# Sun with a "cold" core..?

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#### plancton

##### Guest
Hey guys...!<br />I have searched the forum and cannot find reference to this anywhere and so I decided to post it. Please forgive me if it has already been thrashed out.<br />I read an article on the Sun possibly having a cold core and I'm curious to know what the pro's think. Here's the article... http://www.alternativescience.com/is_the_sun_hot.htm

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#### origin

##### Guest
I'm not a pro. but it looks like a steam pile to me.<br /><br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

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#### billslugg

##### Guest
Hello and welcome Plancton<br /><br />A) Thermodynamics prohibits any closed surface at temperature X to contain any temperature <X. This assumes equilibrium and assumes the absence of a refigeration system. <br /><br />B) Centripetal force is directly proportional to rpm. Ranque-Hilsch tubes typically run at 1,000,000 rpm and produce 100 degrees C delta. The Sun is at .00005 rpm and needs to shed 30 million degrees C. As a refrigeration mechanism, this effect is 10^16 times too small to do the job. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p> </p> </div>

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#### alokmohan

##### Guest
Sun has no cool core.Sorry you are wrong.

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#### usn_skwerl

##### Guest
I believe you are wrong....All my life, in science class, I've always been told the sun has a core, photosphere, corona, etc.<br /><br /><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p>Conditions at the Sun's core (approximately the inner 25% of its radius) are extreme. The temperature is 15.6 million Kelvin and the pressure is 250 billion atmospheres. At the center of the core the Sun's density is more than 150 times that of water. <p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br />source: http://www.nineplanets.org/sol.html<br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

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#### emperor_of_localgroup

##### Guest
Yes, the article he quoted in the link was not published in a top scientific journal. So, I dont know how much of this to take seriously. But the link took a stab at the formation of the sun which is interesting and scientifically credible.<br /><br />If gravity pulls in gas molecules to form a sun, eventually temperature of the gas will rise and that will cause the gases to expand. This will limit the size of a star.<br /><br />Then the question is what is the gravity/heat balance on gas molecules? Or under what conditions effects of heated gas would not be a factor in formation of a star?<br /><br />I have no time to do the math now. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <font size="2" color="#ff0000"><strong>Earth is Boring</strong></font> </div>

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#### MeteorWayne

##### Guest
Sorry, you are wrong.<br />The "cold core" theory of the sun is eliminated by the observations we have in hand.<br /><br />To suggest a cold core for the sun is unsupported by all scientific evidence to date.<br /><br />Reality and physics are hard taskmasters. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080"><em><font color="#000000">But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id.</font></em> </font></p><p><font color="#000080">I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function</font><font color="#000080"> </font></p> </div>

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#### nstars507

##### Guest
hey!<br />yeah... i am no pro but i am possitive that is not true. sorry to burst your bubble lol and the idea sounds kinda cool but yeah there is no possible way. i mean just think about it fusion is the thing that keeps the sun going and that is due to intense heat and presssure to cause hydrogen to form into helium ... and that leaves no room for the cold core idea... *~natalie~*

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#### nexium

##### Guest
I suppose a very advanced race could build a hollow sphere the size of the sun and put a trillion times a trillion LED = light emitting diodes on the surface, so it would look like a sun in visable light, but would be cool (50 degrees c?) both on the surface and at the center. Neil

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##### Guest
a big led disco ball in space!! <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

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#### MeteorWayne

##### Guest
Of course you'd have to power the LED's, which leads back to a sun for the energy source <img src="/images/icons/smile.gif" /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080"><em><font color="#000000">But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id.</font></em> </font></p><p><font color="#000080">I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function</font><font color="#000080"> </font></p> </div>

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##### Guest
An LED house light bulb (Edison-type) equivalent to 100Wt (converted to lumens) output with 7 very high output Cree chips (the highest output currently made commercially), with a very large aluminum heatsink, runs 90deg C in operation.<br /><br />I know this well since I've converted half a dozen lights in the house to them... <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p>.</p><p><font size="3">bipartisan</font>  (<span style="color:blue" class="pointer"><span class="pron"><font face="Lucida Sans Unicode" size="2">bī-pär'tĭ-zən, -sən</font></span></span>) [Adj.]  Maintaining the ability to blame republications when your stimulus plan proves to be a devastating failure.</p><p><strong><font color="#ff0000"><font color="#ff0000">IMPE</font><font color="#c0c0c0">ACH</font> <font color="#0000ff"><font color="#c0c0c0">O</font>BAMA</font>!</font></strong></p> </div>

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#### freezian

##### Guest
Is there no way that this could be a remote possibility? Could this be impossible?

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#### billslugg

##### Guest
It is, in fact, absolutely, 100%, without a doubt totally and completely impossible. Forget it. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p> </p> </div>

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100% impossible

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#### freezian

##### Guest
You cannot be 100% sure? The Sun could have it's own internal regulator. If it has cool spots or cooler spots,how is this possible? you can't say 100% without proof? Has anybody been to the Sun? It could make sense for the pure fact of it getting too hot or being too cool what the consequences would be for us and the Solar system? The Universe has order so how can you say that it is 100% without a doubt?

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#### billslugg

##### Guest
If you look at the Sun, you see an imaginary spheroid located at exactly one optical depth in the photosphere's plasma. By measurement, the temperature of that surface is never lower than 4500K. Anything located within that spheroid can see only the interior surface of that imaginary spheroid. Therefore it has no place less than 4500K to reject heat. Any object cooler than 4500K will quickly come up to 4500K. An object inside that imaginary surface can be hotter than 4500k but not cooler.<br /><br />That is how we know 100% that the Sun does not have a cold core. Now, if you want to argue that nothing is 100%, I will grant you that. I will only say that the 100% I am referring to is the same 100% that I use when I say that I am 100% sure that Paris Hilton is not a Nobel Laureate. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p> </p> </div>

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#### qso1

##### Guest
freezian:<br />You cannot be 100% sure?<br /><br />Me:<br />This is true but the data so far gets us pretty close to 100% IMO. You mentioned some internal regulator. Current theory is that the suns surface temp is around 6,000 degrees K. Core temps are in the tens of millions of degrees due to sustained fusion.<br /><br />If you want to get just a tiny idea of the effort put into research on the sun, go to:<br /><br />http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sun<br /><br />Keeping in mind that the hot core idea is something that has been measured to some degree by spectrography and in the case of fusion. One of the ways the suns age is estimated is because we can determine age by solar mass and how long the fusion process should occur over that period of time. Measurements and supportable, or at least verifiable data.<br /><br />What you would need to do to begin to stem the tide of hundreds of years of research from scientists the world over who basically have verified this research...is to lay out the details of your theory.<br /><br />Why is the core cold in your opinion?<br /><br />What details, observations can you provide to support the idea of some internal regulating mechanism?<br /><br />Answer even these two questions and you could at least provide some supportable reasons for your theory. The problem with saying something like..."How do we know the suns core is hot if we have never been to the sun"...is equally applicable to your theory without data. That is, how would you know its got a cold core if you have never been there?<br /><br />BTW, the Universe is both order...and chaos. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><strong>My borrowed quote for the time being:</strong></p><p><em>There are three kinds of people in life. Those who make it happen, those who watch it happen...and those who do not know what happened.</em></p> </div>

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