"Trees" on Mars may be CO2 gas jets

[Smersh]

<p>I have been reading through the "NASA finds life on Mars!" thread in the SETI forum on the old Uplink board, (that does not seem to have transferred over here, for some reason, otherwise I would have bumped it.)</p><p>As long as Uplink is still available in read-only mode, the thread can be found here:</p><p>http://uplink.space.com/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=seti&Number=335822&page=&view=&sb=&o=&fpart=1&vc=1</p><p>("Insert link" seems not to be working, sorry.)</p><p>I also read an article at space.com from 2001 about this subject here:</p><p>http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/solarsystem/clarke_mars_banyon_010709-1.html</p><p>Anyway I put this thread in SS & A because if this theory is true, it would "debunk" (if that is the correct word,) any ideas people may have had about there possibly being trees at the Martian south pole.&nbsp;</p><p>In August 2006, research by a team of Mars scientists at Arizona State University concluded that the "trees" are in fact CO2 gas jets erupting through the ice. Details here:</p><p>http://themis.asu.edu/news-polarjets</p><p>I was wondering if any experts here agree with the above theory about the gas jets. Thanks. </p><p>&nbsp;</p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <h1 style="margin:0pt;font-size:12px">----------------------------------------------------- </h1><p><font color="#800000"><em>Lady Nancy Astor: "Winston, if you were my husband, I'd poison your tea."<br />Churchill: "Nancy, if you were my wife, I'd drink it."</em></font></p><p><font color="#0000ff"><strong>Website / forums </strong></font></p> </div>

 

[doublehelix]

<p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'><font color="#0000ff">("Insert link" seems not to be working, sorry.)</font><br /><strong> Posted by smersh</strong></DIV></p><p>Anything with http in it will automatically turn into a link, so no extra code is needed.&nbsp;</p><p>-dh&nbsp;</p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#3366ff">doublehelix, Community Manager<br />Imaginova </font></p> </div>

 

[Smersh]

<p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Anything with http in it will automatically turn into a link, so no extra code is needed.&nbsp;-dh&nbsp; <br /> Posted by doublehelix</DIV></p><p>Thanks doublehelix, the "insert link" function did work for me yesterday, but not today for some reason. All I was hoping to do was make a hyperlink to avoid a looooong url going across the screen! </p><p>&nbsp;</p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <h1 style="margin:0pt;font-size:12px">----------------------------------------------------- </h1><p><font color="#800000"><em>Lady Nancy Astor: "Winston, if you were my husband, I'd poison your tea."<br />Churchill: "Nancy, if you were my wife, I'd drink it."</em></font></p><p><font color="#0000ff"><strong>Website / forums </strong></font></p> </div>

 

[JonClarke]

<p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>In August 2006, research by a team of Mars scientists at Arizona State University concluded that the "trees" are in fact CO2 gas jets erupting through the ice. Details here:http://themis.asu.edu/news-polarjetsI was wondering if any experts here agree with the above theory about the gas jets. Thanks. &nbsp; <br />Posted by smersh</DIV></p><p>I am not sure "agree" is the right word.&nbsp; These are very odd features.&nbsp; Buit the proposed mechanism appears to fit&nbsp; the observations, violates no existing physics or chemistry, and is consistent with the environmental conditions.</p><p>Certainly much more clausible that the "trees" idea! <br /><br />cheers</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>Jon</p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><em>Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars</em>  Arthur Clarke</p> </div>

 

[bobw]

<p>That is a really great picture on at the top of the page at&nbsp; http://themis.asu.edu/news-polarjets.</p><p>Is that the stuff they used to call "Dalmation Terrain"?&nbsp; It is much more violent than I thought it was.</p><p>What a rush going out in some vehicle on water detail at the poles.</p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[JonClarke]

<p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Is that the stuff they used to call "Dalmation Terrain"?&nbsp; It is much more violent than I thought it was.What a rush going out in some vehicle on water detail at the poles.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <br />Posted by bobw</DIV></p><p>&nbsp;"Dalmatian terrain" (http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20030701a&nbsp;is formed by the&nbsp;dark, more&nbsp;or less circulation spots made on white frosted ground during the early stages of the spring thaw.&nbsp; Quite a different process and landscape</p><p>Jon</p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><em>Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars</em>  Arthur Clarke</p> </div>

 

[bobw]

<p>I probably missed the point at <br />http://themis.asu.edu/news-polarjets</p><p>They have a picture with A part and B part.&nbsp; The A part looks dalmatian to me.&nbsp; Are they saying the A part is formed the old slow way and just the B part with the tails is from the geysers?<font size="1"></font></p><p><br /> <img src="http://sitelife.space.com/ver1.0/Content/images/store/11/1/5bbb12a1-ec76-4ecf-8116-96f9685c6d87.Medium.jpg" alt="" />&nbsp; </p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[JonClarke]

<p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>I probably missed the point at http://themis.asu.edu/news-polarjetsThey have a picture with A part and B part.&nbsp; The A part looks dalmatian to me.&nbsp; Are they saying the A part is formed the old slow way and just the B part with the tails is from the geysers?&nbsp;&nbsp; <br /></DIV></p><p>The Dallmatian terrain has nothing to do with spiders and geysers.&nbsp; The spots with tails have just defrosting spots where in action has resulted in a destict orientation to them.&nbsp; As far as we can tell they are just frost on sand.</p><p>&nbsp;the spiders are much more complex features, requring formation of a layer of solid CO2 ice, sub ice sublimation, eruption from a vent, formation of a centripetal dendritic network of sub ice pathways leading to that vent (the "trees"), and deposition of dust and other material on top of the ice.</p><p>Hope this helps</p><p>Jon<br /></p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><em>Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars</em>  Arthur Clarke</p> </div>

 

[bobw]

<p>Let me try the pop quiz one more time.&nbsp; Thanks for the patience </p><p>Dalmatian terrain is frost so it can only happen at the edges of the ice cap?</p><p>Although the spiders and geysers may look (to me) like dalmatian terrain they aren't and both sides of the picture are geysers?</p><p>How do they tell them apart?&nbsp; Do you need a radar return that shows deep CO2 ice, or just know that the spot is far enough away from the edge of the cap that it couldn't be frost during that part of the year?&nbsp; </p><p>It is still confusing to me but that stuff would make a way more exciting vacation spot than Yellowstone park.</p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[JonClarke]

<p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Let me try the pop quiz one more time.&nbsp; Thanks for the patience Dalmatian terrain is frost so it can only happen at the edges of the ice cap?Although the spiders and geysers may look (to me) like dalmatian terrain they aren't and both sides of the picture are geysers?How do they tell them apart?&nbsp; Do you need a radar return that shows deep CO2 ice, or just know that the spot is far enough away from the edge of the cap that it couldn't be frost during that part of the year?&nbsp; It is still confusing to me but that stuff would make a way more exciting vacation spot than Yellowstone park. <br />Posted by bobw</DIV></p><p>I am probably explaining it poorly.&nbsp; I can't rule out spiders in that image, but they are very poor examples.&nbsp; This link has better ones http://photojournal.jpl.nasa.gov/catalog/PIA08659&nbsp;.</p><p>Dalmation spots are a feature of the annual frost and snow extension to the polar caps.&nbsp; The spiders form are on the polar cap proper.&nbsp; </p><p>hope this helps</p><p>Jon</p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><em>Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars</em>  Arthur Clarke</p> </div>

 

[bobw]

You are explaining fine.<br /><br />PIA08659 is the same one as on the bottom of the polarjets page.&nbsp; That is what is left after the seasonal layer sublimates.&nbsp; Next spring it will have geysers and black spots until summer.<br /><br />I think I understand it now.&nbsp; The area where the geysers form never gets down to bare dirt in the summer.&nbsp; The area where the dalmation terrain forms does.&nbsp; It is two different things, like you said long ago.<br /><br />Thanks. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>