New Horizons I (and II!) Mission Update Thread

[bpcooper]

There is no plaque. Just the CD.<br /><br />Ten day forecasts are not reliable in Florida. Neither are six hour forecasts.<br /><br />None of the rockets are cleared for flight through precipitation. However, the Atlas 5 has high performance and can launch in winds up to about 30 knots. Whether they allow that for this launch with the RTG remains to be seen. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p>-Ben</p> </div>

 

[nacnud]

Horizons Pluto Mission: A Tour De Force of Rocketry, Technology<br /><font color="yellow">Aviation Week & Space Technology <br />By Craig Covault<br />01/08/2006 04:13:29 PM<br /><br />The New Horizons Pluto flyby spacecraft is poised to become the fastest vehicle ever to depart Earth, blazing outbound at 10.07 mi. per sec.--zooming past the orbit of the Moon in just 9 hr.--on the first mission to the last known planet.<br /><br />New Horizons' velocity will be about 10,000 mph. faster than most previous Earth escape flights to the Moon and planets.<br /><br />Flying at 36,000 mph.--the Earthly equivalent to about Mach 50--New Horizons will reach Jupiter in only 13 months. Relative to the Sun, its Earth escape velocity will be 28.8 mi. per sec.More<br /><br /><font color="white">Wow, 13 months to Jupiter! Does this mean that if we wanted to we could launch a similar sized probe to Jupiter every year? Use areocapture to enter orbit etc... A probe a year, that would be fantastic!</font></font>

 

[henryhallam]

I bet you'd need one heck of a heat shield, and very sturdy instruments + structure in terms of acceleration, for aerocapture. A 13 month trajectory to Jupiter will be going pretty quickly to start off with, then there's the whole of the Jupiter gravity well to fall through and pick up speed. It would be great though if it could be made to work!

 

[centsworth_II]

<font color="yellow">"I bet you'd need one heck of a heat shield..."</font><br />Which would make the craft too heavy to boost to such a speed. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[mikeemmert]

<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p>Wow, 13 months to Jupiter! Does this mean that if we wanted to we could launch a similar sized probe to Jupiter every year? Use areocapture to enter orbit etc... A probe a year, that would be fantastic!<p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br /><br />How about some more probes to Saturn, Titan, Uranus, and Neptune? Another high-energy mission is sending infrared telescopes outside of the plane of the ecliptic, away from the glare of the gegenshcein and the Kuiper belt. This would improve the signal-to-noise ratio of infrared observations.

 

[yurkin]

We could do a fly-by mission to Jupiter every year. <br /><br />But getting into orbit would be another matter.

 

[centsworth_II]

What would be better. A 300 million dollar fly-by every year for ten years or a 3 billion dollar mission orbiting for ten years. I'd say the latter, no contest. Even if we have to wait awhile. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[mikeemmert]

There was no sentinel when Shoemaker-Levy IX crashed onto Jupiter. During the period when that story was current, either <i>Astronomy</i> or <i>Sky and Telescope</i> ran a story about an astronomer named Smith who witnessed one of these strikes in the 19th Century.<br /><br />He had invited a friend to observe Jupiter through his telescope. The friend called out and said a large dark circular feature 1/4 of the size of the planet had appeared. The astonished Smith confirmed that, then said he wanted to break out the telescope with the reticle to measure the feature.<br /><br />In the half-hour or so that he did that, the feature turned white! He remarked in his journal that he was afraid people would think he'd been drinking. He had no idea what he was seeing. He had no idea how a dark feature a quarter the size of Jupiter could turn white in a half-hour. (Probably ice condensing on asteroid/comet dust from a collision).<br /><br />Some day all the gas giants will have a fleet of probes examining them and the space around them.

 

[mikeemmert]

Well, the long-awaited and long-feared antinuclear protest has taken place:<br /><br />http://www.space.com/news/ft_060109_newhorizons_protest.html<br /><br />There were six times as many people there as I thought there would be. All of three dozen! Wow!<br /><br /><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p>Mooooommmmmm!! mlorrey and mikeemmert are squabling about stuff. Make 'em stop!...There are other places to continue your discussion. Please take it "outside". <p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br />Ah,- no sir. This is an item in the news about New Horizons and should be discussed in this forum and on this thread.<br /><br />None of these people are going to post on this forum. So I tried to explain what their thinking was and was accused of being anti-mission (nothing could be further from the truth), anti-nuclear (actually, I have come to be a proponent because it's cleaner, safer, and even cheaper than lignite), and a proponent of disarmament (you bet! Wars are stupid and expensive).<br /><br />The protesters are using New Horizons as a vehicle to protest nuclear arms. They are not actually against the mission itself. From the article:<br /><br /><font color="yellow">"...said Maria Telesca-Whipple, a married mother of two from Rockledge and an organizer with the Global Network Against Weapons & Nuclear Power in Space. "We have no problem with the peaceful exploration of space, but we don't think that's what plutonium in space is all about."<font color="white"><br /><br />They are using New Horizons as a stand-in, a symbol. What they are doing is using a dishonest bait-and-switch tactic. They believe they are exploiting ignorance, that people think all plutonium is explosive. I got away from Lanny Sinkin's group because I determined that pseudoscience and just plain lies was a major part of their strategy. While the goals are in my opinion, laudable, that's not a good tacti</font></font>

 

[henryhallam]

<font color="yellow">Whassamatter, scared of radiation? I'll tell you what, I saw a Redstone go up, and you are missing one hell of a show if these fantastically long odds are going to run you off from the beach! </font><br /><br />I think Comga's probably more worried about getting absolutely DRENCHED in one of the thunderstorms that are a popular cause of weather scrubs in FL!

 

[Philotas]

Aero braking? How much energy would be needed for braking? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[henryhallam]

<font color="yellow"><br />That was an extremely bad tactic which had the effect of amplifying what the protesters had to say. It is against the United States Constitution for the government to deny free speech. Everybody knows that and everybody knows who's operating the helicopters. Dumb move. </font><br /><br />Bear in mind that CCAFS and Patrick are operational air force bases, there's probably a lot of rotary-wing traffic around there most days anyway.

 

[CalliArcale]

That's what popped immediately into my mind too. I have no idea what the normal rate of helicopter traffic is around there, but I'm sure they've got some rotary birds in the air quite a lot of the time -- especially after that embarassing incident with the illegal aliens (Haitians, weren't they?) coming ashore on Merritt Island and going completely undetected for quite some time. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p><font color="#666699"><em>"People assume that time is a strict progression of cause to effect, but actually from a non-linear, non-subjective viewpoint it's more like a big ball of wibbly wobbly . . . timey wimey . . . stuff."</em>  -- The Tenth Doctor, "Blink"</font></p> </div>

 

[mikeemmert]

Hello, henryhallam;<br /><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p>I have no idea what the normal rate of helicopter traffic is around there,<p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br />OK, "coincidence".<br /><img src="/images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /><br />And, of course, there is no way to prove any assertion to the contrary.<br /><br /><img src="/images/icons/crazy.gif" />Here I am playing devil's advocate for these people with whom I disagree and whose tactics I disagree with. They are suffering targeting error.<br /><br />There's a more clear-cut case from my own life. During the Yugoslavian war, helicopters constantly flew over my workplace. It was miles from any military base. They did something to the rotors which caused them to make a lot of noise.<br /><br />The day after America bombed the Chinese embassy we had some customers in Air Force uniforms getting a hitch installed on a truck (no Air Force markings on the truck). I pulled up a rental truck for a Chinese-looking customer. Three helicopters showed up. I had to stop my presentation about safe driving because of these clowns.<br /><br />After they flew away, I asked the customer if he was from China and he mumbled something and I said, "You'll do." Then I got in the Chinese thinking position (anybody remember that from BCT?) and apologised for the bombing.<br /><br />Little "guerilla theater" there...what the heck, the Army guys were pretty rude, interfering with my job.<br /><br />The Chinese-looking guy thought it was funny <img src="/images/icons/laugh.gif" />

 

[comga]

Whoa there. You mistook my posting.<br /><br />As henryhallam said, I am more concerned with getting soaked by a thunderstorm on a launch-scrub day. I am no more concerned with the Plutonium than other debris in an explosion, and I am not particularly worried about a launch accident occuring. And if one did, heaven forbid, these things have come out of ground commanded destructions before without shattering and scattering.<br /><br />I also think some of this discussion of the merits of RTG powered spaceflight is a worthy topic of discussion. You are playing quite the devil's advocate. If you are trying to provoke thought, and read some new, cogent responses to the arguments with which you don't personally agree, it is not having the desired effect.<br /><br />However, discussing the issue for which it may or may not be a proxy is not germain. If the protesters are trying to make a point about Iraq, or the Bush administration, or Hanford, or Oak Ridge, or the nuclear power industry, that's their right. We could go on about whether the helicopters are transport or an attempt to drown out free speech. However, that's not what I come here to discuss. There are lots of places where people want to discuss these incendary issues. I don't wish to be seen as minimizing your personal experiences, but I don't want to talk politics here. I want to discuss the science and the mission. <br />

 

[CalliArcale]

I don't think that's what mikeemert is trying to do. He's just mentioning a newsworthy item relevant to New Horizons. Some protesters are gonna make a fuss when it launches; that's relevant.<br /><br />I do agree that we should keep the political speculation to a minimum in this particular thread, but it's certainly worthwhile to mention the protests, as a newsworthy update.<br /><br />Anyone have any mission status type stuff for New Horizons? I've been having trouble getting their website to load. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p><font color="#666699"><em>"People assume that time is a strict progression of cause to effect, but actually from a non-linear, non-subjective viewpoint it's more like a big ball of wibbly wobbly . . . timey wimey . . . stuff."</em>  -- The Tenth Doctor, "Blink"</font></p> </div>

 

[jmilsom]

Whew. Back from the field. I'm hoping to be near a computer come launch time. <br /><br />Alan Stern is making updates every two days on the mission site. If you are having trouble getting through:<br /><br />On the 9th he mentioned:<br /><br />- that the past two weeks had been quiet<br />- that on 3 Jan the final flight parameter loads were installed in the twind computers New Horizons carries within her hull.<br />- New Horizons amazing speed, which has been discussed above<br /><br />He also gave a 'playbook' for the first three weeks on the road to Pluto:<br />Day 1: First contact, command to flight mode, configure thermal control, Inertial Measurement Units (IMUs) on, "burp" and prime the propulsion lines. <br />Day 2: Thermal management and guidance system checkouts. <br />Days 3-8: Navigation system and sensor checks, guidance system checks, tracking to refine spacecraft trajectory. <br />Day 9: First trajectory correction.<br />Day 11: Second trajectory correction (if needed). <br />Days 12-19: Additional guidance and navigation system checks, spacecraft trajectory refinement. <br />Day 20: LORRI and PEPSSI instruments, communications and power checks. <br />Day 21: Third trajectory correction (if needed). <br /><br /><font color="orange">Days 5 Hours 03 Mins 28 Secs 54 - until launch!!!</font>/safety_wrapper> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[mikeemmert]

Does anybody know why the Atlas has a bronze tank? What kind of bronze?

 

[jmilsom]

This just to add some more in response to Calli's query (sorry mike do not know the answer to your question)<br /><br />From the PI's Perspective dated 11 January:<br /><br />http://pluto.jhuapl.edu/overview/piPerspectives/piPerspective_current.html<br /><br />Issues discussed include:<br /><br />1. Media Interest - there are apparently four or five interviews a day.<br /><br />2. Current status: <br />- The launch vehicle is undergoing final closeouts on the launch pad at Cape Canaveral Air Force Station, Florida <br />- The final NASA Flight Planning Board has been held. <br />- Thursday will be the NASA Flight Readiness Review. <br />- Friday will see launch team communications checks<br />- Sunday will be the Launch Readiness Review<br /><br />3. Mission Contributors - Gives a great thankyou to a very large team that has made the mission possible.<br /><br /><font color="orange">Days 5 Hours 02 Mins 15 Secs 09 - until launch!!!</font>/safety_wrapper> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[jmilsom]

Hi again,<br /><br />It was quite easy to find out. I found this link, which gives an interesting history of the Atlas launch vehicle:<br /><br />http://www.interspacenews.com/sections/feature%20stories/The%20history_of_the_atlas_launch_vehicle.htm<br /><br />The Atlas common core is made out of aluminum with an anodizing process for protection which gives it its characteristic bronze color. Part of the Atlas booster stage of the rocket frosts over and turns from a bronze color to white as the vehicle is tanked with super cold liquid propellants and frost coats the outside.<br /><br /><font color="orange">Days 5 Hours 02 Mins 02 Secs 52 - until launch!!!</font>/safety_wrapper> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[CalliArcale]

Uber-cool. <img src="/images/icons/wink.gif" /> Thank you, jmilsom! It's very good to know how well things are progressing!<br /><br />I think my company's firewall is interfering with the New Horizons website for some bizarre reason. <img src="/images/icons/frown.gif" /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p><font color="#666699"><em>"People assume that time is a strict progression of cause to effect, but actually from a non-linear, non-subjective viewpoint it's more like a big ball of wibbly wobbly . . . timey wimey . . . stuff."</em>  -- The Tenth Doctor, "Blink"</font></p> </div>

 

[comga]

Today's news<br /><br />STATUS REPORT: E06-002<br /><br />NASA EXPENDABLE LAUNCH VEHICLE STATUS REPORT: E06-002<br /><br />MISSION: New Horizons<br />LAUNCH VEHICLE: Lockheed Martin Atlas V 551 (AV-010) LAUNCH PAD: Complex<br />41, Cape Canaveral Air Force Station, Fla.<br />LAUNCH DATE: Jan. 17, 2006<br />LAUNCH WINDOW: 1:24 p.m. - 3:23 p.m. EST <br /><br /><br /><br />Flight Readiness Review completed today at NASA's Kennedy Space Center. <br />Spacecraft closeouts conclude tomorrow; payload test team conducts spacecraft electrical tests Saturday, and the fairing access doors will be closed for flight. <br />Rollout of the Atlas V from the Vertical Integration Facility is scheduled Monday at 10:30 a.m. EST. The storable propellant tank will be loaded onboard the Atlas first stage tank Monday afternoon. <br />On Tuesday at 10:39 a.m., Pad 41 will be cleared for cryogenic fueling operations scheduled to begin at 11:24 a.m. EST. <br /><br />And from the PI Alan Stern:<br /><br />New Horizons Friends and Family,<br /><br />New Horizons passed LRR (Launch Readiness Review) early this afternoon. Come on down to Florida, the weather is great, and we're planning to fly out for the Kuiper Belt on the 17th! <br /><br />There is a great picture of Alan and the spacecraft on the cover of this weeks Aviation Week, and a great story inside. Nice going New Hoizons!

 

[mikeemmert]

How will the press conference on the day of the flyby be handled? Will at least one photo be available? Will they announce the date of full data release at that time? THAT show will be a lot better.<br /><br />It will take 9 months to get a full data load from Pluto at 763 bps. That's a little different from the dramatic "Live From Neptune!" Voyager flyby in 1989. But that kind of live science is impossible at these distances and with the weight limitations of the transmitter.<br /><br />It seems like presentation of the results might require some planning.

 

[comga]

"How will the press conference on the day of the flyby be handled? Will at least one photo be available? Will they announce the date of full data release at that time?"<br /><br />There will be no immediate image dowloads because the probe will keep gathering data for at least 12 hrs after closest approach. This includes the observing the occultation of the Sun by both Pluto and Charon. Then the idea is to look for rings when they are backlit.<br /><br />Only once they are done taking images and spectra will they turn the spacecraft to point the HGA to Earth. The spacecraft can't point the HGA at Earth and an instrument at Pluto to take images at the same time. Once it starts transmitting, it will take 4 hrs for the first datum to make it back. After that the data will trickle in.<br /><br />Long before the encounter they will know if they have enough power and functioning hardware to transmit simultaneously on both the prime and backup systems. That will determine the length of the time needed for first dump of the data. Don't know if they plan to transmit it all twice or just the parts that were dropped.<br /><br />If you will have been patient enough to wait ten years, you will be able to wait a few more weeks. Besides, we will all be that much older and have mellowed with age, won't we? (I hear one of Alan Stern's qualifications to be NH PI was that he was and is young enough to still be working during the encounter and extended mission.)

 

[mikeemmert]

When Voyager encountered Neptune, the newspaper published a front page photo as soon as they got one better than the best photo ever taken from Earth. The ship was still a couple of weeks out. It still didn't show very much detail, but it was electrifying - kind of a wake up call. It was going to make it! Four planets! With Triton providing a nice contrast as far as color went.<br /><br />Such a photo to accompany the (brief) announcement of the flyby might help. People will understand that it's just a publicity photo. It would whet people's appetites for the real show and previous experience with other spacecraft has taught us to wait for the main course.