# Novel propulsion method- differential linear percussion

Page 2 - Seeking answers about space? Join the Space community: the premier source of space exploration, innovation, and astronomy news, chronicling (and celebrating) humanity's ongoing expansion across the final frontier.

#### voidpotentialenergy

Seems very similar to an idea i had when i was around 20yold.
Fire a metal sphere from one end a ships and stop it at the same end in a 1/2 sphere tube rail to be fired again.
A reverse force is felt each time it's fired but the net gain is 0, when it's stopped at the same end it was fired it's a different story.
Called internal shock.
We fire the metal sphere with a mini rail gun so it's all electric.

Many people said that conservation of momentum wouldn't allow movement.
But a few people also said we internally shock the same end when fired and stopped so conservation of momentum should create a thrust in the opposite direction.

Jury still out on the idea so don't give up trying.
Great ideas come from not listening to much to set laws but just enough.

Particle Article

#### Particle Article

hi vpe,
my research suggests that if we send a weight down a railgun fast,
While it is travelling, it will throw the craft forwards
(in the opposite direction than the weight is travelling).
when the track terminates/weight stops, the craft wants to stop at least mostly
now we need to draw the weight back to create another pulse of forward motion.
If we draw the weight back slowly, we may be able to make, because it's velocity is a square.

I think the 3 Newtonian Laws will always be true,
but in my ram video there are 4 actions,
and in the servo motor one, there are 2 actions

thanks for casting your eye over the concept again!

#### Catastrophe

##### "Science begets knowledge, opinion ignorance.
Hi again!
I have another new space propulsion method,
this time I have tested it.
I built a carriage and put a pneumatic ram bolted to it.
I set a plane level for the carriage, which is on wheels.
I ducted 60 psi of pneumatic force to the ram on one end,
and used a regulator to step down to 7.5 psi on the other.
When this goes through a 3-port 2-position switch,
and I actuate the ram,
I can move my carriage forward around 20 mm in one cycle.
This is a perfectly feasible, and also effective space thruster afaic tell.
The drive needs to be hauled into space with a rocket I guess.
The method works because of differential velocity, at one end of the ram and the other,
it receives a different shock of energy.

This post serves as prior art, and will remain unedited

This is really easy, hope u like my thought- it seems like it works!
"and I actuate the ram," Is this part of the cycle or 'one off'? Cat

#### Particle Article

perhaps with a really momentous thrust, some gain could be in a single pressurising,
but I think the single ram thrust would be for lift off,
in the best way to use a ram, to simply push off something massy- it could be possible to help lift-off

-it would hopefully in a cyclical form allow acceleration

'the shock of energy' in my original post,
I have realized that the percussion at the ram ends, it's not really what makes it move
that it's the inertia of the weight while moving on a power stroke.

some contention that draws a Newtonian law is=>
say I travel 100mm and stop, there is the action and reaction
-however I can of course travel 1 meter instead, which will net more motion for the same end stop or movement termination

I wonder that more than one Newtonian event is implicated in the full 2-way cycle of the ram one

what I am going to do is spin up some air motors on a wheel to watch mechanical advantage next among
I have this 60cm dia. wheel thing I have built for more tests

so the answer is- I hope it's a cyclical acceleration using something like these

Last edited:

#### voidpotentialenergy

hi vpe,
my research suggests that if we send a weight down a railgun fast,
While it is travelling, it will throw the craft forwards
(in the opposite direction than the weight is travelling).
when the track terminates/weight stops, the craft wants to stop at least mostly
now we need to draw the weight back to create another pulse of forward motion.
If we draw the weight back slowly, we may be able to make, because it's velocity is a square.

I think the 3 Newtonian Laws will always be true,
but in my ram video there are 4 actions,
and in the servo motor one, there are 2 actions

thanks for casting your eye over the concept again!
My personal opinion to travel is to do it in the emptiness between quanta.
In essence traveling through the nothing that makes up 99.999 % of the universe.
Brute force no matter how good will always be to slow in such a vast galaxy.
Quantum mechanics and gravity are trying to tell us something about travel if we are smart enough to listen.

Traveling without space/time makes impossible length trips a mute point.
JMO

#### Particle Article

I agree that folding space or some sort of unimaginable tech is really what we want, as even light takes millenia sometimes.
Conventional travel beyond light speed may be impossible, as mass might become energy or cause a singularity(something weird probably happens). But if we become space-faring, conventional means will be used for short distances though, between planets and moons, or short jumps.

If this concept worked- it would help us with Mars and our 3 moons.

#### Catastrophe

##### "Science begets knowledge, opinion ignorance.
Rather than building larger propulsion units, should we not rather be collapsing space so that it is more easily traversed?

Cat

#### COLGeek

Moderator
I am intrigued by thoughts of folding/collapsing space to achieve the theoretical "shortest distance between two points". Assuming we could fold/collapse space, seems the trick would be unfolding/un-collapsing space afterward. Likely not "good" for the space in between points.

#### Catastrophe

##### "Science begets knowledge, opinion ignorance.
I am intrigued by thoughts of folding/collapsing space to achieve the theoretical "shortest distance between two points". Assuming we could fold/collapse space, seems the trick would be unfolding/un-collapsing space afterward. Likely not "good" for the space in between points.

Ah! Yes. I thought someone might take me up on that. Best find a Stargate, I suppose.

Sorry. I see so many science fiction ideas promulgated at great length, I thought I would have a little fun with this idea.

Cat

COLGeek

#### Particle Article

well hmm
I wonder that space is not actually a flat thing that can be folded hehe

here I have a hydraulic test of the best candidate==>
hydraulic inertia drive - YouTube

Catastrophe

#### COLGeek

Moderator
well hmm
I wonder that space is not actually a flat thing that can be folded hehe

here I have a hydraulic test of the best candidate==>
hydraulic inertia drive - YouTube
Its those pesky three dimensions that get in the way... Then there is the whole "go outside of normal space" thing. How does one get outside of all that is?

Thanks for sharing your experiments. Fun stuff.

#### Catastrophe

##### "Science begets knowledge, opinion ignorance.
I don't know if anyone remembers (and I am not going to repeat it all here - off topic) but I produced some rather interesting (I think) flatlander analagies showing that a 3-dimensional being could operate outside the "Universe" of a flatlander, and get into its space.

It is in a thread called "Edgeless Universe" and I found it using search "flatlander" "Catastrophe".

Cat

Last edited:
COLGeek

#### Particle Article

oh- so nice that u r not getting tired of me here

I sort of wonder what else I can do with my box of tricks

I was looking at heart-shaped cams as an interesting device for it
{edit} a heart shaped cam will only change the speed of the weight relative to the other part of the curve,
it will not slow a half-orbit, so I cannot use a heart-shaped cam to create speed difference back and forth

Last edited:

#### voidpotentialenergy

I agree that folding space or some sort of unimaginable tech is really what we want, as even light takes millenia sometimes.
Conventional travel beyond light speed may be impossible, as mass might become energy or cause a singularity(something weird probably happens). But if we become space-faring, conventional means will be used for short distances though, between planets and moons, or short jumps.

If this concept worked- it would help us with Mars and our 3 moons.
Yes even if we could get close to C it's 8-10 years to the nearest star with speed up and slow down included.

If we break the universe down to it's most basic parts we get mostly nothing and very small amounts of something.
Could be as simple as expanding a quantum leap area into a useful size.
Then we would have an area that in essence is nothing and not bound by time or space.

Nature i think will want to fill that area in with fluctuation so i suspect it will take a vast quantity of energy to stop nature from filling the area as a natural process.

Could turn out to be the ticket to going anywhere at any speed or even in an instant.

Particle Article

#### Particle Article

I've been trying to run the math on the servo motor with semi-circle cam
at the moment I have:

K.E = half * mass * metres per second squared

so for the slow half of the revolution ==>
K.E = .5 * 10 * 5 sq
= 625 and took 10 units of time

fast half of the revolution ==>
K.E = .5 * 10 * 25 sq
=15,625 and took 2 units of time

so then we adjust our figures to the time it took
15,625/5
=3125
625*5
=3125

it looks good like that, ie. K.E cycle is 625(3125) slow vs. 3125(15625) fast
-- maybe we are moving forwards?

#### Particle Article

today I made my ram wheel work and sketched the servo device==>

I'll make the video of the ram wheel tomorrow for us
cheers!

#### Catastrophe

##### "Science begets knowledge, opinion ignorance.
Pardon my asking, but . . . . . . . . . what is the end result, and on what scale.

I commend your excellent presentation but, where is it leading?

Cat

#### Particle Article

it leads to space hehe

I have tried to talk to the ESA,
so I'm hoping I can get a model taken to the ISS to test

I'll build the 6 amp 9 volt dc servo cam model,
which goes on a heavy fishing line with 2 eyelets
--in the space station heh! (firing into cushions at the ends)

the package will be a 40 x 60 cm cardboard box weighing <7.5kg

--once proof of function is fulfilled,
well we should go to Alpha Centari and break light speed teehee

I'm actually not sure exactly where this is going,
but it should be the third space drive, not including pushing purely
...and it's very important imo that a purely electronic drive is made possible

Last edited:

#### Catastrophe

##### "Science begets knowledge, opinion ignorance.
and the bottom line . . . . . . . . . ???

#### Particle Article

atm-
imo the bottom line is a purely electric drive that does move forward,
I'm not sure that it accelerates
using no fuel is vastly advantageous

-so this is used at conceivable speed in our interaction with Mars
to ferry what we need
...that's what I'm hoping, that it will help us with more land for people

a practical application at immediacy is positioning satellites

#### Catastrophe

##### "Science begets knowledge, opinion ignorance.
Am I alone in not understanding that?

Cat

#### Particle Article

atm -at the moment
imo -in my opinion

so whatever the ends of the of this are(although it is simply space travel)
my original impetus is simply the puzzle of it,
I mean what is the screw/propeller for space
-has me thinking

{edit- oh I see that perhaps you mean economics? @Catastrophe uh, I dunno really. I can't afford to maintain a patent internationally- I'm not inspired by the coin that much}

Last edited:

#### Catastrophe

##### "Science begets knowledge, opinion ignorance.
PA, I can speak as one who has had many granted international patents. I cannot advise you as I do not have specialised knowledge of your expertise. However, without prejudice, I can say that I would have had no chance whatsoever presecuting their strength against any multinational. I am not saying this applies to your cases whatsoever, but anyone in your possible position would have to prove infringement. To use a stupidly exaggerated example, how do you prove that anyone in any household is using lemon juice in contravention of your (imaginary) patent? It would be impossible (at least financially) to obtain search warrants to break into normal households and determine whether they were using lemon juice to clean specified household items. People may forget when taking patents that they do not grant some unevailable right, they only give you the right to prosecute infringement. I am not a patent lawyer, so I can only say this as an (experienced) individual and not as a legal expert.

Cat

#### Particle Article

yah-
I think this exercise serves me
on some level I am impatient,
so making this quicker is better
I'll just get this information out there,
for anyone to use if it works

my expertise is not large, I'm just a hackery fitter kind of unit,
I can't use cnc or auto-feed at this point

I'll film this wheel this morning, should be 4 hours away

Question Propulsion
Replies
2
Views
3K
Replies
1
Views
818
Replies
1
Views
723
Replies
18
Views
5K
Replies
0
Views
939