Orion slips back a year

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earth_bound_misfit

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<p>A lot of the media (including SDC) is reporting that Orion won't have a manned launch until 2014. Bit of a bummer but I suppose not entirely unexpected.</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Question time :)</p><p>How many unmanned test flights would there be?&nbsp; Take a guess if it's unknown at this stage. Any ideas when test flights might begin? </p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p> </p><p>----------------------------------------------------------------- </p><p>Wanna see this site looking like the old SDC uplink?</p><p>Go here to see how: <strong>SDC Eye saver </strong>  </p> </div>
 
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shuttle_guy

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<p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>A lot of the media (including SDC) is reporting that Orion won't have a manned launch until 2014. Bit of a bummer but I suppose not entirely unexpected.&nbsp;Question time :)How many unmanned test flights would there be?&nbsp; Take a guess if it's unknown at this stage. Any ideas when test flights might begin? <br />Posted by earth_bound_misfit</DIV></p><p>The plan is to launch the first dummy Orion in April 2009. That is just with a modified Shuttle SRB not the Ares SRB first stage. The second stage is a dummy also thus the mission is sub orbital.<br /></p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>
 
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Bytor_YYZ

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<p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>The plan is to launch the first dummy Orion in April 2009. That is just with a modified Shuttle SRB not the Ares SRB first stage. The second stage is a dummy also thus the mission is sub orbital. <br /> Posted by shuttle_guy</DIV></p><p>It isn't even hardly a dummy "Orion".&nbsp; It doesn't have the same interfaces as the spacecraft, just the right mass and the shape in the same place.&nbsp; The whole upperstage/spacecraft have no lineage with the actual spacecraft and upperstage.&nbsp;&nbsp; </p>
 
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Carrickagh

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<p>I'm sorry but I've read March 2015 for the first anticipated manned launch.</p><p>Is that correct? Or are the dates at this stage fluid based on whatever pacing items they have to track on the MS project spreadsheet?</p><p>*</p><p>UPDATE: OK, looks like I've been misreading. The NASA managers are calling it September 2014, but the mandated Congressional date (however they mandate these things) is March 2015. </p><p>So if they set the goal six months out they may still make it by the time the people writing the checks have asked for it. There's a certain logic to that. </p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>
 
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DrRocket

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<p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>I'm sorry but I've read March 2015 for the first anticipated manned launch.Is that correct? Or are the dates at this stage fluid based on whatever pacing items they have to track on the MS project spreadsheet?*UPDATE: OK, looks like I've been misreading. The NASA managers are calling it September 2014, but the mandated Congressional date (however they mandate these things) is March 2015. So if they set the goal six months out they may still make it by the time the people writing the checks have asked for it. There's a certain logic to that. <br />Posted by Carrickagh</DIV></p><p>http://www.reuters.com/article/scienceNews/idUSN1143975220080811?feedType=RSS&feedName=scienceNews<br /></p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>
 
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Carrickagh

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<p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>http://www.reuters.com/article/scienceNews/idUSN1143975220080811?feedType=RSS&feedName=scienceNews <br />Posted by DrRocket</DIV></p><p>Thanks for the link.</p><p>I liked this one manager's quote:</p><p><font color="#993366">"The window of opportunity for us to accelerate Orion has closed," program manager Jeff Hanley at NASA's Johnson Space Center in Houston told reporters during a conference call.</font></p><p>Gates and Phases, baby! Gates & Phases.</p><p>*</p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>
 
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trailrider

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<p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Thanks for the link.I liked this one manager's quote:"The window of opportunity for us to accelerate Orion has closed," program manager Jeff Hanley at NASA's Johnson Space Center in Houston told reporters during a conference call.Gates and Phases, baby! Gates & Phases.* <br />Posted by Carrickagh</DIV></p><p>What is the "drop-dead" date for beginning dismantling of Shuttle ET production tooling?&nbsp; That is a critical point, because IF it were decided to go with an alternative booster system for Orion, say, by the next Administration and/or Congress, utilizing the ET tooling, we might have no choice but to follow the Ares I/V fiasco!</p><p><br /><br />&nbsp;</p>
 
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Zipi

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Date:&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Tue, 12 Aug 2008 09:31:45 -0500<br />From:&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; info@JSC.NASA.GOV<br />Subject: NASA TO REALIGN CONSTELLATION PROGRAM MILESTONES<br /><br />August 12, 2008<br /><br />Lynnette Madison<br />Johnson Space Center, Houston <br />281-483-5111 <br /><br /><br />Josh Byerly <br />Johnson Space Center, Houston <br />281-483-5111 <br /><br /><br /><br />Report #H08-205<br /><br />NASA TO REALIGN CONSTELLATION PROGRAM MILESTONES<br /><br />WASHINGTON -- In a news conference Monday, NASA managers discussed how the agency will be adjusting the budget, schedule and technical performance milestones for its Constellation Program to ensure the first crewed flight of the Ares I rocket and Orion crew capsule in March 2015. <br /><br />The Constellation Program is developing the spacecraft and systems, including the Ares I and Ares V rockets, the Orion crew exploration vehicle, and the Altair lunar lander, that will take astronauts to the International Space Station after the retirement of the space shuttle, and eventually return humans to the moon. <br /><br />&quot;Since the program's inception, NASA has been working an aggressive plan to achieve flight capability before our March 2015 target,&quot; said Rick Gilbrech, associate administrator for the Exploration Systems Mission Directorate at NASA Headquarters in Washington. &quot;We are still confident the Constellation Program will make its first flight to the International Space Station on or before that date. Our new path forward better aligns our project schedules with our existing funds to ensure we can address the unplanned challenges that always arise when developing a complex flight system.&quot; <br /><br />NASA will retire the space shuttles in 2010 and had established a goal of achieving flight capability for the Constellation Program before 2015 to narrow the gap in America's human spaceflight capability. As such, NASA aligned Constellation contracts and internal milestones against a date much earlier than March 2015 to incentivize an earlier flight capability. <br /><br />As part of an annual budget process that evaluates the program's budget, schedule and technical performance milestones, NASA will be working with its contractors to discuss how program plans and internal milestones should be adjusted -- a process that will take several months and require contract modifications and associated milestone realignments. Such adjustments are not unusual for a complex development program as work matures and schedules and resources are aligned. <br /><br />For more information about the Constellation Program, visit: <br /><br />http://www.nasa.gov/constellation <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>
 
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Carrickagh

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<p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>What is the "drop-dead" date for beginning dismantling of Shuttle ET production tooling?&nbsp; That is a critical point, because IF it were decided to go with an alternative booster system for Orion, say, by the next Administration and/or Congress, utilizing the ET tooling, we might have no choice but to follow the Ares I/V fiasco!&nbsp; <br />Posted by trailrider</DIV><br /><br />I've had the impression most of this stuff starts shutting down in the 2009 timeframe. I don't have any key dates, however.</p><p>There was a previous poster who said he worked at Stennis (nowhere near Michoud, I realize) but he/she might have a better idea on the dates.</p><p>**</p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>
 
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shuttle_guy

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<p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>I've had the impression most of this stuff starts shutting down in the 2009 timeframe. I don't have any key dates, however.There was a previous poster who said he worked at Stennis (nowhere near Michoud, I realize) but he/she might have a better idea on the dates.** <br />Posted by Carrickagh</DIV></p><p>We understand that ET tooling starts to be dismanteled next month.</p><p>We have been told&nbsp;that layoffs start in October for the ET team.</p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>
 
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Carrickagh

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<p>This sort of sums it up:</p><p align="left">The work force at Michoud is one of the best supporting the U.S. <font style="font-weight:400;color:blue!important;font-family:geneva,arial,verdana" color="#0000ff"><span style="font-weight:400;color:blue!important;border-bottom:blue1pxsolid;font-family:geneva,arial,verdana;background-color:transparent" class="kLink">space </span><span style="font-weight:400;color:blue!important;border-bottom:blue1pxsolid;font-family:geneva,arial,verdana;background-color:transparent" class="kLink">program</span></font>. Michoud employees returned to work in large numbers after Hurricane Katrina to regenerate the external tank assembly line even after suffering significant personal tragedy and loss of homes. Three years later, the redesigned external tanks being assembled at Michoud are the best ever produced. </p><p align="left">While the reductions associated with the shuttle's retirement will result in fewer people doing NASA work at Michoud, the agency plans to locate significant work there in the future. Boeing employees will manufacture and assemble the <font style="font-weight:400;color:blue!important;font-family:geneva,arial,verdana" color="#0000ff"><span style="font-weight:400;color:blue!important;font-family:geneva,arial,verdana" class="kLink">Ares</span></font> I upper stage, and conduct avionics <font style="font-weight:400;color:blue!important;font-family:geneva,arial,verdana" color="#0000ff"><span style="font-weight:400;color:blue!important;border-bottom:blue1pxsolid;font-family:geneva,arial,verdana;background-color:transparent" class="kLink">systems </span><span style="font-weight:400;color:blue!important;border-bottom:blue1pxsolid;font-family:geneva,arial,verdana;background-color:transparent" class="kLink">integration</span></font> and checkout. Lockheed Martin will build structures for the Orion crew exploration capsule as well as the capsule's Launch Abort System. In future years, the Ares V core stage and Earth departure stage, which will be needed for the return to the moon, will be built at Michoud. </p><p>link:http://www.spaceref.com/news/viewpr.html?pid=26105</p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>
 
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docm

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And the fact that demo'ing the STS tank tooling also means NASA can brush off Direct using another arguement - no STS tooling remains. A self serving action on the part of management if ever I saw one. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>
 
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