Question Make SpaceX starship with removable passenger sections.

[MoonlightRistow]

Hi, After watching and listening to a lot of talks about colonizing Mars it seems like a good idea to make passenger sections removable to leave behind. Basically you go in your cabin you keep that cabin. Less strain for fuel to return to Earth and more resources for Mars. Plus each passengers waste materials, as these can have some use on Mars. And each passenger should take with them about their own body weight in seeds of food they eat on Earth. Will help keep them healthy to eat the food and liquids their body has become accustomed to. And each cabin have about 1 inch of water circulating around these removable cabins. Helps absorb radiation and reusable for drinking and recycle from washing and toilet. You even leave the ultra steel section behind. Metal would be major commodity or even be part of one of your burrowing tunnellers. Which could lead to a future hyperlink to the poles.

 

[MoonlightRistow]

Another thing I saw recently was making nuclear waste into diamond batteries. Last thousands of years will constant full charge. Invaluable asset for Mars. And a great way to get rid of nuclear waste.

 

[Mental Avenger]

Hi, After watching and listening to a lot of talks about colonizing Mars it seems like a good idea to make passenger sections removable to leave behind. Basically you go in your cabin you keep that cabin. Less strain for fuel to return to Earth and more resources for Mars. Plus each passengers waste materials, as these can have some use on Mars. And each passenger should take with them about their own body weight in seeds of food they eat on Earth. Will help keep them healthy to eat the food and liquids their body has become accustomed to. And each cabin have about 1 inch of water circulating around these removable cabins. Helps absorb radiation and reusable for drinking and recycle from washing and toilet. You even leave the ultra steel section behind. Metal would be major commodity or even be part of one of your burrowing tunnellers. Which could lead to a future hyperlink to the poles.

I do not see a need for any return trips back to Earth, not for a long time. Also, a spacecraft able to land on Mars and take off again would be more complex and necessarily be more massive than one designed to just land. Sending a spacecraft back to Earth would be a waste of time, materials, and fuel. Anything sent there should stay there. I propose initially sending robotic supply ships via the economy route and land them at the site that is chosen. The robotic supply vessel hulls can be pre-fitted with electrical wiring, plumbing, and other hardware and fixtures so they can be used as habitats when emptied. Also, robotic supply ships could carry significantly more supplies because they would not require any of the living space, environmental systems, living supplies, or shielding needed for passengers. Enough supply vessels should be sent to ensure sufficient habitats and supplies for the proposed colony size, and for at least 5 years. Then, colonists could be sent in large passenger vessels, one way.

Perhaps in 50 or 75 years it may be practical to have ships capable of return to Earth.

 

[ChrisA]

In the real world, the mission has to be affordable. NASA's plan that seems to be shaping up is to place a small space station in orbit around Mars. about four astronauts live there and make a trip to the surface of Mars that last up to about 3 or 4 days than return to the station. They might be able to visit multiple locations this way. While in the station that can manage several robots that stay on the surface. This way the lander can be smaller and only needs to lander with a few days of supplies.

The station would house astronauts for a few months then they return to Earth. In a few years, a new crew is launched.

The SpaceX Starship could have a role to play as quite a lot of bulk cargo and fuel needs to be sent ahead to the station. And landers and robots need to be sent to Mars as well.
But landing a starship on Mars means it is stuck there on Mars forever until someone finds a way to build a chemical plant that can make 100 tons of fuel that is needed to launch the Starship back to space. This chemical plant would be HUGE and would need acres of solar panels and a large tank farm. Clearly the first Starships to land on Mars will never take off again. Not until that rocket fuel factory is build and operational.

So,.. the first mission to Mars will not land the Starships. They will be used to move cargo to the station. Or maybe to move the station itself to Mars.

They are never going o send 100 people to Mars in that ship. Do the math. Each person and all the food, water and clothing and other supplies plus 1% of the life support system has to fit inside 10 cubic meters. The passenger and all the supplies for a two-year mission plus the stuff needed on Mars (spacesuits and other gear) all in a 2.15-meter cube.

Think about you, a spacesuit a two year supply of food and water and your share of toilet and shower and cooking space. all packed into 2.15 meter cube for over two years You would not be able to move. I'd say six astronauts at most.

 

[Mental Avenger]

In the real world, the mission has to be affordable. NASA's plan that seems to be shaping up is to place a small space station in orbit around Mars. about four astronauts live there and make a trip to the surface of Mars that last up to about 3 or 4 days than return to the station. They might be able to visit multiple locations this way. While in the station that can manage several robots that stay on the surface. This way the lander can be smaller and only needs to lander with a few days of supplies.
The station would house astronauts for a few months then they return to Earth. In a few years, a new crew is launched.

That plan is a waste of time and resources. It does not accomplish anything that warrants the expense. Such a space station would be small and cramped. The astronauts would have to spend over a year total in weightlessness with the possible exception of one short trip to the surface. Trips to the surface and back would require a great deal of fuel. The scouting of the surface can be done by large rovers designed for testing areas and moving on. It would remain.

The SpaceX Starship could have a role to play as quite a lot of bulk cargo and fuel needs to be sent ahead to the station. And landers and robots need to be sent to Mars as well.
But landing a starship on Mars means it is stuck there on Mars forever until someone finds a way to build a chemical plant that can make 100 tons of fuel that is needed to launch the Starship back to space. This chemical plant would be HUGE and would need acres of solar panels and a large tank farm. Clearly the first Starships to land on Mars will never take off again. Not until that rocket fuel factory is build and operational.

As pointed out, Robotic supply ships can land on Mars full of supplies and be used as habitats. It will be a very long time before there is anything produced on Mars worth sending back to Earth in a spacecraft. Intellectual property can be sent by radio.

So,.. the first mission to Mars will not land the Starships. They will be used to move cargo to the station. Or maybe to move the station itself to Mars.

There is no way they could send an orbital space station large enough to store significant amounts of supplies, and there is no point in doing so. Since the supplies need to be sent to the surface, send them down as they arrive.

They are never going o send 100 people to Mars in that ship. Do the math. Each person and all the food, water and clothing and other supplies plus 1% of the life support system has to fit inside 10 cubic meters. All the supplies for a two-year mission plus the stuff needed on Mars (spacesuits and other gear) all in a 2.15-meter cube.

Of course a spacecraft for colonists would be SpaceX Starship Super Heavy, or a convoy of 2-3 SpaceX Starship could be sent together. “as envisioned in the 2017 design unveiling, the Starship is to have a pressurized volume of approximately 1,000 m3 (35,000 cu ft), which could be configured for up to 40 cabins, large common areas, central storage, a galley, and a solar flare shelter for Mars missions plus 12 unpressurized aft cargo containers of 88 m3 (3,100 cu ft) total.“
(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SpaceX_Starship)
Supplies for use on Mars would be sent ahead of time. Also, since it would be a one way trip, the colony transport ship(s) would only need supplies and life support for 6 months, not two years.
Do the math.

Think about you, a spacesuit a two year supply of food and water and toilet and shower and cooking space. You would not be able to move. I'd say six astronauts at most.

Again, a one way trip with supplies only for the trip to Mars, would allow a LOT more room for passengers.
Any round trip missions would waste huge amounts of money and resources. With limited funding, round trip missions do not make any sense at all. Send enough supplies ahead of time, send enough people to establish a self sufficient colony, and start a new life on Mars.

 

[egribble]

I do not see a need for any return trips back to Earth, not for a long time. Also, a spacecraft able to land on Mars and take off again would be more complex and necessarily be more massive than one designed to just land. Sending a spacecraft back to Earth would be a waste of time, materials, and fuel. Anything sent there should stay there. I propose initially sending robotic supply ships via the economy route and land them at the site that is chosen. The robotic supply vessel hulls can be pre-fitted with electrical wiring, plumbing, and other hardware and fixtures so they can be used as habitats when emptied. Also, robotic supply ships could carry significantly more supplies because they would not require any of the living space, environmental systems, living supplies, or shielding needed for passengers. Enough supply vessels should be sent to ensure sufficient habitats and supplies for the proposed colony size, and for at least 5 years. Then, colonists could be sent in large passenger vessels, one way.

Perhaps in 50 or 75 years it may be practical to have ships capable of return to Earth.

 

[egribble]

Who is for a one way trip to Mars? You either survive or die, but either way, you do not come back.