Planets orbital inclination to ecliptic?

[solva11]

Does a planets orbital inclination to the ecliptic explain why Jupiter is currently (edit: last summer) low on the horizon, yet Mars is almost overhead?<br />I'm at 48 degrees N latitude.<br />Thanks!

 

[MeteorWayne]

Actually it's due to our rotation's inclination to the ecliptic.<br />All the planets except for Mercury are within 3 degrees of a flat plane, but our rotation axis is inclined 23 1/2 degrees to the ecliptic. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080"><em><font color="#000000">But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id.</font></em> </font></p><p><font color="#000080">I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function</font><font color="#000080"> </font></p> </div>

 

[CalliArcale]

It's also a matter of where they are in their orbits in relation to us -- and what time it is, since Mars isn't always close to the horizon and Jupiter isn't always high in the sky. <img src="/images/icons/wink.gif" /> And actually, if you see Jupiter high in the sky right now, you're not seeing Jupiter at all. More on that later....<br /><br />There's a nice free utility called Solar System Live that lets you see the relative positions of the planets from "above" the north pole of the Sun. This link will show you the entire solar system, at the current time. You can play around with the settings to see different dates. Mars is the red one with a male symbol (and white icecaps), and Jupiter is the brown one with a sort of floppy number 4. Earth is the blue one with a circle divided into four quarters on it. Earth is currently hard to see on this chart; it's kind of underneath Mars' symbol. But you should be able to see that Mars and Jupiter are on opposite sides of the solar system right now. That means that they'll be on opposite points along the ecliptic.<br /><br />The ecliptic has two meanings, although both are really the same thing seen from different perspectives. If you're looking at a model of the solar system, the ecliptic is the plane of the Earth's orbit. If you're looking at a starmap, it's the line that the Sun seems to follow in the sky over the course of a year. This is also where the 12 zodiac constellations are; the ancients ascribed meaning to these formations of stars because the Sun seemed to pass through them -- and so do the planets, since they follow roughly the same path.<br /><br />Mars, Jupiter, and all the other planets stay very close to the ecliptic. This chart, from NinePlanets.org, gives the orbital inclinations; bigger nu <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p><font color="#666699"><em>"People assume that time is a strict progression of cause to effect, but actually from a non-linear, non-subjective viewpoint it's more like a big ball of wibbly wobbly . . . timey wimey . . . stuff."</em>  -- The Tenth Doctor, "Blink"</font></p> </div>

 

[MeteorWayne]

At 48 degrees North, Mars reaches it's highest elevation (68 degrees) just before 1:30 AM local time.<br />Even though that's 22 degrees away from the zenith, it appears very close to overhead.<br />In fact, most observers would call it overhead. It takes a lot of practice to accurately estimate altitude! <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080"><em><font color="#000000">But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id.</font></em> </font></p><p><font color="#000080">I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function</font><font color="#000080"> </font></p> </div>

 

[solva11]

Thanks everyone for your informative posts. Still studying your replies!<br /> Although after looking a little closer at my 50 degree North planisphere, I see that the ecliptic is quite low in the sky around summertime (when I observered Jupiter), and significantly higher in the sky around winter (as it is now when Mars is "overhead"......good point MeteorWayne!). I was under the false impression that the ecliptic was relatively stationary off the horizon throughout the seasons. My mistake! This is what had me looking for an explanation.<br /><br />Just a wild guess... but is the ecliptic more stationary above the horizon throughout the seasons at the Equator? (more exaggerated effect nearer the poles?).

 

[qso1]

If you have astronomy software that can plaback as an animation, like Starry Night. What you can see and understand by speeding up the motion of the stars will be quite impressive. I think you can gain a much better understanding much faster by doing this.<br /><br />There is also a freeware program (I think it still is) called Celestia. I'm not sure if it can be animated, but if it can...the results will be the same. This really worked for me and I have had a basic understanding of the way the planets move, the plane of the ecliptic etc for a long time. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><strong>My borrowed quote for the time being:</strong></p><p><em>There are three kinds of people in life. Those who make it happen, those who watch it happen...and those who do not know what happened.</em></p> </div>

 

[alokmohan]

What about the Juipter mystery as Cali states.It mars?

 

[qso1]

Watching any of the planets and looking from several different perspectives, say earths surface...the moon...mars. The more perspectives the better ones understanding of how it all works becomes. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><strong>My borrowed quote for the time being:</strong></p><p><em>There are three kinds of people in life. Those who make it happen, those who watch it happen...and those who do not know what happened.</em></p> </div>

 

[garfieldthecat]

<font color="yellow">"I see that the ecliptic is quite low in the sky around summertime (when I observered Jupiter), and significantly higher in the sky around winter (as it is now when Mars is "overhead"" </font><br /><br />Well, this works on night time, but on day time it's the exact contrary <img src="/images/icons/smile.gif" /> (due to daily rotation around the axis).<br /><br /><font color="yellow">"Just a wild guess... but is the ecliptic more stationary above the horizon throughout the seasons at the Equator? (more exaggerated effect nearer the poles?). " </font><br /><br />Variation of the position of the ecliptic in the sky is simply due to the inclination of the rotation axis of the Earth, which is around 23 degrees. So the variation of the ecliptic apparent position is the same for all part of the planet, around 45 degrees of difference between the highest point and the lowest point. The difference is, at the equator, the ecliptic is pretty high in the sky since the equator never makes an angle bigger than 23 degrees compared to the ecliptic. And actually, the ecliptic is at the Zenith twice in the year around the equator: at the spring and autumn equinoxes.<br /><br />It’s quite hard to explain clearly by words, but you can find nice schemes here:<br />http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equinox<br />