Stiffness of spacesuits

[willpittenger]

I read Cernan's book. He wrote how his Gemini suit was extremely stiff and part of why his spacewalk on that flight failed. Also, he wrote how on Apollo 17, he had problems closing his hand while in a suit and was extremely sore when he left the moon.<br /><br />Do today's spacesuits have the same problems? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Will Pittenger<hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Add this user box to your Wikipedia User Page to show your support for the SDC forums: <div style="margin-left:1em">{{User:Will Pittenger/User Boxes/Space.com Account}}</div> </div>

 

[JonClarke]

Yes! <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><em>Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars</em>  Arthur Clarke</p> </div>

 

[docm]

That said work continues on a flexible 'Bio-Suit' at MIT ;<br /><br />History: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_activity_suit<br /><br />Today: http://mvl.mit.edu/EVA/index.html<br /><br />PhysOrg article: http://www.physorg.com/news10683.html <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[baktothemoon]

I'm looking forward to when we have the Bio-Suit. Finally have a good spacesuit.

 

[vulture2]

Unfortunately it is difficult to produce suit joints that will remain exactly the same volume as they bend. As a result internal pressure tends to force the suit into a particular position where the volume is greatest, and one must work against this pressure to bend the joints. Also, touch perception is limited because of the thickness of the fabric and the stiffness due to internal pressure. Nevertheless astronauts do frequently work for hours inthe suits.

 

[baktothemoon]

I'm suprised nobody ever tried to make a partly mechanically articulated suit to aid in movement.

 

[steve82]

I heard one of the things they learned early on in the Neutral Bouyancy Lab is the importance of not working against the suit.

 

[willpittenger]

BioSuit certianly would avoid complaints from female astronauts that the suit makes them look fat. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Will Pittenger<hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Add this user box to your Wikipedia User Page to show your support for the SDC forums: <div style="margin-left:1em">{{User:Will Pittenger/User Boxes/Space.com Account}}</div> </div>

 

[fingle]

Re: Unfortunately it is difficult to produce suit joints that will remain exactly the same volume as they bend.<br /><br />Maybe something like the Newtsuit or one of the other atmospheric diving suits.<br /><br />these suits use special mechanical joints that aid in ease of movement. I guess that the seals would have to be reversed or something to make them airthight from the pressure being inside the suit instead of outside. Also at 732 pounds is the suit way more heavy than current space suit design ?<br /><br />Well maybe the joint system could be adapted for space suits.<br /><br /><img src="/images/icons/smile.gif" /><br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[tomnackid]

NASA has an advanced spacesuit program that is looking into adapting the technology of atmospheric diving suits. Unfortunately although these suits are highly flexible and can take relatively high internal pressure (reducing or eliminating the need for pre-breathing before an EVA) they are heavy and bulky (a suit takes up the volume of a person) and have not been suitable (no pun intneded!) for any current missions. I imagine we will see suits like these if we build a permanent lunar outpost and need something that is extremely durable and low maintenance--or at least can easily be maintained on site.

 

[Testing]

Don't forget they also have the insulation stiffness. Materials are much better now but they still have some pretty wild temperatures to deal with. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[nyarlathotep]

<font color="yellow">I'm suprised nobody ever tried to make a partly mechanically articulated suit to aid in movement.</font><br /><br />Well, if you're making a partly mechanically articulated suit what's stopping you from making a _fully_ mechanically articulated suit and operating it from inside the station over a radio link? Actually, forget the suit.

 

[j05h]

Phil Nuytten - designer of the NewtSuit - helped develop the Ames' AX-5 hard spacesuit:<br />http://ails.arc.nasa.gov/Images/Space/jpegs/AC85-0468-154_a.jpeg<br />http://ails.arc.nasa.gov/Images/Space/<br /><br />He has designed a "swimmable" hardsuit for underwater use that is supposedly being repurposed for spaceflight. The Da Vinci Project (or Canadian Arrow?) was planning on using a variant of his hardware for their astronauts. He has repeatedly said that he will build spacesuits for anyone using rotary-joint technology. Hardsuits have all sorts of advantages, including the internal pressure, packability, modular sizing and maintainability. THe Newtsuit packs into a couple of large transport cases, it isn't transported as a whole unit but packed neatly away. The Newtsuit site shows (used to show?) one of the suits in it's case. Even assembled, a Newt-spacesuit would be only as bulky as a regular spacesuit, if somewhat heavier. The "swimmable" hardsuit would actually weigh less as a spacesuit than an Orlan or EMU.<br /><br />Hardsuits have a lot of potential. <br /><br />Josh <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <div align="center"><em>We need a first generation of pioneers.</em><br /></div> </div>

 

[willpittenger]

Simple. Scientests like to have their real hands on what they are doing.<br /><br />As for the "articulated" part, I suspect he is talking about hard shell suits. Those have joints like the arms in a Newt Suit. Some are actually hybrids: Part Hard and part soft. Most have interchangable parts so the suit does not have to be fit to the astronaut. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Will Pittenger<hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Add this user box to your Wikipedia User Page to show your support for the SDC forums: <div style="margin-left:1em">{{User:Will Pittenger/User Boxes/Space.com Account}}</div> </div>

 

[willpittenger]

<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p>Also, touch perception is limited because of the thickness of the fabric and the stiffness due to internal pressure.<p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br />I should note that it is tough to feel through ANY glove. It does not matter if we are talking about space suite gloves, winter gloves, surgical gloves, or any other type. Human fingers just need to be in direct contact with the object being felt. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Will Pittenger<hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Add this user box to your Wikipedia User Page to show your support for the SDC forums: <div style="margin-left:1em">{{User:Will Pittenger/User Boxes/Space.com Account}}</div> </div>

 

[baktothemoon]

This is my kind of spacesuit.

 

[willpittenger]

If we need a comedian, I will be sure to tell you. To be honest, I have no love for comedy at all. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Will Pittenger<hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Add this user box to your Wikipedia User Page to show your support for the SDC forums: <div style="margin-left:1em">{{User:Will Pittenger/User Boxes/Space.com Account}}</div> </div>

 

[baktothemoon]

Well, sorry. If you want me to delete it that's fine. Geezz.

 

[lampblack]

<font color="yellow">Well, sorry. If you want me to delete it that's fine. Geezz.</font><br /><br />Don't you dare delete it. That's an undeniably cool image -- although the silly thing looks like it would weigh a thousand pounds or so.<br /><br />Some folks just need to grow themselves a sense of humor. <img src="/images/icons/wink.gif" /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <font color="#0000ff"><strong>Just tell the truth and let the chips fall...</strong></font> </div>

 

[baktothemoon]

It does, in the Halo games and books you learn that the Master Chief weighs over a thousand pounds in that armor. But the armor works with his augmentations so that he has super strength and agility. However, only he can use it. If an ordinary soldier used it they wouldn't be able to control it.

 

[baktothemoon]

BTW, if you like that image, then watch this vid.<br /><br />http://www.unlimitedgamer.net/halo3/trailer-e3-06.php

 

[shoogerbrugge]

Getting back to reality, the economist had an article about the stifness on spacesuites which actually said the stiffness was better. Let me look it up, here

 

[vulture2]

Good link, however the stiffness is only useful if running because it allows elastic bounces like a kangaroo. I would guess most work on the moon will involve slowly moving around in one place or bending, and vehicles will be used for long distance travel. Also, in weightlessness one cannot "run" and the stiffness is not helpful.