Can a Black Hole "star" commit fusion, would the photons collect inside the star, would the photons degrade into something else?

[Harry Costas]

A black box can be shaken to make scientific analysis what is inside.
The properties matter give off properties and formations that allows us to predict.
Transients of matter from Axion to Neutron matter have dipolar vector fields creating dipolar vortices that expelling matter and perpendicular vector field going into the core, creating and event horizon, that mimics a black hole.

 

[Harry Costas]

Matter in the universe cannot be created or destroyed, matter can be transformed from one to another.
Matter has been in the universe forever and ever.

 

[rabsal]

EM in a BH gets stripped down to magnetism....all the energy lines curve inward not allowing E to manifest. So photons don't exist any more and "fusion" at this stage would be like a magneto-star but would create a "slip" into another spacetime from the density, which reverses the energy to inflation...IMO...

 

[Harry Costas]

Hello rabsal
That implies a singularity.
Condensates from Axion to Neutron matter form a dipolar electromagnetic vector fields that expel matter and suck in matter perpendicular.
Black Holes are very much in theory.
Condensates have a matter that we can predi

 

[rabsal]

Thanks Harry, but you have got me with the "condensates",...I thought it was just a pretty new word...
I don't believe in the "singularity", or that it leads to another spacetime and the infinity(the math predicts) is the Multiverse...
But if the condensate forms a dipolar vector(explain that one...?) that expels matter and a perpendicular vector going back into the core....and what I said before about magnetism would be a monopole, which supposedly don't exist...but you seem to have the "lingo" down. I will be better equipped to understand this more in a few weeks once classes start...
There is a new report about the Chandra tele that uses x-rays to see into the center of the galaxy and they report a wild energy party going on and there is an exchange of energies more like what you have described as the condensates-I think...sorry I don't have the link...

 

[rabsal]

Try this idea. At the 'top' of the cycle, space has reached its most empty condition and therefore contracts so forcing "stuff" closer together again and decreasing entropy. Note the elegant use of the word "stuff". Nice 'holdall' for all your mass/energy/dark whaterers! Space contracts maybe because of 'light energy' as in opposite of dark. Just joking! Space contracts because it is tired of not holding anything so it collapses. As "stuff" comes together it attracts, some react chemically and order increases until it gets to the 'other' side of the next Big whatever where entropy is minimum because it is all in (big laugh please) a Big Bang. After what I am proposing is just the opposite of the BB. "What's good for the goose is good for the gander". Old English saying.

My change in style is because it is my 82nd Birthday today, so I am being a little frivolous with my nomenclature. It is 7 am here and no alcohol has been consumed. The party doesn't start for hours yet.

Cat

Happy B-day...mine was just a couple of weeks ago...56 and going back to school....
Reading through all these comments I have to bring up the Chandra tele observations and with x-rays they could see into the center of the galaxy and there seems to be an energy exchange...has the group seen this???

 

[rabsal]

Oh and Cat, the nexus idea is awesome and cyclic universe seems like the best model, but I heard if a "wormhole" exists it cant transfer information because it is expanding FTLS ...the ER=EPR scenario...so how would a Universe keep information within if it expands FTLS...with a BB that is expanding more slowly within the FTLS inflation...

 

[Catastrophe]

As I have pointed out elsewhere, there is too much (imho) taking micro ideas and transposing them to macro. If (and I do not believe that there is) such a thing as a wormhole, I believe it would be limited to passage of micro-entities, not 100 passenger space liners. The answer is simple when you think about it. A micro particle can transfer as a single entity. A human would have to transfer atoms/molecules at a time. It would kill, bits coming over piecemeal.

Cat

 

[saliceha]

Black hole shrinking information in the photons, while star preserving information in the photons by transforming it into energy.

 

[Catastrophe]

rabsal, "if a "wormhole" exists it cant transfer information"

I don't know whether the same idea applies (who does?), but going through a nexus is not the same thing as "going through" a singularity. Does this help?

Cat

 

[vincenzosassone]

If (and I do not believe that there is) such a thing as a wormhole, I believe it would be limited to passage of micro-entities

I don't know exactly, but the same words were pronunced by Stephen Hawking, something like: "If wormholes exist, they are as small as an atom; we can't use them, we can't see them, they can be there in our planet but we can feel their presence". (This sums up all I know about wormholes according to Stephen Hawking.
Anyway, I must say that if that is true (if wormholes are small) we will have huge problems in future interstellar voyages

 

[Phaedrus]

Just a question...

Sure, if you dropped a couple of atoms or even atomic nuclei into it together at about the same place and time. Before they reached the center (on presumably two trajectories to the center close to each other in time), eventually their nuclei would be forced to fuse, as they would be forced into too small a space not to fuse. No photon emitted in the process would ever get past the event horizon, by virtue of all the emitting atoms being inside the event horizon. The energy gained by the black hole is measured in terms of its increase in mass. Remember, a black hole only really has 3 parameters: Mass, spin, and charge.

 

[Harry Costas]

Matter transition evolves both ways.
Axion condensate releases matter: as per the Big Bang Theory.
Axion gluon (two photons)
To
Complex Partonic matter
To Quark matter
Kaon Matter
To
Neutron matter
Neutron matter away from confinement loses and electron.
To Proton
Fusion to evolve all atoms as we know them.
To revert the direction.
We can estimate the compaction of the transients.
All what I say can be researched

 

[Scott D. Deutsch]

My theory is that our universe came from the collapse of a supermassive black hole from another universe, and our inflation/expansion is a "white hole" or repulsive/expanding black hole. So black holes have a maximum density they can absorb before collapsing and slipping into another spacetime and creating a new universe. That density could be calculated once we understand the density of dark energy or the "energy" of dark energy in our universe. It would have to be equivalent to "inflation" which is faster than light speed and whose density has exceeded that of space expansion vacuum energy....or somerhing like that....I believe this to be equivalent to the inverse/reciprocal energy of lights speed per volume of space, and we should find the graviton at that energy level.

That's not what I was talking about...

 

[Harry Costas]

We have many theories and ideas how the universe works.
If your happy with your ideas then clap your hands.
If you really want to understand, then go on the journey of research, the more you read and observe the more understanding you will have.
The key is.

Have fun with it and keep an open mind.

 

[Atlan0001]

A star is a closed system finite. A blackhole, on the other hand, probably opens interiorly to infinity. You can find a bottom to a star. There probably is no bottom to a blackhole except infinity / origin. Go with the grain of event horizon instead of against it or into it, you might discover a wormhole driver to other star systems, or an expansive star cluster, galaxy, universe, or all following in stepped planes, by way of the event horizon.

 

[Harry Costas]

Black Hole has many meanings and most are found in movies.
Classical Black Hole has a singularity where noting can escape, but for minor electrical leaks.
A mimic Black hole is a condensate probably a Quark core , partonic matter and so on to a Axion Gluon Matter. These types of Black holes create a dipolar electromagnetic vector fields forming vortices that are capable expanding to millions of light years.
MILKYWAY core creates 7000 light years vortices
M87 100,000 light years
Super cluster of galaxies over a million light years.
To create such forces the core must have a huge mass.
Perpendicular to the vortices the pulling force creates an event horizon.
And so such core show the power of a Black Hole without a singularity.

 

[Harry Costas]

General Relativity and Quantum Cosmology
[Submitted on 18 Feb 2022]
First Law of Mechanics for Spinning Compact Binaries: Dipolar Order
Paul Ramond, Alexandre Le Tiec

Building upon the Noether charge formalism of Iyer and Wald, we derive a variational formula for spacetimes admitting a Killing vector field, for a generic energy-momentum distribution with compact support. Applying this general result to the particular case of a binary system of spinning compact objects moving along an exactly circular orbit, modelled using the multipolar gravitational skeleton formalism, we derive a first law of compact binary mechanics at dipolar order. We prove the equivalence of this new result with the canonical Hamiltonian first law previously derived for binary systems of spinning compact objects, for spins colinear with the orbital angular momentum. This paper paves the way to an extension of the first law of binary mechanics to the next quadrupolar order, thereby accounting for the spin-induced and tidally-induced deformability of the compact bodies.

Comments:	44 pages, 3 figures
Subjects:	General Relativity and Quantum Cosmology (gr-qc)
Cite as:	arXiv:2202.09345 [gr-qc]
	(or arXiv:2202.09345v1 [gr-qc] for this version)
	https://doi.org/10.48550/arXiv.2202.09345 Focus to learn m

Astrophysics can be very complex and yet simple in its understanding.

 

[Harry Costas]

Our universe is one infinite universe.
The parts within our infinite universe have the same properties and form similar objects.
Our universe years gone by, was observed as our MILKYWAY.
The more we observed the more we found no end.

As for B;ack holes, one needs to define which type.
Classical Black hole in theory has a singularity an Event Horizon and a core of infinite mass.
Mimic Black Hole is a condensate with no singularity, but does create and Event Horizon and the core could range from 10^18 to 10^35 compaction and has one common property that we can observe and that is a dipolar electromagnetic vector force fields that form vortices,
What makes up a Black Hole?
Quark matter to partonic matter to Axion Gluon matter,

 

[Unclear Engineer]

A couple of comments:

1. Concerning fusion in a neutron star: the ultimate fusion has presumably already occurred, with the result being a mass of "pure" neutrons. That is why it is called a neutron star. However, neutron stars do pull in additional mass from the surrounding environment, and there appears to be episodic fusion events of that additional mass on the surface of the neutron star, where hydrogen and maybe other elements experience the temperatures and densities to cause them to fuse. Look back through Space.com and ScienceDaily.com and you will find a recent article on that.

2. Concerning what photons might do inside a black hole: In theory, two photons colliding can produce an electron/positron pair, since an electron + positron collision/annihilation produces a pair of photons, and that is presumed to be reversible. A 100 petawatt laser being developed in China should be able to actually test that theory, see https://www.science.org/content/art...-so-powerful-they-could-rip-apart-empty-space . But, even if that does happen, presumably the positrons and electrons will then collide and produce photons, again. Whatever, we do not know of any way for the photons or particles to escape from the black hole so that we could see/detect them. The light sent our way from black holes is thought to be created just outside the event horizon by extremely heated matter being drawn into the black hole. That is what Quasars are thought to be - massive black holes drawing in gigantic amounts of matter per unit of time.

 

[billslugg]

Pair production requires a charged particle in order to carry away the momentum. It would seem that photons within a black hole are there forever.

"In the pair production process, an incident gamma ray of sufficiently high energy is annihilated in the Coulomb field of a nearby charged particle, resulting in the creation of an electron–positron pair. As with the photoelectric effect, conservation of momentum requires the presence of a third body which takes up the balance of the momentum in the form of a recoil."

J.Gregory Stacy, W.Thomas Vestrand, in Encyclopedia of Physical Science and Technology (Third Edition), 2003

 

[Unclear Engineer]

Considering the assumed densities of both photons and particles of all sorts within a black hole, it does not seem difficult to imagine all sorts of interactions that might convert photons into matter.

But, the process I referred to in my previous post does not involve a single photon - it is a collision between 2 photons. So, momentum can be conserved without proximity to a third particle with mass and an electric field, in theory. I expect somebody will try to actually demonstrate that once there are laser beams of sufficient power in operation. That is what the article is talking about in the link I provided in my previous post.

 

[Harry Costas]

Concerning Fusion in Neutron Stars.
Neutron star is a transient condensate.
Fusion within a Neutron Condensate cannot occur, once neutrons are released from the core and away from confined forces neutrons lose an electron and form Protons, than fusion of Protons can take place.

As for Black Holes matter does not stay there forever.
Unless you are talking about classic black holes with a singularity in theory nothing can escape, but the theory breakers down, as explained, dipolar property, that eject matter out from the core,

 

[Unclear Engineer]

Harry, do you have a reference to a description of the process by which real black holes eject matter from their cores?

 

[Harry Costas]

Observations is a good start,
The best start from the Big Bang Theory of nucleosynthesis from a black hole.
Not just one but through out the trillion galaxies predicted that happened all at once,