I, ROBOT

hracctsold · Dec 28, 2004

I am new to this group thing, but I am also a time travel and sci fi fan and big reader. I also really like Issac Asimof, (sorry about that), books as well. I heard him respond to a person one time who said he had read everything Issac wrote, and he said I highly doubt that, because I don't think I have read all that I have written. I was not able to go see the movie until it came out on video, but thought it was well adapted to the series concept. At first I had reservations about how they could adapt one movie about the different stories, but heard someone say in an interview that they agreed, and wanted to be true to the whole nature of the ideas presented. (Or something to that thought). I think they did a good job at it. What do you think?

Saiph · Dec 28, 2004

They did a suprisingly good job of adapting it to current tastes in movies (i.e. more action). Sure, they did something different with it, that assimov would likely never do (lots of action), but they still had the underlying "who done it", the pervasive moral issue of how to treat robots, and the puzzle of how the three laws were foiled. It also demonstrated why the Zeroth law was put into place. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> --------------------SaiphMOD@gmail.com -------------------"This is my Timey Wimey Detector. Goes "bing" when there's stuff. It also fries eggs at 30 paces, wether you want it to or not actually. I've learned to stay away from hens: It's not pretty when they blow" -- The Tenth Doctor, "Blink" </div>

neocon · Dec 30, 2004

Pretty good flick. Will Smith sure has come a long way from the "Fresh Prince"

rogers_buck · Dec 30, 2004

Is what I read here a tacid endorsement of the movie???

avaunt · Dec 30, 2004

No, I think more a tacit one. <img src="/images/icons/wink.gif" /> I liked it.

JonClarke · Dec 31, 2004

I am a great admirer of Asimov and went to this film prepared to be unimpressed. I was pleasantly surprised in many ways. I think it had a good story line and some very interesting ideas about the emergence of artificial conciousness. I think it was well acted and directed, and was visually spectacular. The weakest parts were where it tried to tip a nod at Asimov. The whole point of Asimovian (or Calvinian) robots was that the three laws were immutable. The three laws could be subverted or subsumed but not overridden in such an arbitary way. They could not be overridden in such a naive way as the film showed without causing massive damage to the the positronic brain. We have had so many stories about robots running amok, it would have been much more intelligent and original to show something different. But the producers decided to stick to cliches rather than be original. this is a pity because the reason why Asimov invented the three laws was because he was tired of the mechanical monster cliche. Jon <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars Arthur Clarke </div>

hracctsold · Dec 31, 2004

I think you are making perfect sense. It has been a while since I have read any robot stories, but I seem to think that some of his last or later robot stories dealt with robots who were contemplating just such a overthrow or something of that nature. But that took around 20,000 years to do or something of that nature. So that would have been later then the movie, but that part of the movie maybe was to be expected for its storyline.

hracctsold · Jan 1, 2005

In answer to your question of who they could get to play Will Smith 20,000 years later in the Caves of Steel, they could always get Will Smith to play his decendent. I know what you mean about the quality of shows from the books they have. It wasn't until I heard that they were going to be faithful to the story did I really think it might be half-way good to see.

JonClarke · Jan 1, 2005

In Asimov's stories, even zeroth law robots did not offer the violence towards humans that we see in the film. There is an inconsistency with the nature of robot conciousness here. Asimovian robots were always concious, even when deactivated (albeit at a low level). they would have been aware of three law violations in their behaviour, however dimly, while under NIKI's control and this would cause major damage to the positronic brain. In Asmov's universe even thinking about the zeroth law caused major stress and even fatal damage to many robots. The "discoverer" of the zeroth law, R. Giskard, "died" as a result of implementing it. The big problem in the film is the interpretation of the zeroth law. As envisaged by Asimov, this was basically Mill's "greatest good of the greatest number". However the film took the interpretation of "the ends justifies the means". OK, for a simplistic action flick, but it misses the more subtle approach of Mill (which is still morally dangerous, as pointed out in Le'Guin's chilling tale "Those who walk away from Osmelas"). The producers/directors showed they could deal with the subtle questions of emergent conciousness, it is a pity they could not do the same here. One can find was to justify it in the film, but in the end if you are going to use ideas from someone else in your universe you need to handle them consistently. The problem with LOTR again. If producers/directors want to tell there own story, unconstrained by the imagination of others, they should do so. But if you overtly and specifically base your imagined world someone elses's ideas, there is a degree to which you must be found by them, not matter how you extrapolate. Cheers Jon edited for spelling <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars Arthur Clarke </div>

hracctsold · Jan 1, 2005

Jon, But the question remains, do you think Will Smith could play his decendent when even the robots were old, that far in the future?

JonClarke · Jan 2, 2005

hraccts Anything is possible of course. I guess that the details world of I, robot is so removed from Asimov's future history that there would be little point. It is hard to see what room there is for a sequel too, although it would be nice to see the Exodus threme developed more fully, perhaps with robots being granted human rights. But I doubt that this would happen. Cheers Jon <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars Arthur Clarke </div>

hracctsold · Jan 2, 2005

Jon, Thanks for the update, but I really wasn't that serious about Will's future role. But as had been said, I think the movie was better then antisipated(sp?). I don't know if I am going against any rules (OF THIS FORMUM in talking about other subjects then what was listed), but do you also think the seemingly time travel concepts were as well upheld in the movie Frequency? Could it seem possible for one person to to have two sets of memories of past life conflicting events, as the story-line gave? I really don't think its possible, but it would be interesting to see how things would react.

JonClarke · Jan 2, 2005

Since time travel is fantasy (as far as we know) a person can write whatever they like! But the idea of multiple memories of former and current realities, at least in the mind of the protaganists does crop up from time to time. Le'Guin's "Lathe of heaven is one". More commonly though only the central character remembers the previous reality and has no knowledge of the new one, and are as strangers in a strange land. Jon <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars Arthur Clarke </div>

hracctsold · Jan 6, 2005

Huh?? Would you mind putting that in english. Robin William's movie was alright, but it ran a little long.

hracctsold · Jan 7, 2005

Please refer to the thread, "Texas English," in free space for the proper way to speak those honored words, thank you.

hracctsold · Jan 9, 2005

Are you talking about I, Robot? What part of terminator would that be? I guess I can see it if the terminator was domesticated, but the other was abnormal to their true programing. That is what the 3 laws were all about.

jmilsom · Feb 11, 2005

I finally saw this film during the last week. Not too bad. I agree with the interaction above concerning the zeroth law. The film was going really well and then it was suddenly like, “OK we’ve followed Asimov enough, let’s forget about Asimov now, and show everyone what cool special effects we’ve got.” It is a pity intelligent, thoughtful films do not make money. But, all in all a pretty good film – perhaps they can deal with some of the deeper issues in a sequel. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

vogon13 · Feb 11, 2005

Haven't seen it yet. Cautiously optomistic I will enjoy flick so will most likely purchase DVD or Tivo PPV. As long as I, Robot isn't as bad as the film of Nightfall, I'll be happy. Nightfall, the story, beyond excellent; Nightfall, the movie, fecesfulable. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> TPTB went to Dallas and all I got was Plucked !!So many people, so few recipes !!Let's clean up this stinkhole !! </div>

slayera · Feb 11, 2005

The poorest book to movie is Damnation Alley. The book rocked and the movie is not worth the film its printed on. I hope one day someone remakes it a little closer to the vision of the book. I still have no clue why movies differ so much from the book? I am of the opinion that if you make a book into a movie then be true to that vision or make your movie on the same subject not related to the book.

I, ROBOT

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