my alcohol induced idea to get into space

[Gravity_Ray]

So while I was laying down and spinning from too many beers, I thought about this idea. Here it is for you all to chew on and be spit out. Let me know any thing that will make this not work.

This idea combines two ideas. Space elevator, Space Ship 2.

So the idea of a space elevator is the best idea I have ever heard that has not been tried, and Space Ship 2 although untested is working on a proven test bed. But the elevator has problems because of the way it will react with our atmosphere specifically the incredibly destructive oxygen molecules in the upper atmosphere.

So why not put a robot in orbit that will make the elevator cable with a counter weight to keep it in orbit. But we dont build the elevator all the way down, we terminate it just above the border of space (above the upper atmosphere). Build a male/female type connector at the end of it as a landing. Now launch a ship like Space Ship 2 that can just make it to the border of space (and so can come down without orbital speeds). Aim for the connector at the bottom of the elevator and plug into it at the hight of the ship's arc and click tight.


Now the astronauts can climb out of the ship, and take the elevator the rest of the way up to orbit, where it can be tied to a bigelow type station (counter weight). Then you can hop on space ships that never come down to Earth and go exploring the solar system using all the energy you get from the spinning space station. When done you come back to elevator station, take elevator down to the landing, hop back to your Space Ship 2 ship, and glide back down to Earth.

So what you all think? :ugeek:

 

[Jazman1985]

Well, it solves the ozone problem and the problem with drag in the lower atmosphere. The only thing I can anticipate that will hinder it is that the elevator will still be extremely difficult to make, albeit slightly easier now. I think the biggest problem would be reliably docking with the elevator. The spaceship could always be sky-hooked closer, but you would still need to get within a reasonable distance. (~1 mile? say) I think it needs further thought to figure out any flaws as well.

 

[kelvinzero]

I had a similar idea to this but using an orbital ring:

• You create a ring of satellites in orbit, each being a unit in a magnetic monorail.
• A suborbital craft flies up and magnetically latches on to this rail as it rushes past at several km/s.
• Then it can be accelerated up to orbital velocity (stationary wrt to the monorail)
• Then the passengers disembark at one of the various orbital stations/hotels before catching a moon shuttle
• The moon shuttle can be thrown from the orbital ring with up to double orbital velocity.
• To recover the rings momentum, returning craft and lunar exports are decelerated by the ring.
• This also makes reentry a breeze, since you decelerate the craft back to earth-stationary velocity before dropping it.

Advantages over an elevator:

• There is no need for miracle materials. there is very little stress applied to this system, only a small nudge distributed over each element.
• Elevators can be slow, meaning passengers can waste a lot of time soaking up radiation as they climb through the van allen belt. This method would be very fast.
• In the event of a catastrophe or terrorism, the whole thing does not fall down to earth. Only a few links would be taken out. Being in LEO, fragments would rapidly decay and fall to earth.
• The ring orbit could be chosen to be accessible from anywhere on the equator, any time of day, or over an even wider area twice every day.

This system would probably require even more mass than an elevator.. perhaps much more. However since it does not require carbon nanotube materials (which are not yet even proven) it can be produced from lunar materials, which contain very little carbon. This mass can be launched magnetically from the moon. Infact you could have a similar ring there, except it would not need to be in orbit but actually on the moon's equator.

Also this ring would be a huge tourist destination of its own. Once on the ring you can catch a monorail to any other part. It would collect vast amounts of space solar power that could be beamed down to earth, or even used for beamed power propulsion allowing aircraft that can stay aloft indefinitely and suborbital craft that do not require any dangerous fuels.

 

[aphh]

So while I was laying down and spinning from too many beers, I thought about this idea. Here it is for you all to chew on and be spit out. Let me know any thing that will make this not work.

This idea combines two ideas. Space elevator, Space Ship 2.

So the idea of a space elevator is the best idea I have ever heard that has not been tried, and Space Ship 2 although untested is working on a proven test bed. But the elevator has problems because of the way it will react with our atmosphere specifically the incredibly destructive oxygen molecules in the upper atmosphere.

So why not put a robot in orbit that will make the elevator cable with a counter weight to keep it in orbit. But we dont build the elevator all the way down, we terminate it just above the border of space (above the upper atmosphere). Build a male/female type connector at the end of it as a landing. Now launch a ship like Space Ship 2 that can just make it to the border of space (and so can come down without orbital speeds). Aim for the connector at the bottom of the elevator and plug into it at the hight of the ship's arc and click tight.


Now the astronauts can climb out of the ship, and take the elevator the rest of the way up to orbit, where it can be tied to a bigelow type station (counter weight). Then you can hop on space ships that never come down to Earth and go exploring the solar system using all the energy you get from the spinning space station. When done you come back to elevator station, take elevator down to the landing, hop back to your Space Ship 2 ship, and glide back down to Earth.

So what you all think? :ugeek:

SS2 type craft could not dock with it. If the satellite providing the space elevator or the ladder part is on geosynchronous orbit, the ladder stays on stationary point over earth. SS2 type vehicle can't do that.

However, enter Armadillo's climbing platform, that does only climb, and not much horizontal velocity, and you would have a craft that could climb up to the beginning of the ladder and dock with it. The satellite at the upper end of the ladder would need to have some sort of propulsion to counter the added weight of payload at the beginning of the ladder.

Otherwise the payload would drag the satellite and the ladder down.

I have been drinking, so none of what I wrote may hold tomorrow.

 

[neilsox]

Hi Ray: Similar ideas have been analyzed in detail, but none built. My guess is a high risk demonstration is possible by 2012 if someone with good judgement invests a few billion dollars. Making it safe and reliable may take lots longer and a trillion dollars. The most difficult part is matching the speed of the dangling ribbon and the ground to ribbon vehicle. Possibly the returning space craft has more difficulty matching the speed of the top end of the ribbon, especially if some of the space craft systems malfunction. Failure to reattach, on the first try may mean there is no way to return to Earth alive.
If the ribbon is about 60,000 miles long the average ground speed can be zero miles per hour, but varies wildly in both speed and direction. Better, perhaps, is about 50,000 miles long and an average ground speed of about 500 miles per hour. Possibly still better is a rotating sky hook (sometimes called a bolo) Optimum length may be about 20,000 miles, as this puts the top end lower than GEO stationary altitude, thus leaving hundreds of communications satellites safe from the flailing top end. If it flips end over end every 2.5 hours, and the path of the end is 62,800 miles in circumference. If it completes a rotation every 5 hours the average tip speed is 12,560 miles per hour, which is close to orbital speed for a ribbon 20,000 miles long, thus the tip speed in the stratosphere is approximately zero, making attachment easier and at lower altitude. The ground speed of the top end is about 25,000 miles per hour allowing the space craft to go to several of the planets and most of the asteroids with only minor course correction.
It may be best to have a short burn rocket motor at each tip, to assist in making the attachment, to reduce the jerk that occurs shortly after attachment and to restore the rotational speed to optimum after each launch.
In a semi polar orbit, launch opportunities occur about every 2.5 hours, occasionally over nearly every country of the world. Some of the attachments will need to deliver tip motor fuel, and an Edwards type climber should move on the ribbon to repair damage by space junk, micro meteorites and atomic oxygen. More details are at http://www.liftport.com Click on forum 4 lines from the bottom of the main page. Neil