Lunokhod

JonClarke · Nov 30, 2008

There is a very interesting documentary on YouTube about these extraordinary missions. Not only were they the first robot rovers, they are stil the largest and most complex rovers ever sent off Earth, nd Lunokhod 2's 37 km traverse is unlike to be exeeded for many years.  The breathless American-accented (and centric) commentary is annoying in places, but there is a lot of stuff I have never seen before and some great interviews with some of the key players..  There is lots of footage of Russian robotics, including some of the PROT-M legged Mars rover(not credited, it is the little one with two flat feet just before the odd bipedal robot with the tail wheel.  Interestingly enough all the early work was done by military vehicle designers, not aerospace engineers, people with practical experience of building vehicles that could cross rough, uncertain terrain. What is also interesting is the very high level of training given to the operator crews, something we have not seen with the MERs.  .Finally, the end of the mission is attributed to the end of the Po210 heater’s effectiveness (half life 138 days).An interesting postscript was that the Lunokhod team built, at short notice, a six wheeled machine to investigate the Chernobyl site, they did this in less than 3 months.There is some footage of the Marsokhod that was taken to the US for trials in Death Valley as well Part 1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9K0_p2R13_8&feature=related Part 2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RG5ErrCR60k&feature=related  Part 3 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yDWuoO-tjIw&feature=related  Part 4 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SrayutWAwf4&feature=related  Part 5 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDXOfYgVaD0&feature=related   <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars Arthur Clarke </div>

silylene · Nov 30, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>There is a very interesting documentary on YouTube about these extraordinary missions.Not only were they the first robot rovers, they are stil the largest and most complex rovers ever sent off Earth, nd Lunokhod 2's 37 m traverse is unlike to be exeeded for many years.  The breathless American-accented (and centric) commentary is annoying in places, but there is a lot of stuff I have never seen before and some great interviews with some of the key players..  There is lots of footage of Russian robotics, including some of the PROT-M legged Mars rover(not credited, it is the little one with two flat feet just before the odd bipedal robot with the tail wheel.  Interestingly enough all the early work was done by military vehicle designers, not aerospace engineers, people with practical experience of building vehicles that could cross rough, uncertain terrain. What is also interesting is the very high level of training given to the operator crews, something we have not seen with the MERs.  It does explain Vadim Gushin’s comment that we should consider experience with the Lunokhods in our work, something I did not fully understand at the time.Finally, the end of the mission is attributed to the end of the Po210 heater’s effectiveness (half life 138 days).An interesting postscript was that the Lunokhod team built, at short notice, a six wheeled machine to investigate the Chernobyl site, they did this in less than 3 months.There is some footage of the Marsokhod that was taken to the US for trials in Death Valley as well Part 1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9K0_p2R13_8&feature=relatedPart 2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RG5ErrCR60k&feature=relatedPart 3 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yDWuoO-tjIw&feature=relatedPart 4 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SrayutWAwf4&feature=relatedPart 5 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDXOfYgVaD0&feature=related Posted by jonclarke</DIV> Jon, these are really good.  Thanks for posting. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> petet = silylenePlease, please give me my handle back ! </div>

Slava33 · Dec 1, 2008

It was a great Science channel documentary.  Some of the early prototypes they showed were hilarious!  And the final product was pretty cute (in a take me to your leader kinda way).Zuke696 has a lot of good stuff on his feed.  May be in a copyright gray area, but it's documentaries, not blockbusters, it's more of a public service.This NOVA "Sputnik declassified" program broadcast recently had a lot of interesting never-released-before stuff as well. I was wandering if any one knows of a good repository for these documentaries about the space program?  Paid or not. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

JonClarke · Dec 1, 2008

I really liked how the design was driven by the practical requirements of the mission, rather than what seems to happen with some western projects which where the robotics drive what can be done.  I know design is a two way, but there does seem to be a difference in approach as to what is in the driving seat, as it were.  The amount of testing and innovation that went into the Lunakhods is most impressive.  Anyone who still thinks there was anything half-arsed about the Russian space program after watching this is, I suspect, irredeemably prejudiced. Their payload was very large. Lunokhod 1 carried: <ul><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm0cm0pt;tab-stops:list36.0pt">Six cameras (two TV & four panoramic) </li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm0cm0pt;tab-stops:list36.0pt">RIFMA X-ray fluorescence spectrometer </li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm0cm0pt;tab-stops:list36.0pt">RT-1 X-ray telescope </li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm0cm0pt;tab-stops:list36.0pt">PrOP odometer/penetrometer </li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm0cm0pt;tab-stops:list36.0pt">RV-2N radiation detector </li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm0cm0pt;tab-stops:list36.0pt">TL laser retroreflector </li></ul> Lunokhod 2 carried an even larger payload:  <ul style="margin-top:0cm"><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm0cm0pt;tab-stops:list36.0pt">Seven cameras (three TV & four panoramic) </li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm0cm0pt;tab-stops:list36.0pt">RIFMA-M X-ray fluorescence spectrometer </li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm0cm0pt;tab-stops:list36.0pt">X-ray telescope </li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm0cm0pt;tab-stops:list36.0pt">PROP odometer/penetrometer </li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm0cm0pt;tab-stops:list36.0pt">RV-2N-LS radiation detector </li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm0cm0pt;tab-stops:list36.0pt">TL laser retroreflector </li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm0cm0pt;tab-stops:list36.0pt">AF-3L UV/visible astrophotometer </li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm0cm0pt;tab-stops:list36.0pt">SG-70A magnetometer </li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm0cm0pt;tab-stops:list36.0pt">Rubin 1 photodetector </li></ul> All this on a mass of 840 kg for Lunokhod 1 (Lunokhod 2 probably massed a bit more, because of its larger payload). The Lunokhods stack up very well, payload wise, even now.  For comparison MSL will mass 900kg and will carry:  <ul style="margin-top:0cm"><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm0cm0pt;tab-stops:list36.0pt">Seven cameras (MastCam, MAHLI, MARDI, two pairs of HazCams)</li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm0cm0pt;tab-stops:list36.0pt">ChemCam</li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm0cm0pt;tab-stops:list36.0pt">Alpha-particle X-ray spectrometer (APXS)</li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm0cm0pt;tab-stops:list36.0pt">CheMin</li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm0cm0pt;tab-stops:list36.0pt">Sample Analysis at Mars (SAM)</li></ul>·         Quadrupole Mass Spectrometer (QMS) ·         Gas Chromatograph (GC) ·         Laser Spectrometer (TLS) <ul style="margin-top:0cm"><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm0cm0pt;tab-stops:list36.0pt">Radiation Assessment Detector (RAD)</li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm0cm0pt;tab-stops:list36.0pt">Dynamic Albedo of Neutrons (DAN)</li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm0cm0pt;tab-stops:list36.0pt">Rover Environmental Monitoring Station (REMS)</li></ul>·         Meteorological package (pressure, humidity, wind currents and direction, air and ground temperature)·         Ultraviolet sensor   The main advance in 40 years is autonomy.  The Lunokhods were completely teloperated, whereas MSL with have a much higher level of agency, as it has to, working on Mars. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars Arthur Clarke </div>

MarkStanaway · Dec 1, 2008

Hi Jon, Thanks for posting that link. It was REALLY interesting. Thats the first time I have seen some film of the develpoment effort that went on behind Lunokhod. You might be interested in this explanation of what caused the demise of Lunokhod 2: 'Lunokhod 2 was targeted to land at Le Monier crater, a transitional zone between lunar mare (seas) and highland continental country in early 1973. This was only 150 km from the Taurus Littrow valley which had just been visited by the final Apollo 17 mission the previous December. Lunokhod 2 weighed 850 Kg, more than 100 Kg heavier than its predecessor reflecting the improvements that had been incorporated since the previous mission. It had two speeds, could traverse steeper slopes and larger holes, had twice the range, and TV pictures were now transmitted every 3.2 secs with the cameras mounted higher a great improvement for the drivers. It also carried extra scientific experiments. The rover carried out a close inspection of its landing stage and craters in the immediate vicinity before closing its lid and shutting down at the end of the first lunar day. The rover continued its exploration for the next three months when quite suddenly Radio Moscow announced that its programme had been completed! No further explanation was offered for the seemingly premature demise of the rover. It was only 30 years later that an explanation was offered. It seems the drivers had gone down into a particularly steep crater and as they tried to exit it the lid had scraped the side of the crater depositing lunar soil on the solar cells. The effects were not immediately obvious with only some loss of electrical power but when the lid was closed for the night soil was dumped onto the radiators which control temperatures in the pressurised section. When the lid was opened the following day the radiators could not function and quickly rising temperatures caused Lunokhod 2 to expire.' Here is what happened after the first launch attempt in Feb 1969 when the pressure was on to upstage Apollo.  'The first attempt to launch a Lunokhod was aborted in February 1969 when the UR 500 Proton launch vehicle failed when excessive vibration tore off the launch shroud and the rocket exploded scattering debris 15 km downrange. For months afterwards, teams tried to recover the Polonium nuclear isotope intended to keep instrumentation in the Lunokhod pressurised container warm during the lunar night. It later transpired that some insufficiently briefed local troops had found the container and were using it to keep their hut warm during a particularly cold winter! This failure was the start of an incredibly unlucky string of disasters which afflicted the Soviet moon programme at a time when they were trying to upstage the American Apollo programme during the first half of 1969. Mark <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

JonClarke · Dec 1, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Hi Jon, Thanks for posting that link. It was REALLY interesting. Thats the first time I have seen some film of the develpoment effort that went on behind Lunokhod. You might be interested in this explanation of what caused the demise of Lunokhod 2: 'Lunokhod 2 was targeted to land at Le Monier crater, a transitional zone between lunar mare (seas) and highland continental country in early 1973. This was only 150 km from the Taurus Littrow valley which had just been visited by the final Apollo 17 mission the previous December. Lunokhod 2 weighed 850 Kg, more than 100 Kg heavier than its predecessor reflecting the improvements that had been incorporated since the previous mission. It had two speeds, could traverse steeper slopes and larger holes, had twice the range, and TV pictures were now transmitted every 3.2 secs with the cameras mounted higher a great improvement for the drivers. It also carried extra scientific experiments. The rover carried out a close inspection of its landing stage and craters in the immediate vicinity before closing its lid and shutting down at the end of the first lunar day. The rover continued its exploration for the next three months when quite suddenly Radio Moscow announced that its programme had been completed! No further explanation was offered for the seemingly premature demise of the rover. It was only 30 years later that an explanation was offered. It seems the drivers had gone down into a particularly steep crater and as they tried to exit it the lid had scraped the side of the crater depositing lunar soil on the solar cells. The effects were not immediately obvious with only some loss of electrical power but when the lid was closed for the night soil was dumped onto the radiators which control temperatures in the pressurised section. When the lid was opened the following day the radiators could not function and quickly rising temperatures caused Lunokhod 2 to expire.' Here is what happened after the first launch attempt in Feb 1969 when the pressure was on to upstage Apollo.  'The first attempt to launch a Lunokhod was aborted in February 1969 when the UR 500 Proton launch vehicle failed when excessive vibration tore off the launch shroud and the rocket exploded scattering debris 15 km downrange. For months afterwards, teams tried to recover the Polonium nuclear isotope intended to keep instrumentation in the Lunokhod pressurised container warm during the lunar night. It later transpired that some insufficiently briefed local troops had found the container and were using it to keep their hut warm during a particularly cold winter! This failure was the start of an incredibly unlucky string of disasters which afflicted the Soviet moon programme at a time when they were trying to upstage the American Apollo programme during the first half of 1969. Mark Posted by MarkStanaway</DIV>Thanks Mark.  What is your source for both those stories?  Had Lunokhod 2 lasted as long as Lunokhod 1 it might have covered 100 km! It is a pity that Lunokhod 3 did not go to the Moon.  With the experience gained from te other missions it would surely have surpassed them.One tit bit from the documentary was that the actually flight articles differented from thepictures and models in one significant detail.  It was swathed in thermal blankets, givit it the same padded appearance we see with Soyuz. Tou can glimpse this in the brief shot of an operational Lunokhod being loaded onto the descent stage.Jon <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars Arthur Clarke </div>

MarkStanaway · Dec 1, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Thanks Mark.  What is your source for both those stories?  Had Lunokhod 2 lasted as long as Lunokhod 1 it might have covered 100 km! It is a pity that Lunokhod 3 did not go to the Moon.  With the experience gained from te other missions it would surely have surpassed them.One tit bit from the documentary was that the actually flight articles differented from thepictures and models in one significant detail.  It was swathed in thermal blankets, givit it the same padded appearance we see with Soyuz. Tou can glimpse this in the brief shot of an operational Lunokhod being loaded onto the descent stage.Jon Posted by jonclarke</DIV>Hi Jon,The main source was 'Soviet and Lunar Exploration' by Brian Harvey published by Springer/Praxis books 2007.pp 264-272. A great read which I thoroughly recommend.I used this and other sources for a quiz which can be found at: http://www.funtrivia.com/trivia-quiz/History/Lunokhod-Moon-Rover-273348.html <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

JonClarke · Dec 1, 2008

Thanks mark, I will look for that.Does the book explain why the laser reflector of Lunokhod 1 has not yet been found? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars Arthur Clarke </div>

MarkStanaway · Dec 2, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Thanks mark, I will look for that.Does the book explain why the laser reflector of Lunokhod 1 has not yet been found? Posted by jonclarke</DIV>The only mention of using the laser reflector was during the first lunar night in December when signals were flashed from the French observatory at Pic du Midi and the Semeis observatory in Crimea. They struck the 14 cubes of the reflector and bounced back reportedly measuring the earth moon distance to within 18cm. Presumably when the power source gave out the following October Lunokhod was at an unsuitable angle for the reflector to be used.The laser reflector on Lunokhod 2 (supplied by France) was fired 4000 times with and accuracy of 25 cm. Earlier in August Scott, Irwin and Worden in Apollo 15 flew over Lunokkhod 1 and reported its aluminuim alloy frame glinting inh the sun as it plodded across the lunar landscape.The final record was that it had travelled 10.5 km, sent back 20,000 pictures including 200 panoramas and X rayed the soil at 25 locations. It was later revealed that the braking system had failed in the 'on' position quite early on and it was driving against the fiction of its brakes for much of its mission, a real testament to its rugged design. The driving team and scientists were exhausted after 10 months working for  10 hour shifts 14 lunar days at a time punctuated by short breaks of 3 days at lunar noon when the landscape was washed out for driving.The title of the book should read 'Soviet and Russian Lunar Exploration'.Mark  <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

JonClarke · Dec 2, 2008

I hd not realised that the Apollo 15 crew had seen it.  Very cool!It must have parked at a realy odd angle - corner reflectorsd are supposedto reflect fromalmost any angle. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars Arthur Clarke </div>

MarkStanaway · Dec 2, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>It must have parked at a realy odd angle - corner reflectorsd are supposedto reflect fromalmost any angle. Posted by jonclarke</DIV>  That was just my speculation. It could also have been that when the power suddenly gave out they did not an accurate fix on its position. At the time it was exploring a group of four craters north of the landing site when telementry reported a rapid loss of pressure in the hermetically sealed cabin. The wheels just stopped turning (implying they were driving at the time) and the TV signals ceased.Mark <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

JonClarke · Dec 3, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'> That was just my speculation. It could also have been that when the power suddenly gave out they did not an accurate fix on its position. At the time it was exploring a group of four craters north of the landing site when telementry reported a rapid loss of pressure in the hermetically sealed cabin. The wheels just stopped turning (implying they were driving at the time) and the TV signals ceased.Mark Posted by MarkStanaway</DIV>That sounds like a sudden pressurisation failure was the cause of the mission end.  This does not jibe this the documentary that it the decay of the Po210 heater that led to the mission end.  I wonder which version is correct? Jon <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars Arthur Clarke </div>

MarkStanaway · Dec 3, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>That sounds like a sudden pressurisation faolire was the cause of the mission end.  This does not jibe this the documentary that it the decay of the Po210 heater that led to the mission end.  I wonder which version is correct? Jon Posted by jonclarke</DIV>It was fairly obvious toward the end of the mission that the power was running down. The distance travelled in June was 1559m July 220m August 215m and September 88m. Loss of signal occurred  on 4 Oct 1971There was a real conflict of priorities with this mission as the official Soviet mouthpiece Pravda kept pressuring Georgi Babakin (mission director) on 'How many kilometres did we do today?'. When  principal science director Alexander Basilevsky wanted to stop and investigate a particularly interesting rock that the drive team was diligently trying to avoid  he had to be gently reminded that this was a Lunokhod not a Lunostop!I agree that that laser reflector shuold work at whatever angle Lunokhod ceased its mission.For the record Luna 17's landing site (Lunokhod 1's landing stage) is 38.26 N 35 W. Maybe if you aim a laser beam 1559m NNE of this position in the vicinity of four small craters you may be able to pick up Lunokhod 1 with some sort of grid search. Of course the prisims may just be covered with dust which may be an explanation of why no signof Lunokhod has been found. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

JonClarke · Dec 3, 2008

I really must get the book.  Decay of the Po210 heat source would not mainfest itself in lost of power, but loss of heat over the lunar night.  Loss of power suggests that the cells were degrading, or maybe their connections, which cells often did in those days.Eleven months wrorking on the extremely hostile Moon was quite an achievement, especially in an era when Russian spacecraft were not noted for long operating lives. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars Arthur Clarke </div>

MarkStanaway · Dec 8, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>I really must get the book.  Decay of the Po210 heat source would not mainfest itself in lost of power, but loss of heat over the lunar night.  Loss of power suggests that the cells were degrading, or maybe their connections, which cells often did in those days.Eleven months wrorking on the extremely hostile Moon was quite an achievement, especially in an era when Russian spacecraft were not noted for long operating lives. Posted by jonclarke</DIV>I have been doing some more reading and came across this explanation for the power failure on Lunokhod 1'One of the principal architects of the mission Deputy Chief Designer Ivanovskiy later recalled that the rover's internal batteries had been designed for only a certain number of cycles of charging and recharging equivalent to three months. After exceeding their design lifetimes by almost eight months the batteries simply gave up'.The explaination goes on to say: 'Before losing contact the controllers managed to park the rover so that the laser reflectors remained in a usable position'.  Source: 'The Soviet Space Race with Apollo' by Asif Siddiqi pp 741-742. University Press of Florida 2000 <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

JonClarke · Dec 8, 2008

That is interesting Mark, as nobody has been able to find the Lunokhod 1 rover in its final position.  That suggests that it is somewhere different to where people think it is. Jon <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars Arthur Clarke </div>

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