How do we prevent divorce in the Astronaut Corps?

[willpittenger]

In Gene Cernan's autobiography, he wrote how the Apollo training put tremendous stress on his marriage. Even though he announced prior to Apollo 17 that he would retire after the flight, his wife divorced him shortly after the flight. The problem was that he lived in the Houston area, but the Apollo simulators were mostly in the Cape area. So he was away from home a lot.<br /><br />With spouses tolerating less and less, what can we do about the problem? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Will Pittenger<hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Add this user box to your Wikipedia User Page to show your support for the SDC forums: <div style="margin-left:1em">{{User:Will Pittenger/User Boxes/Space.com Account}}</div> </div>

 

[docm]

Hire single astronauts? /shrug/<br /><br />That or spend some bux on human factors in the form of sims in Houston <i>or</i> housing in Florida.<br /><br />Keeping families separated just won't work. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[windnwar]

The military has been dealing with this issue for decades, and in general only so so. Which is why divorce rates are so high there as well. Long term family seperation leads to stress on the marriage and a much high chance of it all falling apart. <br /><br />The only solution is housing nearby the training. The problem with that is with training spread around, if your spouse is employed they aren't going to be able to follow you everywhere you go for training. Which gets back to centrally locating as much of the training facilities as possible. It just isn't always practical. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p><font size="2" color="#0000ff">""Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." --Albert Einstein"</font></p> </div>

 

[willpittenger]

I should note that Zeke Slayton would dump astronauts that looked like they were about to be divorced. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Will Pittenger<hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Add this user box to your Wikipedia User Page to show your support for the SDC forums: <div style="margin-left:1em">{{User:Will Pittenger/User Boxes/Space.com Account}}</div> </div>

 

[willpittenger]

So why did so many astronauts pick Houston rather than Orlando (less than an hour from the Cape)? Also, if Houston was required, how would locating the simulators there solve the problem? For the better part of a month, the crew has to practice actual launches in the actual vehicle on the actual pad. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Will Pittenger<hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Add this user box to your Wikipedia User Page to show your support for the SDC forums: <div style="margin-left:1em">{{User:Will Pittenger/User Boxes/Space.com Account}}</div> </div>

 

[sorehed]

Zeke Slayton...he was the one from Tennessee, right?

 

[qso1]

I see no way to prevent divorce in the astronaut corp and frankly, its their business anyway whether they stay married or not. Keeping in mind the military has the same sort of pressures to deal with. Navy submarine personnel who can be away from loved ones for months at a stretch. The ongoing Iraq rebuild which requires troops to stay much longer than they anticipated. They are facing pressures as great as any astronaut.<br /><br />As you pointed out when you said "With spouses tolerating less and less"...its precisely this unwillingness to be tolerant that makes it impossible to stop divorce in any marriage. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><strong>My borrowed quote for the time being:</strong></p><p><em>There are three kinds of people in life. Those who make it happen, those who watch it happen...and those who do not know what happened.</em></p> </div>

 

[qso1]

Houston as a NASA center was picked by LBJ at around the time Gemini started. It would have been better in my opinion to have the whole space training, mission control, and launch activities stay at the cape but politics at the Presidential level almost always wins out over practicality.<br /><br />In short, what your suggesting about training in real vehicles...makes too much sense. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><strong>My borrowed quote for the time being:</strong></p><p><em>There are three kinds of people in life. Those who make it happen, those who watch it happen...and those who do not know what happened.</em></p> </div>

 

[windnwar]

Though having the training and facilities split between the two makes it less likely to have both facilities taken out by a hurricane. So I can understand having a bit of redundancy between the two. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p><font size="2" color="#0000ff">""Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." --Albert Einstein"</font></p> </div>

 

[qso1]

Good point...and maybe that was factored into the planning. It could be one of the reasons JSC was justified beyond "Just cause LBJ wanted it". <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><strong>My borrowed quote for the time being:</strong></p><p><em>There are three kinds of people in life. Those who make it happen, those who watch it happen...and those who do not know what happened.</em></p> </div>

 

[ashish27]

this is a problem in every field. The only solution is to find a spouse who would stand by you all your life. Its better not to marry rather than marrying a demanding woman.

 

[jimfromnsf]

"The problem was that he lived in the Houston area, but the Apollo simulators were mostly in the Cape area. So he was away from home a lot. "<br /><br />Cernan's bio is not applicable to today. He was writing about what happened over 30 years ago.<br /><br />There were simulators in Houston and the Cape for Apollo. Now, the shuttle ones are only in houston. <br /><br />Many workers have to travel. there is nothing special that needs to be done for the astronauts. They are just like everyone else and don't require special treatment. They can go to consuling just like all the other workers. <br /><br /> "For the better part of a month, the crew has to practice actual launches in the actual vehicle on the actual pad"<br /><br />This is not applicable for the shuttle and subsequent vehicles. <br /><br />This is a non issue

 

[vogon13]

Peer pressure, shunning, financial disincentives, (re)criminalization of 'alienation of affection', reintroduce legislative restrictions on divorce, (re)educate Christians that all four of their sacred and innerent Gospels record Christ's prohibition against divorce and remarriage, allow individual states to not recognize out of state divorces, public education campaign to (re)acquaint the public with the long term and devestating damage divorce does to children, in other words, put things back to the way they were in the fifties and sixties.<br /><br /><br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#ff0000"><strong>TPTB went to Dallas and all I got was Plucked !!</strong></font></p><p><font color="#339966"><strong>So many people, so few recipes !!</strong></font></p><p><font color="#0000ff"><strong>Let's clean up this stinkhole !!</strong></font> </p> </div>

 

[windnwar]

Sounds like a terrific reason to stay single and never get married then. lol <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p><font size="2" color="#0000ff">""Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." --Albert Einstein"</font></p> </div>

 

[davf]

<font color="yellow"> Zeke Slayton...he was the one from Tennessee, right? </font><br /><br />LMAO! Damn, I just spewed water over my keyboard. That will teach me to be drinking while reading...

 

[dragon04]

Lesser known cuzint of Deke Slayton, famous asternot. <img src="/images/icons/wink.gif" /><br /><br /><font color="yellow">How do we prevent divorce in the Astronaut Corps?</font><br /><br />The short answer is we don't. Or more correctly put, can't. That's all about the underlying strength of the marriage between any two people.<br /><br />Cops, firefighters, doctors, over the road truck drivers, commercial sailors and fisherman, etc. ad infinitum are in the same situation as astronauts in terms of potential strains on marriages.<br /><br />Good marriage, no worries. Marginal or bad marriage, the party's over.<br /><br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <em>"2012.. Year of the Dragon!! Get on the Dragon Wagon!".</em> </div>

 

[bpfeifer]

NASA facilities and contracts were intentionally spread accross the country and to as many congressional districts as possible under Web's administration. This was part of his strategy to secure the financial backing of Congress. It was definitely a nod to political reality, rather than for any practical reasons.<br /><br />As for married astronauts... There was an extremely high divorce rate among the Apollo, Mercury, and Gemini astronauts. I haven't seen statistics, but I think the divorce rate is lower today.<br /><br />The only way to actually prevent it is to only hire unmarried men and women. That's what the Roman Legion did... <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Brian J. Pfeifer http://sabletower.wordpress.com<br /> The Dogsoldier Codex http://www.lulu.com/sabletower<br /> </div>

 

[willpittenger]

I won't just sit there and ignore the problem just because some normal people that happened to be married picked the wrong field. You are telling people that happen to be married to stay out of the corps and astronauts to avoid falling in love. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Will Pittenger<hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Add this user box to your Wikipedia User Page to show your support for the SDC forums: <div style="margin-left:1em">{{User:Will Pittenger/User Boxes/Space.com Account}}</div> </div>

 

[willpittenger]

We still have to do something. At least put their homes close to where they train. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Will Pittenger<hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Add this user box to your Wikipedia User Page to show your support for the SDC forums: <div style="margin-left:1em">{{User:Will Pittenger/User Boxes/Space.com Account}}</div> </div>

 

[jimfromnsf]

Read the posts<br /><br />There is nothing that needs to be done<br /><br />The book is about events that happened 30 years ago.<br /><br />The shuttle astronauts don't train at the cape anymore like they did for Apollo. They are only at the cape for a fews days during their training cycle. The bulk of training is in Houston where they live. <br /><br />The astronauts are pampered enough. They should be treated the same as other workers

 

[lampblack]

Yeah... they're grown-ups, and most of them are pretty good at anticipating and solving problems. <br /><br />In most cases, they've got the smarts and overall resources to avoid divorce court -- if avoiding divorce court is a priority. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <font color="#0000ff"><strong>Just tell the truth and let the chips fall...</strong></font> </div>

 

[qso1]

Will Pittenger :<br />We still have to do something. At least put their homes close to where they train.<br /><br />Me:<br />Why?<br /><br />The military would never make such accomodations for soldiers because they can't. If one chooses to become an astronaut, they know its going to be tough going and whoever they are seeing romantically should also know. When astronauts divorce, whos to say its solely because of the job? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><strong>My borrowed quote for the time being:</strong></p><p><em>There are three kinds of people in life. Those who make it happen, those who watch it happen...and those who do not know what happened.</em></p> </div>

 

[qso1]

shuttle_guy:<br />Isn't the divorce rate in america running about 50%? I do not think it was any higher for the early astronauts.<br /><br />Me:<br />The divorce stats I have seen for the last two decades is just what you mentioned...50% or thereabouts. I don't know what it was during the Mercury days. I do recall that divorce rates tend to be higher for those engaged in high stress career feilds. But theres nothing I can see that can be done about that because of the myriad reasons for divorce and inability to prove that high stress alone cause it. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><strong>My borrowed quote for the time being:</strong></p><p><em>There are three kinds of people in life. Those who make it happen, those who watch it happen...and those who do not know what happened.</em></p> </div>

 

[holmec]

Isn't the problem two fold?<br /><br />1. being away from home because of training.<br /><br />2. Spaceflight is dangerous business. Wives have a hard time with the dangers. <br /><br />All in all, being an astronaut partly means sacrificing time with family.<br /><br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p><font color="#0000ff"><em>"SCE to AUX" - John Aaron, curiosity pays off</em></font></p> </div>