What is that in the sky?

wpascual · Feb 9, 2009

Hi everyone!  This is my first time on this site and it's my first time posting.  Can someone please tell me what is the bright object in the western night sky???  Oh, I live in New York and it is 8:30pm on Feb 9th.

Saiph · Feb 9, 2009

If you see an unusually bright object in the sky, there's three typical answers...well, maybe four but I doubt you'd be confused on #4:1) Plane, just high and moving slow2) Venus (very bright, and very steady! Never far from the sun...so within a few hours of sunrise/sunset)3) Sirius (seriously...and it's near Orion's left foot (our left, not his)) This tends to twink wildly, and in many colors4) The moon

In this case, you're looking right smack dab at Venus, the Evening star (or dawn star). <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> --------------------SaiphMOD@gmail.com -------------------"This is my Timey Wimey Detector. Goes "bing" when there's stuff. It also fries eggs at 30 paces, wether you want it to or not actually. I've learned to stay away from hens: It's not pretty when they blow" -- The Tenth Doctor, "Blink" </div>

MeteorWayne · Feb 10, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>If you see an unusually bright object in the sky, there's three typical answers...well, maybe four but I doubt you'd be confused on #4:1) Plane, just high and moving slow2) Venus (very bright, and very steady! Never far from the sun...so within a few hours of sunrise/sunset)3) Sirius (seriously...and it's near Orion's left foot (our left, not his)) This tends to twink wildly, and in many colors4) The moon

In this case, you're looking right smack dab at Venus, the Evening star (or dawn star). Posted by Saiph</DIV> 5. There's one other thing that can be brighter than Venus, but only lasts 10 seconds or so, an Iridium satellite flare. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

kg · Feb 10, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>5. There's one other thing that can be brighter than Venus, but only lasts 10 seconds or so, an Iridioum satellite flare. Posted by MeteorWayne</DIV> I've been looking for those Iridium satellite flares using the heavens-above website.  I saw one last night.  It was at the right time and in the right location in the sky but it flashed twice!  It was supposed to brighten to -5 magnitude but neither flare was quite as bright as Venus.  Could the reflecting surfaces on this satellite be misaligned?  This is a great website!  http://heavens-above.com/

MeteorWayne · Feb 10, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>I've been looking for those Iridium satellite flares using the heavens-above website.  I saw one last night.  It was at the right time and in the right location in the sky but it flashed twice!  It was supposed to brighten to -5 magnitude but neither flare was quite as bright as Venus.  Could the reflecting surfaces on this satellite be misaligned?  This is a great website!  http://heavens-above.com/ Posted by kg</DIV> Hmm, interesting. I've never seen that in the hudreds I've observed. I have seen the brightness be off a little but, but never a double flare. Perhaps it crossed a contrail in the sky, which dimmed it in between?The antenna can't be misaligned or there wouldn't be a flare at all. The spot on the earth's surface is very small (especially for ones high in the sky. And your position needs to be very precise; for example, last night's for me was Mag -3, while the center at -8 mag was only 14 km (8 miles) away. That's a huge difference in brightness (58 times brighter) in a very short distance. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

weeman · Feb 11, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Hmm, interesting. I've never seen that in the hudreds I've observed. I have seen the brightness be off a little but, but never a double flare. Perhaps it crossed a contrail in the sky, which dimmed it in between?The antenna can't be misaligned or there wouldn't be a flare at all. The spot on the earth's surface is very small (especially for ones high in the sky. And your position needs to be very precise; for example, last night's for me was Mag -3, while the center at -8 mag was only 14 km (8 miles) away. That's a huge difference in brightness (58 times brighter) in a very short distance. Posted by MeteorWayne</DIV> Interesting, I don't think I have ever seen one of these flares. That is unless I have and just didn't know what I was looking at. Any advice on viewing these events in Colorado, Wayne? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Techies: We do it in the dark. "Put your hand on a stove for a minute and it seems like an hour. Sit with that special girl for an hour and it seems like a minute. That's relativity." -Albert Einstein </div>

kg · Feb 11, 2009

Whoops http://www.wkrg.com/science/article/u.s._and_russian_satellites_collide/23538/

Archer17 · Feb 11, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Interesting, I don't think I have ever seen one of these flares. That is unless I have and just didn't know what I was looking at. Any advice on viewing these events in Colorado, Wayne? Posted by weeman</DIV>Not to steal MW's thunder...Like kg I use info gleaned from the excellent Heavens-Above site (http://www.heavens-above.com/) and have managed to log a lot of Iridium flares over the years. Like MW said, the magnitude varies depending on where you are in relation to the satellite. Some are quite impressive. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

Archer17 · Feb 11, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Whoopshttp://www.wkrg.com/science/article/u.s._and_russian_satellites_collide/23538/ Posted by kg</DIV>That reminds me... remember that satellite the Chinese destroyed a couple years ago? Is there any chance the debris from that will impact satellites at some point? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

kg · Feb 11, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>That reminds me... remember that satellite the Chinese destroyed a couple years ago? Is there any chance the debris from that will impact satellites at some point? Posted by archer17</DIV>I don't know.  I think that satellite was in a lower orbit than the Eridium satellites so the debris might have been brought down quickly by the atmosphere?  Does anyone know about this recent collision?

MeteorWayne · Feb 12, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>I don't know.  I think that satellite was in a lower orbit than the Eridium satellites so the debris might have been brought down quickly by the atmosphere?  Does anyone know about this recent collision? Posted by kg</DIV> There's a thread in Missions and Launches. Also there's a story on the Space.Com front page. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

MeteorWayne · Feb 12, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Interesting, I don't think I have ever seen one of these flares. That is unless I have and just didn't know what I was looking at. Any advice on viewing these events in Colorado, Wayne? Posted by weeman</DIV> As archer17 said, the Heavens-Above page is the place to check out predictions.The following thigs are important. You must select your location as precisely as possible. Since they have added the capability to pick it from a google map, I recomment that. For all other satellites the exact location is not critical, but for Iridiums it is. A distance error of only 6 miles can make a 60 times (5 magnitude) difference in the brightness of the flare intensity. That means if you select a large city, one side may barely see the flare, the other may see somthing 20 times brighter than Venus!Also, time is critical as well. While the satellite may be visible longer (particularly with binoculars) the bright flare only lasts 10 or 15 seconds. So if your watch is off by a minute, guess what, you missed it! There is a "What Time Is It Now?" link at the bottom of the Heaves Above page if you have no other accurate time source.So go here:http://heavens-above.com/Under configuration, click of select from map and find your exact location and mark it.Once you have done that, Bookmark of Favorite the page. That way, when you open it in the future, your location will already be in there. Saves bunches of timeThen Under Satellites, you can click on Iridium Flares for the next 24 hours or 7 days.There are also full time links for the ISS, Genesis 1 and 2, Envisat, and HST. (And the Shuttle when it is up)You can also get a list of: Daily predictions for all satellites brighter than magnitude: 3.5 (good to start with, or in a bright environment) or including all to mag +4.5, (good for dark skies).Good luck!After you've seen a -8 magnitude Iridium flare, you'll never forget it!! Under Configuration <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

MeteorWayne · Feb 12, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Whoopshttp://www.wkrg.com/science/article/u.s._and_russian_satellites_collide/23538/ Posted by kg</DIV> Yes indeed. If you see Iridium 33 listed on your Heaven's above printout, don't bother to look for it

<div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

kg · Feb 12, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Yes indeed. If you see Iridium 33 listed on your Heaven's above printout, don't bother to look for it

Posted by MeteorWayne</DIV> Is there any possibility of seeing any debris where and when Iridium 33 was supposed to appear?  Or would the debris cloud take a completely different trajectory?

MeteorWayne · Feb 13, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Is there any possibility of seeing any debris where and when Iridium 33 was supposed to appear?  Or would the debris cloud take a completely different trajectory?  Posted by kg</DIV> When not flaring, Iridiums are quite faint; I usually see them at about mag +5 on the best (overhead passes). This is based on ones I've seen during my meteor sessions. Since it has broken up, the pieces would be smaller, hence even fainter. And of course by now, the pieces would have spead out in space and time, so will be even harder to spot. I suppose it might be worth a try if you have a good pass.If you want to try on the H-A page, use the "Select a satellite" link.Enter US SPacecomm ID 24946It will come up with a screen showing an Iridium 33 link; click on that.I have no visible passes upcoming here in NJ. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

MeteorWayne · Feb 16, 2009

Three Iridium notes:First, I saw a failed flare this morning. It was supposed to be a -3 magnitude flare from Iridium 39. I saw the satellite at the appointed time and position (through binoculars), but it never flared. It never got brighter than about magnitude +5. This implies that the antennas were not properly aligned; i.e. the orientation of the satellite is not currently under control. I'd be interested in any reports of predicted flares from Iridium 39.Second, the Iridiums in each plane go by about every 9 minutes at the same location. If you look at the same spot 9 minutes before and after the listed time, you may see the preceding or following Iridiums, though they will not be of flare brightness. You might need binoculars. Still, flares are only listed at mag zero and above, so a 1st or 2nd magnitude flare might be easily visible and not be listed. Occasionally, two flares will occur from satellites 9 minutes apart; for example tomorrow morning I have flares listed from 2 satellites in the same plane at 6:06 and 6:15 AM.Finally, if you look at the listed flares for your location, you will note that there are series over a period of a number of days at roughly the same time and the same location in the sky. For example, for me right now, I have a series at about 4:50 AM 25 degrees due north, another around 5:45 AM about 35 degrees above the SSE horizon, another around 6:30 AM low (~ 15 degrees) in the ENE, and another around 6 PM very high (~ 65 degrees) in the NNE. On the days in between those listed, there also might be dimmer flares at roughly the same time and places in the sky. This is because the flares are caused by a particular alignment of the sun and your location on the earth's surface, with the Iridium antennas acting as reflectors. So it can be kind of fun to look at the same spot and time on non listed days, as well as 9 minutes before and after the listed flares.Wayne <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

kg · Feb 16, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>I saw the satellite at the appointed time and position (through binoculars), but it never flared. It never got brighter than about magnitude +5. This implies that the antennas were not properly aligned; i.e. the orientation of the satellite is not currently under control. Wayne Posted by MeteorWayne</DIV> I can't seem to find a picture or illustration of one of these Iridium satellites.  The sun is reflecting off it's antenna and not it's solar panel?

MeteorWayne · Feb 16, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>I can't seem to find a picture or illustration of one of these Iridium satellites.  The sun is reflecting off it's antenna and not it's solar panel? Posted by kg</DIV> That is correct. The Antennae (there are 3, 120 degrees apart) are perfectly flat, door sized Aluminized (or maybe gold? for thermal control) panels. <img src="http://sitelife.space.com/ver1.0/Content/images/store/11/11/bb25ce2f-68ed-4bf0-abcd-2ad3566e4031.Medium.jpg" alt="" />This image shows the actual orietation in the sky (earth down) <img src="http://sitelife.space.com/ver1.0/Content/images/store/4/0/84c982c1-5fef-46e9-80c5-9918808239d6.Medium.jpg" alt="" />http://www.satobs.org/iridium.html <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

What is that in the sky?

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