Europa Orbiter

[yurkin]

Europa Geophysical Explorer Mission Concept<br /><br />The reason the last Europa Orbiter never made it off the pad was that it was estimated to cost at least a billion. This isn’t what they had in mind for the low cost mission. The Europa Orbiter is a flag ship class mission on same level as Galileo and Cassini. Its not Jimo but still very cool.<br />

 

[chebby]

I think the next mission should carry like 3 or 4 of almost identical orbiters to be put in orbit around Europa, Titan and other interesting moons. That would be more cost effective than doing them separately.

 

[vogon13]

Prometheus, in my view, should have been proposed as a carrier craft. JPL keeps building better and better probes and orbiters, and the Prometheus craft delivers them to their target, then returns to earth for a refuel and another JPL blue plate special.<br /><br />Might want to put a garage on the ISS.<br /><br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#ff0000"><strong>TPTB went to Dallas and all I got was Plucked !!</strong></font></p><p><font color="#339966"><strong>So many people, so few recipes !!</strong></font></p><p><font color="#0000ff"><strong>Let's clean up this stinkhole !!</strong></font> </p> </div>

 

[henryhallam]

<font color="yellow"><br />Prometheus, in my view, should have been proposed as a carrier craft. JPL keeps building better and better probes and orbiters, and the Prometheus craft delivers them to their target, then returns to earth for a refuel and another JPL blue plate special.<br /></font><br /><br />Breaking Jupiter orbit is very very expensive in dV, even for a nuclear-electric spacecraft! And refueling is a hassle on a hot core, replenishing the ion drive propellant might be doable though (and just have one reactor core contain enough fuel for several missions)<br /><br /><font color="yellow"><br />I think the next mission should carry like 3 or 4 of almost identical orbiters to be put in orbit around Europa, Titan and other interesting moons. That would be more cost effective than doing them separately.<br /></font><br /><br />Titan and Europa are around different planets <img src="/images/icons/wink.gif" /> I can see the utility in launching several Jovian moon orbiters on one carrier bus to Jupiter but even with a SDHLV the limiting factor will be how much you can get into Earth orbit.. the more orbiters you have, the smaller each will have to be.

 

[chebby]

<font color="yellow">Titan and Europa are around different planets</font> <br />I know that Henry, but didn't Cassini first orbited Jupiter for a while and then went off to orbit Saturn? Or it just passed by Jupiter?

 

[chew_on_this]

It passed by

 

[najab]

><i>Or it just passed by Jupiter?</i><p>It just passed on by.</p>

 

[mikejz]

I think a Titan Mission would be a prime place to test aerocapture. Forget all that heavy fuel! <br /><br />

 

[yurkin]

The problem with that is JPL doesn’t have the capacity to build and operate 3 flagship class missions simultaneously. <br /><br />JIMO exceeded the world’s production of Xenon gas by over a year. The Europa Orbiter is a huge scale back from this mission but its still an enormous mission and more importantly its do able. And I can’t think of a better place then Europa to send it.

 

[mikejz]

I wonder if this is going to demo Nasa's new zero boil-off cryo tanks? Seems like using LH2 would help get a greater useful payload.

 

[chebby]

thanx<br /><br /><font color="yellow">Breaking Jupiter orbit is very very expensive in dV</font><br /><br />but what about using gravity assist to break the jupiter orbit (like dive in from the orbit and just miss the planet while picking up speed?) Sorry if it is a stupid question, I don't know much about orbital mechanics. But I was able to do it pretty well using Kevin the SpacePinguin game <img src="/images/icons/cool.gif" />

 

[mrmorris]

<font color="yellow">"...gravity assist to break the jupiter orbit..."</font><br /><br />Once you've been captured into Jupiter orbit, you can no longer use its gravity to alter your velocity with respect to it. It's possible to use the gravity of the moons of Jupiter to alter the spacecraft's velocity -- but that's not going to make a massive difference in escaping Jupiter's gravity well.

 

[tom_hobbes]

Wouldn't it be possible to separate a small probe before Jupiter (as the rest flies on to Titan) with enough fuel to put itself into Jupiter orbit, then Europa, or would it already be flying way too fast by the time it reaches the Jovian system?<br /><br />Pardon my ignorance. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font size="2" color="#339966"> I wish I could remember<br /> But my selective memory<br /> Won't let me</font><font size="2" color="#99cc00"> </font><font size="3" color="#339966"><font size="2">- </font></font><font size="1" color="#339966">Mark Oliver Everett</font></p><p> </p> </div>

 

[mikejz]

Well the issue is not whether it can be done (it can) the question is what advantage does it pose in terms or cost/risk? Afterall a probe that can put itself into orbit or into Europa orbit can just as well get there in the first place.

 

[tom_hobbes]

True. So there's no advantage? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font size="2" color="#339966"> I wish I could remember<br /> But my selective memory<br /> Won't let me</font><font size="2" color="#99cc00"> </font><font size="3" color="#339966"><font size="2">- </font></font><font size="1" color="#339966">Mark Oliver Everett</font></p><p> </p> </div>

 

[mikejz]

Maybe it was a cheap piggyback/low mass mission, (maybe a flyby, atmospheric probe, or aerocapture demo) but for a real big mission, I think its not needed. <br /><br />I could see maybe see one example of a rapid imager mission, filled with a few high rez cameras and a ton of memory. It flies by a few moons snaping tons and tons of images. and then does a gavity assist to bring it back towards the sun where it will stream the data back to earth.

 

[tom_hobbes]

I see your point. On the whole the advantages diminish rapidly as the mass of any piggy back mission increases. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font size="2" color="#339966"> I wish I could remember<br /> But my selective memory<br /> Won't let me</font><font size="2" color="#99cc00"> </font><font size="3" color="#339966"><font size="2">- </font></font><font size="1" color="#339966">Mark Oliver Everett</font></p><p> </p> </div>