Asteroid Defense

pioneer0333 · Oct 9, 2005

Please for the love of God. When an asteroid pops up, do not blow it up. Just use a nuclear pulse sort of speak. Meaning the detonation of several nukes at a limited distance from the rock. This will nudge the rock away by using shockwaves in a precalculated order "depending on the number of nukes" to push it away. Someone pass this on to NORAD and Space Defense. The plan they have is to just blow it up and hope for the best. They are freakin crazy. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

pyoko · Oct 9, 2005

Perhaps someone can calculate what kind of strength of explosion one would need. If exploded, say, 1km from the asteroid. The asteroid is, say, 100 km diameter, and of a rocky type. Traveling at 100 km/ second towards Earth. Do we even have enough nukes to make a difference? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> -pyoko the duck It is by will alone I set my mind in motion. </div>

vogon13 · Oct 9, 2005

Caught in time, an earth approaching asteroid can be deflected with a can of paint. As much as I like nukes, don't want to be wasting those precious neutrons pulverizing stones. Not when there are so many other deserving targets here on earth. {that last bit be a jokey} <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> TPTB went to Dallas and all I got was Plucked !!So many people, so few recipes !!Let's clean up this stinkhole !! </div>

pyoko · Oct 9, 2005

lol Assume the asteroid is already as close as the Moon. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> -pyoko the duck It is by will alone I set my mind in motion. </div>

vogon13 · Oct 9, 2005

Bring those neutrons home to momma! Sadly, the loose aggregate nature of the surface of apparently many asteroids, makes for a pretty good shield for nuclear effects. Applying a large delta vee to the center of mass of an oncoming rock in that time frame may be quite difficult unless you are willing to go way up in the yield range of the proposed nuke. The Castle Bravo nuke was proably the most powerful (by weight) nuke ever made, and we don't have any on hand now. {Tsar bomb looks to be more than 4x heavier, but I have no exact figures for either} No theoretical limit for the size of an H-bomb (although we have a current thread which is questioning current physics understanding of the reactions that power H-bombs) but rocket capability to loft such gadgets to lunar altitude in available time frame are in short supply. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> TPTB went to Dallas and all I got was Plucked !!So many people, so few recipes !!Let's clean up this stinkhole !! </div>

pyoko · Oct 10, 2005

Russian rockets have been sending things out to space for years for a mere fraction of the cost NASA is spending. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> -pyoko the duck It is by will alone I set my mind in motion. </div>

spaceinvador_old · Oct 10, 2005

Great idea! Now that we know we can intercept asteroids millions of miles away for defence purposes, what are we doing with that? What was point if we're not?...

mental_avenger · Oct 10, 2005

The plan they have is to just blow it up and hope for the best. Incorrect. Extremely incorrect. Currently there are on plans on how to deal with potentially dangerous asteroids or comets. I think you have been watching too many movies. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Our Solar System must be passing through a Non Sequitur area of space. </div>

mental_avenger · Oct 10, 2005

Assume the asteroid is already as close as the Moon. There would be no defense against such an object. We couldn’t even launch a defensive vehicle if it was ready on the launch pad, and it wouldn’t have time to interact with the asteroid. A practical Asteroid Defense Detection System would have to be located out past the orbit of Mars. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Our Solar System must be passing through a Non Sequitur area of space. </div>

alienhunter · Oct 10, 2005

There is in fact something going on. It's the Don Quijote Mission that will show us if it's possible to change the course of an asteroid. http://www.spacedaily.com/news/asteroid-05s.html

jatslo · Oct 10, 2005

Best do this at a distance from larger masses, so that it is easier to deflect, because the laws of motion break down out there. <img src="/images/icons/wink.gif" />

nexium · Oct 11, 2005

Out past Mars won't help with asteroids that orbit between Earth orbit and Mercury orbit. but the deflecting stations do need to be in a slightly to considerablely different solar orbit than Earth. I agree nukes exploded inside an asteroid or a kilometer from the surface may make the impact worse, besides requiring dozens of nukes of the size we can deliver with present heavy lift rockets. Instead, I suggest laser arrays in solar orbit that can illuminate a tiny spot on the killer asteroid or comet. This makes a tiny creater which expells reaction mass propelling the killer slightly in the opposite direction. If we have hundreds of these deflecting stations we can change a likely hit to a likely miss in a million seconds of nugging an asteroid. Years of advance warning is needed. Neil

CalliArcale · Oct 11, 2005

I like your sig, pyoko. It's quirky. <img src="/images/icons/wink.gif" /> <blockquote>In reply to:<hr />Assume the asteroid is already as close as the Moon. <hr /></blockquote> As close as the Moon? The appropriate course of action in this circumstance is: 1) Find a sheltered spot indoors, away from windows. 2) Sit down and put your head between your knees. 3) Bend waaaaay over and.... 4) ...kiss your butt goodbye. I seriously doubt that even if we could deliver all of the nukes on Earth to the asteroid in time we could significantly deflect its course this way. At best, we might slightly adjust the aim point. Then again, it really depends on the mass of the object. The more massive it is, the more it will take to deflect it. It's possible it would be small enough for this to work, especially to explain why it could have gone undetected until it was so close. Being an engineer, I'm caught thinking about delivery. A nice big cluster of nukes is going to be a pretty heavy payload, although we can save mass by breaking it up into many flights. Guidance will be an issue as well. We'll want to make sure this hits its target on the first try, because every nuke has got to count. The delivery problem is likely insurmountable with currently availble equipment in the timeframe suggested by an object already as close as the Moon. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> "People assume that time is a strict progression of cause to effect, but actually from a non-linear, non-subjective viewpoint it's more like a big ball of wibbly wobbly . . . timey wimey . . . stuff." -- The Tenth Doctor, "Blink" </div>

yevaud · Oct 11, 2005

Vogon: I believe the "Tsar" bomb was on the close order of 70MT, IIRC. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Differential Diagnosis: "I am both amused and annoyed that you think I should be less stubborn than you are." </div>

yevaud · Oct 11, 2005

Interesting. I knew of it, but I'd never read any of the history behind it. Except, of course, in passing reference to the Soviet penchant for "Gigantism." When tested, it was probably dropped on the island of Novaya Zemlya in the artic. Just a guess. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Differential Diagnosis: "I am both amused and annoyed that you think I should be less stubborn than you are." </div>

raghara2 · Oct 11, 2005

It was an air explosion of just a deuterium version to decrease fallout. The most beefed up version would be 100 MT+. It is advantageous to split asteroid to hopefully so much pieces so a lot of its mass would burn in the athmosphere. There are really bad types of inpacts, and spliting the asteroid would make some difference. However some asteroids are more like sandbag with few iron cores, so they would be somewhat resistant to nukes.

vogon13 · Oct 11, 2005

The Tsar bomb pictures I've seen show it to be massively bigger than 4 (heck even 5 or 6) of the Castle Bravo units. When it was detonated yield was over 15 megatons, much to the surprise of all the on lookers. Castle Bravo test demonstrated that lithium 6 or lithium 7 would work just fine in a 'dry' bomb design. Vigor of reaction was most impressive. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> TPTB went to Dallas and all I got was Plucked !!So many people, so few recipes !!Let's clean up this stinkhole !! </div>

vogon13 · Oct 12, 2005

Cool! Thanx for the link. Now that I have seen the Tsar Bomba, of course, I want one. <img src="/images/icons/wink.gif" /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> TPTB went to Dallas and all I got was Plucked !!So many people, so few recipes !!Let's clean up this stinkhole !! </div>

vogon13 · Oct 12, 2005

I really enjoyed the link but they really down played the military aspect of the device. IIRC, Krushchev threatened (bragged?) that such a device was in East Berlin. Now it may or may not have been there, but once it is tested, and a specific deployment stated, doesn't US military have to proceed from there? My recollection of all this may not be crystal clear, either. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> TPTB went to Dallas and all I got was Plucked !!So many people, so few recipes !!Let's clean up this stinkhole !! </div>

vogon13 · Oct 14, 2005

If I do the math right, Tsar Bomba weighs in at 60,000 pounds, and the Castle Bravo device is 23,500. Work it out for 50 and 15 megatons and it looks like the Tsar is the biggest bang in the pound for pound analysis. How 'bout that! <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> TPTB went to Dallas and all I got was Plucked !!So many people, so few recipes !!Let's clean up this stinkhole !! </div>

pyoko · Oct 15, 2005

lol I was told about the Tsar Bomb when I was a kid. And also the Tsar Cannon, and the Tsar Acid lol the "Tsar Anything" was the biggest and strongest and baddest in the world. Or so the propaganda went. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> -pyoko the duck It is by will alone I set my mind in motion. </div>

Asteroid Defense

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