What is technically needed to get Enterprise flight-worthy?

[willpittenger]

I am not counting any financial or political problems.<br /><br />Enterprise was OV-101 while Challenger was actually never intended to fly. Later, NASA switched the two. Challenger became OV-099.<br /><br />Now that we are down to three orbiters, could Enterprise be made flight worthy? I figure some systems were never installed. But just how many of those systems are missing? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Will Pittenger<hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Add this user box to your Wikipedia User Page to show your support for the SDC forums: <div style="margin-left:1em">{{User:Will Pittenger/User Boxes/Space.com Account}}</div> </div>

 

[qso1]

Too much to justify it at this point.<br /><br />For starters, the thermal protection system (Tiles, blankets) which Enterprise has none. Attitude Control System (ACS) or some know this as RCS.<br /><br />Thats just two major things I can think of. I'm not sure there would be any more major items but there are probably a host of minor ones related to outfitting the crew cabin, ECLSS, ect. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><strong>My borrowed quote for the time being:</strong></p><p><em>There are three kinds of people in life. Those who make it happen, those who watch it happen...and those who do not know what happened.</em></p> </div>

 

[vt_hokie]

What's needed to get Explorer flightworthy? <img src="/images/icons/wink.gif" />

 

[qso1]

More work than even Enterprise. Explorer being a replica, it would not even have a functional glass cockpit. At least Enterprise cockpit was flight ready though not a glass cockpit. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><strong>My borrowed quote for the time being:</strong></p><p><em>There are three kinds of people in life. Those who make it happen, those who watch it happen...and those who do not know what happened.</em></p> </div>

 

[llivinglarge]

I believe the OV-095 has a complete glass cockpit.

 

[drwayne]

"It wasn't possible to refit Enterprise when Challenger was built."<br /><br />I would say the word there is "practical", it was *theoretically* possible, but what you would have gotten would have cost a lot, and been even heavier than Columbia, limiting its performance.<br /><br />Now, for a long time, there was something floating around along the lines of an urban legend, that stated that Enterprise had been subjected to some mechanical stress testing to falure, and was therefore not even viable for reconstruction. I have been told that that was not the case....<br /><br />This question of course came up when Challenger was lost - and it turned out to be cheaper/better to build another orbiter using spares as a starting point.<br /><br />Wayne <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p>"1) Give no quarter; 2) Take no prisoners; 3) Sink everything."  Admiral Jackie Fisher</p> </div>

 

[trailrider]

Here is what you do to make Enterprise flight worthy:<br /><br />1. Enter cockpit with appropriate screwdriver or other implement.<br /><br />2. Remove Enterprise nameplate.<br /><br />3. Exit cockpit<br /><br />4. Attach tractor link to nosewheel of spacecraft orbiter<br /><br />5. Tow orbiter to 747 and mount on top<br /><br />6. Fly orbiter to Smithsonian or other appropriate museum<br /><br />7. Construct new orbiter from parts from Atlantis<br /><br />8. Re-attach Enterprise name plate<br /><br />9. Replace nameplate<br /><br />That is about what it would take. Virtually the ENTIRE vehicle is useless to make flight-worthy.<br /><br />If it is not cost effective to do the "Update Revamp" to Atlantis or whatever the next orbiter WAS scheduled to undergo the refit, it certainly isn't close to cost-effective to do anything to Enterprise.<br /><br />While it is sad, especially for us that had such high hopes for the STS program, IT IS TIME TO MOVE ON!<br /><br />Ad Luna! Ad Aries! Ad Astra!

 

[mlorrey]

I'd do something similar: build an entirely new shuttle as a hot structure: no aluminum airframe. Use RCC and metal matrix panels as skin with aerogel insulation underneath.<br /><br />Then replace the SSME's with COBRA engines configured for burning RP-1. <br /><br />Use the LH2 tank as the LOX tank, and the LOX tank as the RP-1 tank.<br /><br />Put wings and landing gear on the ET, plus five COBRA RP-1 engines.<br /><br />Get rid of the SRBs.<br /><br />Combined thrust: 5.2 million lb. Vehicle GLOW: 3.5 million lb. Payload capacity: 60,000 lb. bay size: 40' x 15' x 15'. 1/3 of the payload bay is LOX tank, the wings hold RP-1.<br /><br />The Flyback ET detaches at about Mach 16-17 and, being empty, has a low enough wing loading to rapidly decellerate at high altitude, reducing TPS requirements such that nomex blankets can replace the foam.<br /><br />You now have a fully reusable, maintainable, TSTO shuttle system.

 

[willpittenger]

I do not see why Enterprise would need all of that as it was originally intended for flight -- not Challenger. Also, Enterprise had all structural components as built so it could do the glide tests.<br /><br />Now, are you arguing those components were fatally damaged by the tests, neglect during the years of storage, or NASM? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Will Pittenger<hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Add this user box to your Wikipedia User Page to show your support for the SDC forums: <div style="margin-left:1em">{{User:Will Pittenger/User Boxes/Space.com Account}}</div> </div>

 

[spacefire]

I think Explorer could be made flight-worthy:<br />1) Install a row of toilet seats with the exhaust pointing aft and down.<br />2) Seat ass-tronauts on toilets.<br />3) Distribute burritos and start the countdown. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p>http://asteroid-invasion.blogspot.com</p><p>http://www.solvengineer.com/asteroid-invasion.html </p><p> </p> </div>

 

[willpittenger]

Are you telling me the structural components were fatally damaged? If so, when? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Will Pittenger<hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Add this user box to your Wikipedia User Page to show your support for the SDC forums: <div style="margin-left:1em">{{User:Will Pittenger/User Boxes/Space.com Account}}</div> </div>

 

[drwayne]

The structural components are probably OK.<br /><br />However, Enterprise was never configured for engines, never had a TPS installed, life support installed - was never basically wired/plumbed to perform a space role.<br /><br />To do all of that (and the many things my senile mind has forgotten) would be costly, and you would end up with a shuttle that was heavier than Columbia, thus limiting the roles it could serve in.<br /><br />That is why, when the nominal time to do the Enterprise rebuild came up, it was decided to use the test article for the start of Challenger, and why, later, when Challenger was lost - it was decided to dip into the spare's bin for the start of a new vehicle.<br /><br />Wayne <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p>"1) Give no quarter; 2) Take no prisoners; 3) Sink everything."  Admiral Jackie Fisher</p> </div>

 

[drwayne]

As I mumbled somewhere, there was sort of an "urban legend" that floated around for a while that talked of Enterprise undergoing testing, I don't remember if it specified vibration or the like, and that the frame had been stressed to some form of failure.<br /><br />I did some checking at one time, and it seemed to be untrue.<br /><br />Wayne <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p>"1) Give no quarter; 2) Take no prisoners; 3) Sink everything."  Admiral Jackie Fisher</p> </div>

 

[jschaef5]

This is a bit off topic but i found some really cool videos of the early flight tests of the Enterprise on Wikipedia. They are in the file type of .ogg which can be played in windows media player but you need to download the codex for it.<br /><br />videos are at bottom<br />http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_Shuttle_Enterprise<br /><br />to install the codecs download and run this exe<br />http://www.illiminable.com/ogg/ <br />(its the download now button on the right side)<br /><br /><br />I am not sure why all of wikipedia uses the ogg file format... but the videos are pretty good.<br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[earth_bound_misfit]

Thanks for those links Jake! <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p> </p><p>----------------------------------------------------------------- </p><p>Wanna see this site looking like the old SDC uplink?</p><p>Go here to see how: <strong>SDC Eye saver </strong>  </p> </div>

 

[llivinglarge]

What was the point of putting the SSME on the Enterprise for ALT04 and ALT05?