What size will the astronaut corps be post sts?

[ctrlaltdel]

Orion will have a lower flight rate than the shuttle, so will nasa reassign some of the astronauts to other duties or even let some of them go? I'd imagine the mission specialists would be the most vulnerable; orion won't be doing shuttle style science missions and it won't be constructing stations either, so what role do they have? They would still do the six month iss missions, but that only gets through about eight MS's a year. After the ISS is deorbited and, if by some miracle we also get the moon missions, you still have the problem of the low flight rate vs large astronaut corp. Does anyone know how NASA is going to tackle this issue?

 

[thereiwas]

NASA won't have to "let them go". They will start leaving of their own accord when they know there is no future in space for them at NASA. Plenty of astronauts have done this in the past.<br /><br />But if NASA is going to do anything but plant the flag when they get to the moon, they had better start training as astronauts the kind of people that can do something useful once they get there. Chemical engineers, geologists, etc. They should not make the same mistake they did in Apollo, of not sending a geologist until the last mission.

 

[holmec]

But the first moon mission is no earlier than 2025. That's 18 years away. How long do they train for missions, 4 or 3 years? <br /><br />I think there is presently a lot of studying of the moon going on in preparation for landings. That's probably right schedule. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p><font color="#0000ff"><em>"SCE to AUX" - John Aaron, curiosity pays off</em></font></p> </div>

 

[3488]

I would expect NASA to keep a general 'pool' of astronauts.<br /><br />I would expect post Shuttle, it will be rather small. However, crews will still have<br />to train to operate the Orion CEV, no matter what & for specific mission objectives, <br />so that will not change.<br /><br />Thats my two pennies worth anyway.<br /><br />Andrew Brown. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080">"I suddenly noticed an anomaly to the left of Io, just off the rim of that world. It was extremely large with respect to the overall size of Io and crescent shaped. It seemed unbelievable that something that big had not been visible before".</font> <em><strong><font color="#000000">Linda Morabito </font></strong><font color="#800000">on discovering that the Jupiter moon Io was volcanically active. Friday 9th March 1979.</font></em></p><p><font size="1" color="#000080">http://www.launchphotography.com/</font><br /><br /><font size="1" color="#000080">http://anthmartian.googlepages.com/thisislandearth</font></p><p><font size="1" color="#000080">http://web.me.com/meridianijournal</font></p> </div>

 

[docm]

Sounds like if NewSpace takes off they'll be using more astronauts than NASA. <br /><br />Maybe NASA will have to recruit from them by the time Orion is ready because the current crop will be signing up for their Social Security checks <img src="/images/icons/wink.gif" /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[themanwithoutapast]

15-20 Astronauts will be enough from 2010 until 2020. That would make a rotation of at least 6-8 teams which would be a bit more than during Apollo. That's enough. And yes, in that time period, mission specialists will have to go, except for those with flight experience - they can still get a 6 month rotation on ISS launched on Soyuz as flight engineer.

 

[willpittenger]

<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p>NASA won't have to "let them go". They will start leaving of their own accord when they know there is no future in space for them at NASA. Plenty of astronauts have done this in the past.<p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br />There are two problems there. First, we will spend a lot of money training people to be astronauts that will never fly. Second, we will need to pay the astronauts willing to remain extra to convince them to stay (as opposed to going back to wherever NASA found them.<br /><br /><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p>But if NASA is going to do anything but plant the flag when they get to the moon, they had better start training as astronauts the kind of people that can do something useful once they get there. Chemical engineers, geologists, etc. They should not make the same mistake they did in Apollo, of not sending a geologist until the last mission.<p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br />I don't see not sending a geologist to the Moon until the last mission a complete mistake. I don't think they should have waited that long, but until Apollo 14 succeeded, the spacecraft were still being proven. For that reason, having three astronauts on board with the extra training would have been helpful. Still having a test pilot in the crew would have been better yet. (Not all Apollo -- or even Gemini -- missions flew with true test pilots.) <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Will Pittenger<hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Add this user box to your Wikipedia User Page to show your support for the SDC forums: <div style="margin-left:1em">{{User:Will Pittenger/User Boxes/Space.com Account}}</div> </div>

 

[willpittenger]

1. Would a mission specialist/flight engineer be qualified for a space walk?<br />2. Would a mission specialist/flight engineer be qualified to remain inside while the others all go outside. (With crews currently at just 3 and a minimum EVA body count of 2, you leave someone alone inside.)<br /><br /><br /><br />Is the corps size you quoted for a ISS crew of 3, 6, or 7? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Will Pittenger<hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Add this user box to your Wikipedia User Page to show your support for the SDC forums: <div style="margin-left:1em">{{User:Will Pittenger/User Boxes/Space.com Account}}</div> </div>

 

[rocketscientist327]

In my opinion, there should have been a geologist on each mission beginning with Apollo 12. While pilots are great, they do not make the best geologists and do not spend years studying things like rocks. They worry about flying, and after they get done flying, then they worry about why we flew to the spot in the first place. Science.<br /><br />When we get back to the moon, we need geologists and when we get to Mars, biologists as well.

 

[MeteorWayne]

I agree wholeheartedly.<br /><br />I would hope science is why we should do these things. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080"><em><font color="#000000">But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id.</font></em> </font></p><p><font color="#000080">I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function</font><font color="#000080"> </font></p> </div>

 

[PistolPete]

Hold on a minute. You still need someone to pilot the dang thing.<br /><br />Just like a test pilot doesn't make the best geologist, a geologist also doesn't make the best test pilot. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p><em>So, again we are defeated. This victory belongs to the farmers, not us.</em></p><p><strong>-Kambei Shimada from the movie Seven Samurai</strong></p> </div>

 

[MeteorWayne]

I don't think he was saying that.<br />I read it as: you have two whiz bang pilots on board, why not let a scientist expert in your destination fill the third seat?<br /><br />I think that's a good allocation of resources. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080"><em><font color="#000000">But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id.</font></em> </font></p><p><font color="#000080">I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function</font><font color="#000080"> </font></p> </div>

 

[windnwar]

Is the ISS going to stay a three man crew indefinately? If not, your going to need extra bodies to fill those extra slots that come available there. If things like the CEV or Dragon allow more then 3 people to be sent to the station, and Dragon or the various other cargo flights can ship enough materials to support them, I can't see why they'd stay with only 3 people. So I'd think most of the corps are going to be used over the next decade on trips to the space station, and perhaps for shorter durations then currently. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p><font size="2" color="#0000ff">""Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." --Albert Einstein"</font></p> </div>

 

[PistolPete]

Yes there is eventually going to be more than just a three man crew on the ISS. Current designs will have it at six.<br /><br />That being said, because of international cooperation with the ISS, there won't be just Americans up there. I imagine the standard crew breakdown would be something like: 2 Americans, 2 Russians, 1 European, and 1 Japanese or some variation thereof. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p><em>So, again we are defeated. This victory belongs to the farmers, not us.</em></p><p><strong>-Kambei Shimada from the movie Seven Samurai</strong></p> </div>

 

[willpittenger]

<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p>If things like the CEV or Dragon allow more then 3 people to be sent to the station, and Dragon or the various other cargo flights can ship enough materials to support them, I can't see why they'd stay with only 3 people.<p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br />Where would the extra people sleep? In the Quest airlock? The hab module was canceled. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Will Pittenger<hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Add this user box to your Wikipedia User Page to show your support for the SDC forums: <div style="margin-left:1em">{{User:Will Pittenger/User Boxes/Space.com Account}}</div> </div>

 

[willpittenger]

My previous comments that the entire crew had to be pilots was specific to Apollo. The landers of that era could only land two people. Furthermore, a pilot had to stay behind in orbit.<br /><br />On the other hand, Orion landers will carry the entire crew of four people. The CEV will be on autopilot while the crew is on the surface. Since the crew will have more "seats" than will be needed for the pilot and copilot, those extra seats could be bodies that are simply passengers until the vehicle is on the surface. This would be similar to how the shuttle operates. With a shuttle, up to 5 people mostly settle for making small talk and twiddling their thumbs (if you can in those G forces) during launch and reentry.<br /><br />En route to and from the lunar surface, the mission specialists should treat the pilot and copilot as almost gods. That is, the pilot and copilot know what they are doing. The mission specialists don't. On the surface, that changes. The pilot, now commander, gets the job of keeping everyone safe with the copilot/cocommander helping out. However, the mission specialists would give them instructions that would help those specialists out. In that regard, there might actually be two commanders. One provides safety. The other provides science results. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Will Pittenger<hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Add this user box to your Wikipedia User Page to show your support for the SDC forums: <div style="margin-left:1em">{{User:Will Pittenger/User Boxes/Space.com Account}}</div> </div>

 

[nyarlathotep]

>>"Where would the extra people sleep? In the Quest airlock? The hab module was canceled."<br /><br />Where do they sleep during a Soyuz crew exchange?

 

[holmec]

<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p>I read it as: you have two whiz bang pilots on board, why not let a scientist expert in your destination fill the third seat? <p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br /><br />Third seat? what about the fourth seat? <br /><br />2 pilots, 2 scientists, and what ever science you can pack into your pilots. I think it should go that way, and judging from apollo it seems it will...that is have lunar missions with packed schedules. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p><font color="#0000ff"><em>"SCE to AUX" - John Aaron, curiosity pays off</em></font></p> </div>

 

[holmec]

<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p>>>"Where would the extra people sleep? In the Quest airlock? The hab module was canceled."<br /><br />Where do they sleep during a Soyuz crew exchange?<p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br /><br />There is a lot of room in the ISS. Plus 3 people can sleep in a soyuz. The IMAX movie "Space Station" shows that you basically can sleep anywhere since you really don't need a bed, just need to be attached somewhere. In History's Channel Modern Marvels: Space Shuttle, Sally Ride gives a briefing and she says she would sleep in the copilots chair, and her comment was that "its more comfortable in weightlessness".<br /><br />There is really plenty of room in the ISS. Also take into account that the concept of "room" to humans requires less volume in weightlessness because there is no so called floor or ceiling and you can be content being relatively upside down to your coworkers. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p><font color="#0000ff"><em>"SCE to AUX" - John Aaron, curiosity pays off</em></font></p> </div>

 

[MeteorWayne]

"My previous comments that the entire crew had to be pilots was specific to Apollo. The landers of that era could only land two people. Furthermore, a pilot had to stay behind in orbit. "<br /><br />Ok understand.<br />Fortunately when we get back we will have more flexibility.<br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080"><em><font color="#000000">But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id.</font></em> </font></p><p><font color="#000080">I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function</font><font color="#000080"> </font></p> </div>