<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p><br />konangrit: ... Therefore, instead of a 24:60:60 system, Loony Time will use a 20:100:100 system ...<br /><p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br /><br />Yes, that would make handling time in calculations much easier.<br /><br />Here in Finland the metric system (or more precicely SI system) has been used for decades (or a century), only very old people remember the old units for volumes, lengths and such. I hasn't encounter any problems (e.g. being 176 cm tall, buying 1 liter milk bottles and filling 40 liters gasoline to a car) :-D<br /><br />The time is the only common unit not measured in 10-base system and I think that it's the hardest - for example, in calculations you need to convert times to seconds, which is sometimes hard (e.g. <i>"A space craft takes off 31-Jan-2006(*) 08:31 and lands at 1-March-2007 13:41 o'clock. Circulating at 300 km, how many rounds it took around Earth during the trip?"</i>).<br /><br />You probably know the Julian dates used in astronomy (like http://aa.usno.navy.mil/data/docs/JulianDate.html). So, in space, where there is no years and seasons, that may come in to use. After a while using the Julian dates the "spacesters" elementary school students start to complain that it's far too difficult to remember to use "irrational" coefficient 86,400 to convert times between seconds and Julian dates, and they decide to change to pure seconds, which their computers use anyway ;-)<br /><br />(*) Date formats are one interesting things. Finnish use little endian format (today 11.1.2007), Japanese use big endian format (today 2007.1.11) and some use middle endian format (today 1.11.2007).<br /><br />EDIT: The spacesters give the time and date in following format (i.e. they just count seconds from starting from a specific moment, e.g. Unix 00:00:00 GMT, Thursday 1st January 1970)<br /><br /><pre><br /> "date"<br />+-------+ +--+ clock time</pre> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p>________________ </p><p>reaaliaika.net </p> </div>
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<img src="/images/icons/laugh.gif" /> Funny stuff.<br /><br />I was not aware that I was a neo-luddite. Thanks for pointing that out. <img src="/images/icons/wink.gif" /> <img src="/images/icons/laugh.gif" /><br />***<br />The Shire Calendar rocks, check it out.<br />http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shire_Calendar<br />http://www.shire-reckoning.com/calendar.html<br />***<br />The Julian date is in fact modern science's answer to the ridiculous quasi-base-sixty system we normally work with. I use a subroutine to convert from Gregorian to JD using an algorithm from Dr. Math.<br />***<br />IMO the second will persist as the basic time unit for centuries, but how they are added up will evolve not long after we become space-faring. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>
There is another system, let me find a reference. It's a hoot. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080"><em><font color="#000000">But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id.</font></em> </font></p><p><font color="#000080">I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function</font><font color="#000080"> </font></p> </div>
That's assuming the future spacefaring civilization still uses the decimal number system, a truely advanced computer literate society really aught to work in hexidecimal. <br /><br />In that case, starting with seconds<br /><br />1h s = 1 s<br />100hs = 4.26m<br />1khs = 1.13 hours<br />10khs = 18.2 hours<br />100khs = 12.1 days<br />1Mhs = 194.2 days<br />10Mhs = 8.5 years<br />100Mhs = 136 years<br /><br />Perhaps we'll even add 3 fingers to each hand (or another hand with 6 fingers) to make it easy for the kids. <img src="/images/icons/wink.gif" />
<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p><br />josh_simonson: That's assuming the future spacefaring civilization still uses the decimal number system, a truely advanced computer literate society really aught to work in hexidecimal.<p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br /><br />I was thinking to present that thing, too, thanks!<br /><br />EDIT:<br /><br />"Hey, how much is the clock?" <br /><br />"Well, it's A2 over BC."<br /><br />But then I thought just like you:<br /><br /><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p><br />josh_simonson: Perhaps we'll even add 3 fingers to each hand (or another hand with 6 fingers) to make it easy for the kids.<p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br /><br />Yes, exactly! "Spacesters"(*) (and all seriously-taken future hackers) use genetic technology to grow six additional fingers to be able to calculate hexadecimals with fingers :-D<br /><br />But then I thought, that what if they are not anymore using binaries in computers, but qubits...? How many figers they will have in the future...?!? Interfering quantum fingers? :-/<br /><br />---<br />(*) I don't know, if spacester is a correct term for human living his/her whole life in space (like "earthlings", "lunatics", "marsians", ...?)<br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p>________________ </p><p>reaaliaika.net </p> </div>
MaK071,<br /><br />Back in the early 1990's when the y2k thing was becoming big news, I got thinking about our date format here in the U.S. We write it the same way we say, month/day/year. However, when we go to file it, how do we do it? Year/month/day. Because many older computers used only two places for storing the year, they would not be able to calculate things based on 99 becoming 00. If we were going to do a fix, lets do one that lasts forever. Put the year first, so that you can always add fields. Because, someday, it will be 9999.<br /><br />And a 12 hour clock? That probably came about because people were using sundials in Greece to measure the day. Surprisingly, in Greece, a day is about 12 hours long, usually. But we have electric timepieces that can display a 24 hour clock, so that you don't have to look for a little dot, or try to read those little letters.<br /><br />Oh, and while I am at it, how about the QWERTY top keyboard? Designed with only one goal, and that was to keep the keys that were adjacent from each other from sticking. So, they were laid out so that the keys that were most likely to be pressed in sequence were on the opposite sides of the keyboard. This was back in the 1860's when the first typewriters were being built.<br /><br />In the 1920's a scientist by the name of Dvorak studied typists, and typing, and developed a keyboard layout which is far easier to type with, in my opinion, than the QWERTY top. The world record for typing speed was set on a Dvorak keyboard, at 212 words per minute. Practically all operating systems support the Dvorak keyboard, with selection being done in the system settings. Converting a keyboard to Dvorak is easy, all that has to be done is to remove the keycaps and rearrange them. However, not all keyboards can be converted, as some have keyways under the keycaps which will not allow some keys to be put anywhere on the keyboard. Dvorak keyboards can also be purchased from certain suppliers. Tut <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> The secret to peace of mind is a short attention span. </div>
And while we're at it, we should also start using a constructed language, and since today is January 15th (Interlingua day), we'll go with that.<br />http://www.interlingua.com<br />I'm a big Interlingua fan myself. Not my most favourite, but one of them. The biggest reason I like constructed languages is because their ease of learning makes literacy that much easier for people that don't have proper education + the ability to communicate with a larger audience (in the theoretical future where everybody knows it as a second language), and you never know when that would make the difference between the next Ramanujan being discovered, or having him live his life out in obscurity because nobody knows what a genius he is.<br /><br />BTW, I'm typing this out on the Dvorak keyboard as we speak. I'm in favour of just about anything that brings about more efficiency and ease. Metric, Dvorak, you name it. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p>----- </p><p>http://mithridates.blogspot.com</p> </div>
I prefer to think of them as undiscovered gems. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p>----- </p><p>http://mithridates.blogspot.com</p> </div>
MaKo71: <font color="yellow">(*) I don't know, if spacester is a correct term for human living his/her whole life in space (like "earthlings", "lunatics", "marsians", ...?) </font><br /><br /><img src="/images/icons/laugh.gif" /> <img src="/images/icons/smile.gif" /> <img src="/images/icons/laugh.gif" /><br /><br />Works for me as long as that means I've got first dibs! I'd do the one-way ticket thing, I'm already a lunatic - that should count in my favor as well. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>
Well, here's more "bad" news for ya: Talked to an individual who is acutally working on the CEV. Asked him about whether they are using metric or English in designing and constructing the vehicle. He smiled (sheepishly) and admitted they are using English units. The reason is, as I stated...there is simply NO WAY subcontractors and third-tier are going to convert to metrics anytime soon, and so the prime will not.<br /><br />On the other hand, such things as velocites, distances, etc., WILL be in metrics! Keep your conversion tables handy!<br /><br />Ad Luna! Ad Ares! Ad Astra!
As a result the astros will still need two sets of tools. And have you ever tried to divide 12 feet, 9 and 7/16 inches into seven equal parts? NASA should lead by example. If NASA insisted on procuring in metric, the contractors might complain, but they would be able to export their products, and inside three months they would forget about it. All US cars are built in metric dimensions today, except for tire diameters, which are soft metric. <br /><br />At least we won't have any more 200-yard golf shots on the Moon. NASA should have metricated years ago. The mental workload in flying is reduced with the metric system, improving situational awareness and safety. US opposition to flying metric is based on the claim that "in an emergency, pilots will revert to the system they are most familiar with." Even if this were true, it would support metrication, since most pilots are no longer American, and we force the rest of the world to fly with unfamiliar measurements. But the truth is there is not a single study supporting the claim that pilots would be unable to think metric in an emergency. The military has the bizarre job of coordinating Army personnel (who use metric) with the Air Force (which uses Imperial). Medicine is metric. Even Coke comes in 2-liter bottles. The only people in the world who do not seem to be able to think in powers of ten are American engineers and pilots.
I'll beleive that the metric system is superior when we convert clocks to 10-hour days and years to 10 months ...<br /><br />12 and 16 (32, etc.) are such lovely numbers. You can evenly divide a pizza of 12 slices among 2 people, 3 people, 4 people, 6 people or 12 people. Try doing that with 10 slices!
I know that they tried to convert us all here in the US to Metric back in the 70's. But it didn't take. And I can attest that although I know the metric system, I have no concept of how long a Kilometer is. <br /><br />When asked I start to do the conversion in my head, well a Km is shorter than a mile, I think it's 62/100 so a Km is 62% of a mile, so it's a little more than half....<br /><br />The distance from the Earth to the Moon is about a quarter Million Miles, and that distance in Kilometers is, uh .... uh ... uh. Where's that damn calculator again? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <font color="#ff0000"><u><em>Don't let your sig line incite a gay thread ;>)</em></u></font> </div>
<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p><br />elguapoguano: When asked I start to do the conversion in my head, well a Km is shorter than a mile, I think it's 62/100 so a Km is 62% of a mile, so it's a little more than half....<p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br /><br />1 kilometer is 1000 meters ("kilo" is a prefix for one thousand). 1 mile is around 1600 meters -- /> one kilometer is approximately between 2/4 (half) and 3/4 mile (2.5 / 4).<br /><br />I have a similar problem than you have with miles, yards, foots and thus, because I have used metric system all my life 
Some Finnish people have old American cars as a hobby - in these, the speed-o-meter in miles per hour. Now, how fast is 70 miles per hour in kilometers per hour? If the distance between two cities is 100 kilometers, how long it would take driving 70 miles per hour?<br /><br />If the altitude of the aeroplane is 33,000 feets, how high it is in meters(*)? How high in miles?<br /><br /><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p><br />elguapoguano: The distance from the Earth to the Moon is about a quarter Million Miles, and that distance in Kilometers is, uh .... uh ... uh. Where's that damn calculator again? <br /><p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br /><br />Approx. 380,000 kilometers, that is, approx 0.4 megameters [Althought normally only scientists use mega or giga meters in some calculations] ;-) <br /><br />EDIT: I think the best part in metric system is that it is based on ten, and as long as our numeric system is ten-based (arabic), the conversions are pretty easy, just moving the decimal point (e.g. between centimeters and meters, millimeters to kilometers, or grams to kilograms, or cubic meters to cubic centimeters [volumes use the base 1000 - 1000 cubic centimeters is 1 cubic decimeter ; 1 liter is 1 cubic decimeter [volume of 1 kg of water] - 1 cubic meter is 1000 liters]).<br /><br /><p><hr /><br />(*) I think one feet is approx. 30 cm (centimeters, 1/100th of meter), that is 0.3 me</p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p>________________ </p><p>reaaliaika.net </p> </div>
Some Finnish people have old American cars as a hobby - in these, the speed-o-meter in miles per hour. Now, how fast is 70 miles per hour in kilometers per hour? If the distance between two cities is 100 kilometers, how long it would take driving 70 miles per hour?<br /><br />If the altitude of the aeroplane is 33,000 feets, how high it is in meters(*)? How high in miles?<br /><br /><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p><br />elguapoguano: The distance from the Earth to the Moon is about a quarter Million Miles, and that distance in Kilometers is, uh .... uh ... uh. Where's that damn calculator again? <br /><p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br /><br />Approx. 380,000 kilometers, that is, approx 0.4 megameters [Althought normally only scientists use mega or giga meters in some calculations] ;-) <br /><br />EDIT: I think the best part in metric system is that it is based on ten, and as long as our numeric system is ten-based (arabic), the conversions are pretty easy, just moving the decimal point (e.g. between centimeters and meters, millimeters to kilometers, or grams to kilograms, or cubic meters to cubic centimeters [volumes use the base 1000 - 1000 cubic centimeters is 1 cubic decimeter ; 1 liter is 1 cubic decimeter [volume of 1 kg of water] - 1 cubic meter is 1000 liters]).<br /><br /><p><hr /><br />(*) I think one feet is approx. 30 cm (centimeters, 1/100th of meter), that is 0.3 me</p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p>________________ </p><p>reaaliaika.net </p> </div>Just remember that there are 8 Chicago city blocks (distance between streets running North and South) to a mile! A "klick" (kilometer) = 5/8 mile or 5 Chicago city blocks! Since I don't live there anymore, I have to remember back to my childhood...when dinosaurs roamed the Earth! <img src="/images/icons/laugh.gif" /> A meter = 1.0936 yards or approximately 1.1 yds per meter.<br /><br />Let's see... a centimeter is a little insect with 100 legs. So a dyin'-centimeter is a little 100-leg insect that is turned belly up, going "erg"! (It's funnier with an illustration.)<br /><br />You think that's bad? Try converting from statute miles to nautical miles and then do speeds based on each. Like when you are flying at 240 knots and the wind velocity is given in miles per hour! Or tons (2,000 lbs) versus tonnes (2,200) or is that metric tons? This is becoming difficult to fathom (6 feet)!<br /><br />Then there is the unit of measure in the leatherworking industries: An "ounce", is an English unit of WEIGHT = 1/16th lb. But in leather, an ounce is supposed to be the weight of a square foot of leather. Problem is that the actual weight will differ with moisture content and density. So, to "standardize", an ounce is actually 1/64 inch THICKNESS, e.g., an "8-oz." piece of leather is 8/64=1/8 inch thick!<br /><br />Now, how many moles of hydrogen are there in a cubic parsec? Just what the heck is a parsec anyway? How does this translate into Klingonaise? IS there any intelligent life in the universe...ESPECIALLY on a planet called Earth? Tune in tomorrow...<br /><br />I think I need to go take my medicine!<br /><br />Ad Luna! Ad Ares! Ad Astra!
LMAO!!<br />Perhaps a wee dram will help <img src="/images/icons/smile.gif" /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080"><em><font color="#000000">But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id.</font></em> </font></p><p><font color="#000080">I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function</font><font color="#000080"> </font></p> </div>
<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p><br />Trailraider: [Back to the childhood] ... when dinosaurs roamed the Earth!<p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br /><br />:-D<br /><br /><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p>Trailraider: A meter = 1.0936 yards or approximately 1.1 yds per meter.<p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br /><br />Yes, 1 meter is about 1 yard.<br /><br /><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p>Let's see... a centimeter is a little insect with 100 legs.<p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br /><br />Whoo - lots of legs for that insect... :-o<br /><br /><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p>You think that's bad? Try converting from statute miles to nautical miles and then do speeds based on each. Like when you are flying at 240 knots and the wind velocity is given in miles per hour!<p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br /><br />In which miles it is given? In Scandinavian "long miles"? Irish miles? Dutch miles? ;-D<br /><br /><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p>Or tons (2,000 lbs) versus tonnes (2,200) or is that metric tons?<p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br /><br />1 metric ton = 1,000 kg = weight of 1 cubic meter (1,000 liters) of water. Since 1 lb ~ 0.5 kg, 1 metric ton ~ 2,000 lb (I think it is that 2,200 lb).<br /><br /><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p>Now, how many moles of hydrogen are there in a cubic parsec? Just what the heck is a parsec anyway?<p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br /><br />1 parsec = 3.626 light years ~ 30.857e15 km ~ 19.174e12 miles. The amount of hydrogen in cubic parsec depends on the density of that hydrogen (pressure and temperature) ;-) <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p>________________ </p><p>reaaliaika.net </p> </div>
- - - - -Speed Limit - - -<br />- - - 300,000 km/sec - -<br /><br />- It's not just a good idea.-<br />. . . . .It's the law. . . .
"I know that they tried to convert us all here in the US to Metric back in the 70's. But it didn't take."<br /><br />Well most other countries at some point had to change to metric and they handled it ok. What makes it such a problem for the US? <img src="/images/icons/laugh.gif" />
subzero788,<br /><br />The same reason that the United States has not been able to adopt a 1 dollar coin: Change is painful, and we take it out out on the politicians. Now, we all know that the job of a politician is to get re-elected, so they will do anything to avoid causing their constituents to change. We could be losing billions of dollars a year because of refusing to convert to the metric system, but that is considered less painful than having to switch, just as we are losing well over 100 million dollars a year by continuing to print dollar bills. (A dollar bill has an AVERAGE lifespan of 6 months. A coin lasts over 10 years, and costs a few pennies to mint.) <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> The secret to peace of mind is a short attention span. </div>
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