Russian space travel

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ezekialsufo

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Hey all Newbie here :D ,

I was wondering where the US and Russia are on levels of advancement. As of right now I know that the US landed on the moon, then Russia, then China. I don't know who got their space stations going first (just found out Russia had one about a week ago watching Armageddon...lulz). And, we have rovers on Mars, does Russia? How far off is China (they're third right?)?

I am not saying one is better than the other. I just wish I knew the time line of events and when they have worked together in the past.

Very thankful,

Ezekial
 
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neilsox

Guest
The Nazis = Germany was first with intermediate range missiles = the V2. The USSR (now Russia) and USA got most of the missiles and scientists in 1945. The USSR was first to launch a tiny satellite = Sputnik. USA matched or better a few months later. The satellite race has been pretty even, with the USA taking the lead the last 18 years or so. USA is the only country to do a manned landing on the Moon. The USA was first with a space station, a few months after the last manned mission to the Moon The Mir space station USSR was next, and considerably bigger and better, but ten? years latter. The USSR had one person in the Mir space station for more than one year. Longest in space. Other countries space programs were far behind, but Euro = Europe may soon grab second place. China is far behind, but may grab third place soon. Russia will likely fall to 4 th place soon. Nearly all countries with a space program helped build the International Space Station = ISS, but the USA provided more than half the money and perhaps more than half of the technology. USA built the Hubble space telescope, perhaps the most recent major achievement in space. Did I miss anything extremely important? Neil
 
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Gravity_Ray

Guest
You’re not correct in some of your facts neilsox.

USSR – first satellite, first man in space, first woman in space, first dog in space, first non-man lunar landing (both hard landing, and soft landing), first Mars non-man landing, first space station (Salyut 1), first Moon rover, longest stay in space

USA – second satellite, second man in space, second woman in space (actually second woman in space is also Russian, but I am talking about second country to launch a woman in space), second non-man lunar landing, first chimp in space, first man on the Moon, second space station, second Mars non-man landing, first Mars rover

U.K. - third satellite
Canada - fourth satellite
both in 1962

China – third man in space

up comming events: China - third space station
 
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ezekialsufo

Guest
That's great guys I really appreciate those time lines. I am really excited to see China put up a space station. You guys were talking about people moving around in leadership, are we going to move back? I have heard a little bit about us losing leadership from what Obama did on cutting the budget.
 
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scottb50

Guest
ezekialsufo":eq1gzp24 said:
That's great guys I really appreciate those time lines. I am really excited to see China put up a space station. You guys were talking about people moving around in leadership, are we going to move back? I have heard a little bit about us losing leadership from what Obama did on cutting the budget.
I don't see very much progress recently. China might be repeating what the Russians and the U.S. have done but haven't really accomplished very much. The U.S. and Russia have been doing the same things for the last 20+ years, getting to the ISS and back.

The ISS could open the possibility of private enterprise, but so far not a lot has been proposed. Bigalow has proven their product but there are no takers. On the other side launches of communication and Earth observation satellites have book a lot of launches, so maybe this is where we should be looking. The ISS proves it can be done so why not replace the geostationary, overly complex, communications satellites with a lower orbit, quicker data transfer, manned constellation similar to GPS. Multiple stations with replaceable and upgradable transponders that are manned or man visited when needed.

An I-POD or I-PAD that could access virtually anything, at any time, from anywhere. It has to be cheaper then building cellullar towers every five mile or so.
 
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Gravity_Ray

Guest
ezekialsufo":jkvsquqd said:
That's great guys I really appreciate those time lines. I am really excited to see China put up a space station. You guys were talking about people moving around in leadership, are we going to move back? I have heard a little bit about us losing leadership from what Obama did on cutting the budget.
I don’t really like China in space, as their program is purely military. However, they are very good capitalists so its not a stretch that once they get a station and a consistent way up there, its going to open up more flights for a lot of the countries that are not in the orbit of the west.

Obama actually increased the budget for NASA (not cut it), but he did cut Constellation which caused much hullabaloo on these boards and not because of what people say (we are losing our lead in space), but mainly because many people are going to lose their high paying cushy jobs. God forbid they have to go out there like the rest of us and look for real jobs. If any space program needed cutting it was the constellation program (the biggest boondoggle in the history of space programs).

But Obama is not a great space president; it’s just not high on his radar. He really wanted to do the healthcare thing which in my opinion really should not have been rated that high up in priority, and now he has to deal with finance reform and hopefully at some point get the economy going again. No I don’t see this guy getting us any place in space. Hey at least he was honest about it from the get go.

The best thing that could have happened though (IMO) is getting NASA to get in the habit of purchasing directly from private companies (as opposed to cost plus deals with inside vendors). In the past 40 years I have seen nothing from any public space flight that made me feel a country cares about a space program for humanity. So now I’m betting on the private industry horse, I figure I have another 30 years or so left in me, so at least I’ll see if there is any hope at all, or if we as a species are doomed to a terrestrial life (at least for the foreseeable future).
 
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JonClarke

Guest
Gravity_Ray":3gl4q0gs said:
I don’t really like China in space, as their program is purely military. However, they are very good capitalists so its not a stretch that once they get a station and a consistent way up there, its going to open up more flights for a lot of the countries that are not in the orbit of the west.
China's space program has both military and civil components. So there is no need to object to it in general. While I don't like military space actiuvities, the Chinese have as miuch right to do it as anyone else, including the US.
 
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ezekialsufo

Guest
I was actually really surprised and excited when Obama said we're going to Mars in his lifetime. For me that means we'll be advancing quite a bit. Tourism costs may go down enough to where I could purchase a ticket. Obama has said a lot of stuff and done a lot of stuff differently so I'm cautious to believe him. What're the chances of us getting to Mars in his lifetime?
 
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MeteorWayne

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Since this topic is not about a specific Mission or Launch, on it's way to SB&T...

Wayne
 
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access

Guest
"USSR – first satellite, first man in space, first woman in space, first dog in space, first non-man lunar landing (both hard landing, and soft landing), first Mars non-man landing, first space station (Salyut 1), first Moon rover, longest stay in space"-Gravity Ray

I have to point out that longest stay in space was recently taken by Robert Thirsk a Canadian on the ISS so i don't know who gets credit for that but its not the USSR
 
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sftommy

Guest
thoughts on some postings here;

China's space program probably offers the best affordability; if Walmart went to Shanghai with NASA specs and shopped around, we'd have many of the launch craft we envision built faster and cheaper. However, we would loose control of the technology and unenvisioned shortcuts are possible if not probable.

Obama's budget may have done more for NASA than we initially thought. Lori Garver, as the visionary, put a realistic budget in place, the shock of it is forcing the fiscal-conservatives who want big American rockets to cough up the extra money to do what they say they want, shoot big rockets!

Every member of the Senate committee supposedly knows that top secret reason the defense department must have a new heavy lift engine-probably because the Atlas V uses a Russian engine and if relations soured...
(DoD need for a heavy lift suggests DoD believes the militarization of space is necessary for this countries security?)

One other superlative for your list; Farthest man made thing from earth was built and sent by whom?
 
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JonClarke

Guest
access":27b0gjik said:
I have to point out that longest stay in space was recently taken by Robert Thirsk a Canadian on the ISS so i don't know who gets credit for that but its not the USSR
Sorry, Robert Thirsk does not come any where near the longest stay. the top 12 longest stays in space are all by cosmonauts, as are at least the top 10 cumulative space flights.
 
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EarthlingX

Guest
A very nice site about Russian space, with tons of images, history, details, probably closest to the original post :

http://www.russianspaceweb.com/

I will just drop here a couple of videos, i hope they are related, from http://www.youtube.com/user/tvroscosmos :

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6AdOV5DWxHM[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-UwBu-sexA4[/youtube]

Some more links :
http://www.roscosmos.ru : Russian Federal Space Agency - Roscosmos

http://www.energia.ru : S.P. KOROLEV ROCKET AND SPACE CORPORATION «ENERGIA»

http://www.khrunichev.ru : Khrunichev State Research and Production Space Center

Aerospace companies of the Soviet Union

Search for 'Aerospace Russia companies' on Wiki gives 885 results.

I dare you to try doing the same on Google ..

Oh, and 55 years of Baikonur :

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k0Tg8oZ-63o[/youtube]
 
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RVHM

Guest
ezekialsufo":z0bq79ww said:
I was actually really surprised and excited when Obama said we're going to Mars in his lifetime. For me that means we'll be advancing quite a bit. Tourism costs may go down enough to where I could purchase a ticket. Obama has said a lot of stuff and done a lot of stuff differently so I'm cautious to believe him. What're the chances of us getting to Mars in his lifetime?
How can you believe him when he's throwing away many technologies (SRBs, SSMEs, etc.) which would play an essential role in any Mars mission (not for the journey itself, but for lifting the necessary components and the crew into LEO).
 
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SteveCNC

Guest
Another first for USSR as I recall they did some experiments with sex in space back in the 70's if I remember right .
 
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Gravity_Ray

Guest
SteveCNC":f0d4zxis said:
Another first for USSR as I recall they did some experiments with sex in space back in the 70's if I remember right .
I've also read about this from time to time but there is no proof what so ever. Oh wait there was STS-XXX. No just kidding. Those Russians are pretty... ahem open minded and there were plenty of mixed crews on Mir, but I doubt if it was approved activity! Maybe private activity, but certainly not sanctioned experiments.

If you have a link to some thing please post it. Please no Porn sites though! :lol:
 
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RVHM

Guest
SteveCNC":1s1mdiw5 said:
Another first for USSR as I recall they did some experiments with sex in space back in the 70's if I remember right .
I thought it was later.
 
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EarthlingX

Guest
Some more Russian space travel related links and such :

en.rian.ru : http://en.rian.ru/trend/Russian_Space_Programs/

Russia to test launch new spacecraft from Baikonur in 2015


Baikonur Cosmodrome in Kazakhstan

17:27 03/06/2010
© RIA Novosti. Oleg Urusov

Russia will test launch a new spacecraft from Baikonur Cosmodrome in Kazakhstan in 2015, the head of the manned space program at Russia's Federal Space Agency Roscosmos said on Thursday.
About the new cosmodrome in the Amur region :

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vostochny_Cosmodrome

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y_UydCOI0TY[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_kzvPoFkiTI[/youtube]

and

www.federalspace.ru : About Russian Advanced Space Transportation System
:: 12.06.2010

In view of mass media keen interest in the project of a new-generation manned transport space vehicle and appearance of the publications based on conjectures of the authors who proceed from modification of baseline space vehicle proposed by S.P. Korolev Rocket-Space Corporation Energia in its earlier development phase, we wish to explain the following:

Building a new-generation manned space vehicle is carried out in the interests of implementing the policy of space research and development throughout the period up to 2040, which was formulated even at the Air-Space Show MAKS-2009. This policy, involves a build-up of activities in near-earth space, including those based upon manned orbital stations, as well as deployment of interplanetary space infrastructure for flying to the Moon and Solar system planets. The above mentioned infrastructure incorporates an advanced manned transportation system with a new-generation manned transport vehicle; transport module-orbit transfer vehicle with nuclear electrical jet propulsion plant of Megawatt class; interplanetary manned complex; unmanned space and planetary spacecraft and many other things. It is precisely this analysis of problems to be considered and technical and economic aspects of their solving that define the rationale for building a generic space vehicle designed for near-earth and far-out space flights, as distinguished from the projects under which a lot of studies has been performed in Russia since the 1990's.

Preliminary design and an analysis of efficiency in space vehicle use led the specialists of the Corporation and allied enterprises of the Russian aviation-space complex to expediency in using parachute-jet landing of its return vehicle (RV). However, as differentiated from Soyuz TMA space vehicle, it is proposed to use multi- canapy parachute system, solid-propellant jet engines along with extension shock-absorber struts-supports for decrement of vertical and horizontal components of landing velocity. Efficient, disposable, quick-detachable thermal protection for RV is developed; RV configuration is specified; new technical solutions for space vehicle structure are proposed using advanced technologies, equipment and materials, which can find broad use in space and aviation industries in developing modern technology, as well as in other industries.

In accordance with Customer's (Roscosmos) task, Preliminary Design included development of technical documentation, as well as a package of ground experimental and research activities (including those on flight thermodynamics in RV reentry phase of flight); manufacture of models and mockups, process prototypes of separate structural members (models for wind-tunnel testing; load-bearing framework of propulsion compartment body; equipment; high-pressure bottles; control jet engines; jet propulsion system for "soft" landing; avionics, etc.).

Thus, in the Preliminary Design stage, a new vehicle configuration was defined more exactly with its logistic, manufacturing-process and experimental substantiation, which was demonstrated at the exposition held in the hall of the Corporation Scientific-Technical Board on May 27, 2010 during review of the Preliminary Design results. The exposition aroused great interest among space industry specialists and Customer's representatives. The exposition confirmed that most of the technical and technological solutions providing background for the Project are feasible.

RSC-Energia PAO
 
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EarthlingX

Guest
http://www.russia-ic.com : Projects of Russian Space Shuttles Analyzed
17.06.2010



Russian engineers from Central Aero-Hydrodynamic Institute reviewed several projects of shuttle rocket and space systems, designed for RosCosmos.

“Shuttle rocket and space system-1” (SRSS-1) is a semireusable vertically fired carrier rocket based upon reusable aircraft-shaped winged primary stage, as well as upon expendable second stages and transfer orbit stages. Reusable winged primary stage moves by means of reusable liquid-fuel cruise engines.

Engineers from Central Aero-Hydrodynamic Institute based their evaluation on following parameters: efficient reusability of the primary stage, types of demonstrators of recovery stages, and realization necessity.

Reusable primary stage of SRSS-1 provides high level of safety and reliability and eliminates the need of jettison impact areas , which makes the project suitable for advanced commercial launches. These features are very important for Russia, the only country in the world, which launching sites are located on the continent. Experts recommend the project of Khrunichev design bureau – a family of reusable space rockets, working like modules and delivering a variety of useful things to low orbit.
 
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EarthlingX

Guest
www.federalspace.ru : Angara URM-2 Tests Continue at NITS RKP
:: 19.06.2010

A new Angara rocket is being developed in Russia. The Angara project has the highest priority of the state level. The bench tests of Universal Rocket Module URM-2 of the Angara launcher are an inevitable stage of the project. They are hosted by NITS RKP, Peresvet, at test bench 102(TB-102), the largest test bench in Europe.
Angara’s URM-1 bench tests were completed in 2009.
Pre-processed module URM-2 underwent “cold” bench testing after URM-1. The tests carried out on June 17 were aimed at validating pneumatic hydro system. Integrated operations of the system were verified with O-tank filling with liquid oxygen, three short draining operations, and one complete drain of the O-tank. URM-2 thermal control and fire extinguish systems were checked with the module filled/non-filled with cryogenic propellant. In addition, proper functioning of the system was verified.

Cold testing of URM-2 with kerosene filling, as well as totally-filled system tests, will be conducted after analysis of the first verification stage.
URM-2 firing test is planned in autumn of 2010.
Russian Ministry of Defense and Russian Federal Space Agency are the state customers in the Angara contract. Khrunichev Space Center is the prime contractor responsible for development of the Angara universal launch system, including Angara design, manufacturing and tests.

Khrunichev Space Center and NITS RKP PAO
 
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EarthlingX

Guest
Anatoly Perminov about future launchers, Mars, nuclear engines, .. :
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DHysjIQL2fg[/youtube]

This one might be worth a transcript, it's just that my Russian is not that good.

If i understand correctly, he is saying that spaceship with nuclear engines can get to Mars in 1 month, and could launch in 10 years, among other.


Refresher :

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-5DQZOB6JSY[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1yZlbYQXg0k[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nUeQxqM6jT8[/youtube]
 
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orionrider

Guest
Ezekial,

There is a lot of national pride here about NASA and the US space program. Since I roam the forums I noticed that many Americans still think of space like in the old days of the cold war propaganda.

Today's world is very different. While the US is still a major space player, you cannot say it is the first or the second because most projects these days are international. Did you know that american rockets use Russian engines? That every computer display flying in space is made in Europe? The knowledge, skills and experience are spread among many nations.

Russia is the leader for propulsion systems and man-rated rockets and vehicles. The designs dating back to the USSR days are reliable, sturdy and safe. It is also the nation having achieved the most historical milestones in space exploration. But Russia as a country lacks the economical potential to keep the pace in space exploration. With a meager budget of $2.5B, Russia is still capable of amazing feats, but its space program could not stay afloat without external help.

Europe has a huge knowledge base and is potentially the largest 'space power' of the future, but it has not yet achieved much, compared to Russia and the US. However, European companies are unavoidable in any space endeavor today. As a political entity, Europe lacks the boldness ('boots and flags') of other countries. Its space program is very scientific in nature, closely integrated with the science and development effort of the EU. As a result, the relatively modest budget of about $5B is very rationally invested.

The USA is the biggest spender, with a budget of $18B, not counting the US military space budget. However, lobbying, bureaucracy and a failing national economy have greatly hampered the effectiveness of the US space investments. The nationalistic goals of manned space exploration conflict with the scientific mission of NASA, political decisions wasting huge resources in dead-ends and cancelled programs. The US space program is in the process of being reformed on a competitive base, leaving sterile US-only policy in favor of more international cooperation. If this effort succeeds the US will become the lead catalyst of space exploration inside the international community, with enormous gains for all.


Japan has proven itself an ambitious space power. At $2.5B, the budget of JAXA is producing effective results with recent successes in missions on pair with the best international efforts.

India has announced very ambitious plans, leaping in all directions at once: 'boots and flags', science, commercial and military. However, the ISRO has not yet delivered much, so it remains to see what will become of its $1.2B budget.

Israel, Korea, Brazil, Iran,...
Israel and others smaller actors on the space stage are in the process of developing mainly military or commercial applications.

China is the biggest question mark of all space powers. The Chinese follow a private agenda seemingly based on national pride and the military rather than Science or even business. However, not much is known of the evolution of the Chinese space program, only bold declarations that have repeatedly failed to deliver. Nothing is known of the space budget and the Chinese hide the true extent of their efforts as a military secret.

Private businesses like Bigelow, Virgin galactic, SpaceX and others could become the next big thing in space, mainly in making space more affordable. Other private initiatives, like AdAstra's VASIMR engine, could really make a difference in how space exploration evolves.
 
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PiotrSatan

Guest
Don't forget that the very proper first design was also from Nazi Germany. A-12. The rocket that was supposed to go in the space and drop itself in later stages, something like we have today. It was pretty good design, pretty old but i would say it's still comparable to what we have now. I wonder how would Nazi Germany progress with the space today, if they had won the world wars they would begin.
 
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EarthlingX

Guest
About sci-fi alternatives :

http://www.wired.com : Space Nazi Trailers Draw Crowd Funding for Iron Sky
June 29, 2010, 8:00 am

By Hugh Hart Email Author

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DeAfoiN5SDw[/youtube]

Thanks to a pair of knockout fake trailers, a team of Finnish filmmakers will soon start shooting an outlandish sci-fi Nazi movie financed in part by fans who flipped over the clips.

The first teaser for Iron Sky, embedded below, has pulled more than 1.3 million YouTube views since its release two years ago. The follow-up clip (above), released last month, continued the momentum as the project’s website harvested micro-investments from 52 fans enticed by the spooky-sleek visuals.
a commercial, well, sort of :
http://www.federalspace.ru : Russia the Space Power (Video)
:: 05.07.2010
( video on YouTube might not be the best, just a full-screen alternative )
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WL4L-EADjwY[/youtube]

Translated by Roscosmos TV. Roscosmos PAO does not bear responsibility for translation of the video.
and some news :

http://www.federalspace.ru : Tests of Angara URM 2 Common Core Booster Going On at Space-Industry Research-and-Test Center
:: 05.07.2010

Over several recent years, Russia has been creating a new launch vehicle named ‘Angara’. Bench testing is a mandatory phase of this project. Within the framework of the Angara development efforts, bench tests are carried out at the IS 102 test rig. This largest European test facility is run by the Space-Industry Research-and-Test Center (NITs RKP), a Federal Governmental Enterprise (Peresvet, Moscow Region).

The URM 1 common core booster, a module of the Angara launch vehicle, passed successfully the complete sequence of bench tests at IS 102 in 2009.

Following certain preparatory work, ‘cold’ bench tests of the URM 2 common core booster were launched at the same test facility. The first set of tests was carried out successfully on 17 June 2010.
...

Ground fire tests of URM 2 are scheduled for the third quarter of 2010.


Khrunichev Space Center PAO

http://www.federalspace.ru : International Students` Science School Opened in Roscosmos
:: 05.07.2010

International Students` Science School "Space Exploration: Theory and Practice" opened in Russian Federal Space Agency today. Bauman State Technical University International Space Center arranges such forums annually, under Roscosmos` patronage.
Anatoly Perminov, Roscosmos Head, addressed the attendees of the 14th International Students` Science School. He told students from Russia, UK, Belgium, Switzerland, etc. about operations of the Russian space centers, answered the questions of the future scientists, and expressed his attitude towards different aspects regarding evolution of the Russian space industry and its integration into international space business.
This year the students will run the project called ’Space Station with Artificial Gravity’, study space vehicles at Roscosmos companies, meet scientists, designers, cosmonauts.

 
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