[radarredux]

> <i><font color="yellow">Government role in here is to help speeding up that spiral in the beginning, and that exactly what ESA tries here.</font>/i><br /><br />I am against NASA getting into or even directly promoting tourism, but I do support NASA supporting the nascent space enterprise in a number of ways (many of which Griffin has already touched on) including:<ul><li>Effectively mothball the vomit comet and book training on Zero-G's service.<br /><li>Ramp up funding for micro-gravity research that can take place for short periods of time (minutes), and require the researchers book time on Zero-G or the expected suborbital services.<br /><li>Book flights on suborbital flights for all potential astronauts recruits as part of the recruiting program, to give recruits exposure to Zero-G (e.g., make sure they like it), and to give NASA more opportunities to evaluate the recruits response.<br /><li>Book flights on Zero-G or suborbitals for astronaut training to gain experience with some activies (e.g., unscrewing a bolt and removing a panel while weightless).<br /><li>Maintain an "astronaut wings wall" at a high profile NASA site (e.g., Kennedy or Johnson) that lists all Americans who have earned their astronaut wings.<br /><li>Be more supportive in public of the space tourists (or "flight participant") aboard ISS. They can do lots of little things such as promoting an official joint NASA and tourist patch, hosting a "dinner" for the tourist on the ISS, giving tourist's a tour of the Shuttle when it is docked at the ISS (if they coincide), providing a suitable display at the major NASA tourist center showing photos and background information for each tourist who has boarded ISS, and so on.<br /><li>In the NASA souvenir shops sell mechandise (books, mouse pads, videos) associated with the private space industries and provide contact information on how to reach them.<br /><li>If Bigelow is successfu</li></li></li></li></li></li></li></li></ul></i>

 

[dreada5]

<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p>I would like to see Europe to concentrate on space robotics rather than developing manned missions and space tourism.<p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br /><br />I, on the other hand, would like to see Europe concentrate more on developing their own manned capability.<br /><br />Its all very well being experts in space robotics but if Europe doesn't have the ability to choose <b>how</b> it participates in international missions (through robotics, crew/cargo transportation, instrumentation etc) then Europe will always be dependent on other nations and IMO that is an incorrect mindset/approach as it limits what Europe can do.

 

[alpha_centauri]

Indeed<br /><br />practically every major and semi-major governmental player in space are develpoing their own manned space plans. hell even the indians are. It would be stupid for europe not get involved as it will only end up loosing out on the opportunities.

 

[mako71]

<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p><br />dreada: Its all very well being experts in space robotics but if Europe doesn't have the ability to choose how it participates in international missions (through robotics, crew/cargo transportation, instrumentation etc) then Europe will always be dependent on other nations and IMO that is an incorrect mindset/approach as it limits what Europe can do. <br /><p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br /><br />Yes, you're right about that, but I think it in that way, that is it really so important to be independent? Space exploration is indeed a huge effort to take to anyone, so I trust on co-operation. And when I'm looking the most interesting missions from my point of view, I would say that those are e.g. ISS, Pioneers, Voyagers, Galileo, Cassini, DS-1, New Horizons and of course these current Mars missions (orbital satellite and rovers). Ah, and I should not forget Hubble - it's amazing!<br /><br />Of course, manned missions are a good PR thing for getting funds for space programs and that's why I understand the intrest to make them.<br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p>________________ </p><p>reaaliaika.net </p> </div>

 

[rocketman5000]

The more people designing and launching spacecraft the more new and different ideas get tried. Having someone that has never designed a or been involved in spacecraft design will allow for a clean mental state perhaps leading to a major breakthrough in aerospace design. <br /><br />In the bad taste of giving irrelevant analogies. If Henry Ford had been the only mass producer of cars we would still be driving around in cars very similiar to Model T's<br /><br />

 

[holmec]

>Seems the European Space Agency is funding space tourism, but what is NASA doing on this? <<br /><br />This is just ESA's response to NASA's COTS grant that was awarded to Space X and RocketPlane Kistler to finish their rockets and capsules. ESA is just copying NASA, as it should. Of course NASA got the hint from Ansari X Prize org.<br /><br />Let the European space startups get their chance....or second chance (first chance was with Ansari X Prize).<br /><br />So this is just the next thing in grant offering for commercial space (of course it is tourism) which started on the private sector level anyway and governments decided to participate with grants. Its the same spirit as Lindy's Spirit Of St Louis successful flight over the Atlantic.<br /><br />Thank God for visionaries. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p><font color="#0000ff"><em>"SCE to AUX" - John Aaron, curiosity pays off</em></font></p> </div>

 

[dreada5]

Hmm, although I can't see Starchaser rivalling Ariane/ATV for servicing Colombus this side of 2010! <img src="/images/icons/wink.gif" />

 

[j05h]

<i>> Hmm, although I can't see Starchaser rivalling Ariane/ATV for servicing Colombus this side of 2010!</i><br /><br />I can't see ATV flying before 2010! <br /><br />(just kidding, but they sure are taking their sweet time with it)<br /><br />Josh <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <div align="center"><em>We need a first generation of pioneers.</em><br /></div> </div>