Orbital Debris

[torino10]

I have read a few posts and threads about mining asteroids.<br /> I have also seen many threads about the dangers posed by orbital debris. <br />I think I saw something on the NASA website about them offering a grant for a design for something that would collect and dispose orbital debris.<br />My Idea is simple, how about we come up with an orbital recycling facility. This would be a great way to Research orbital mining technology and clean up leo and meo.<br /><br />I was thinking that it would be a two part system, The smelting facility, and the collection vehicles. <br />To truly be worthwile I would like the collection vehicles to utilise the electromagnetic tether propulsion sydtem as it does not require reaction mass.<br /><br />Any ideas?<br />

 

[qso1]

Your ideas a good one. The problem with ideas for space is that old cost barrier. NASA would have to have billions to put such a system in place. The only thing I would add to your idea is to propose that private enterprise be responsible for developing it. Once government starts having a serious problem with debris impacting operating spacecraft, a market to remove said debris will develop. Private enterprise steps in and cleans up.<br /><br />Any thoughts on what your recycling the debris into? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><strong>My borrowed quote for the time being:</strong></p><p><em>There are three kinds of people in life. Those who make it happen, those who watch it happen...and those who do not know what happened.</em></p> </div>

 

[nexium]

This might be profiable, if the space elevator succeeds. At present you would spend a billion dollars for start up and a million dollars per decade for short term costs, but your recycled materials would be worth less than one million dollars per decade, so you would never recover any of the initial billion dollar investment. Near term, you would have trouble finding customers in low Earth orbit, even if you were willing to make delivery to their air lock at no cost.<br />The trash is scattered over a huge volume, so you might collect only one pound per hour on the average. Trying to speed up the collection would expend large amounts of costly energy. The collection (and delivery) vehicles are perhaps best powered by powerful laser beams from Earth's surface, which power the electromagnetic tether propulsion. There are some details in the very good forum at www.liftport.com Neil

 

[torino10]

I was not suggesting that this would be a for profit operation in as far as selling the recycled materials. I was thinking of it more as a way to deal with orbital space debris. The recycling aspect just seemes like a good way to develop rescources for any orbital manufacturing projects that may come along. I also noticed that several orbital launch assist plans(rotational space tether, and flying space elevator) would require a sizable amount of mass to operate. Utilizing mass that is already on orbit, though not in the correct orbit, would be a great way to kill 2 birds with one stone. actually more like hitting a flock of more than 9000 birds. <br /><br />This NASA news Letter is a good read as far as space Debris is concerned.<br />http://orbitaldebris.jsc.nasa.gov/newsletter/pdfs/ODQNv10i2.pdf

 

[nexium]

Hi torino: I agree it is important to develop such capability, but Nasa is unlikely to fund more than a small part of the cost, so some profit is important. Salvage stuff in orbit has amost no value at present, and it is not certain that it will ever be worth more than scrap prices on Earth. A possibility is that the delivery vehicles will be like the pedlers of old, suppling odds and ends needed on an emergincy basis.<br />In the day time, the photovoltaic panel will receive about !% as much electricity pointed at the Sun instead of a laser. This and some power from the eltromagnetic tether would keep back up batteries charged. Some items might be salable without smeltering. ie 20 exploded 6/32 titanium bolts each with one cm of length in good condition. Neil

 

[josh_simonson]

I'd think PV panels would be the most valuable and easilly re-useable portion of an abandoned spacecraft. But keep in mind that if the fuel used to get them is more than they weight, you're actually spending more for used stuff.<br /><br />Large garbage is already tracked, just today they announced a piece of space junk would fly by the ISS but was unlikely to hit it. Spacecraft can dodge these larger pieces so there isn't really a junk problem with pieces of junk that might be worth something. Working in LEO (or in the future LLO) garbage will tend to de-orbit on it's own in a relatively short time so space cleanup is an automatic function in those circumstances.

 

[torino10]

That was why I was thinking of using an electopropulsion tether, Also I was thinking that not only NASA but all space launch businesses and just about any business with orbital assets should be able to supply some of the funds for at least collecting the garbage, perhaps companies that insure satellites may be interested in funding this as well.<br />I know additional costs will not inspire space development, but reduced risks would be good.

 

[ldyaidan]

I think it's a great idea! I've thought for a long time that we need someway to recover some of our "space trash", both to get rid of it as a hazzard, and to re-use those supplies. Anything that is already up there, we don't have to launch. Wonder if several smaller units, running on solar power, could pick up x amount, then deposit it either at a space based or lunar facility. (Wonder how much countries would pay for these "secret satelites" that are up there that they don't want anyone to know what they actually do...)<br /><br />Smaller units might be more efficient, and cheaper to launch, but I don't know the technical stuff or if it would actually work<br /><br />Rae

 

[torino10]

Ok I've been doing some thinking about this.Space tether propulsion is a good way to maintain an orbit but would probably not be very good at changing the inclination of the orbit. I thought maybe multiple tethers but that won't really work. the boost is to the sattelite as a whole, reducing boost on one and increasing on another will have no effect. So you will need some kind of reaction mass to effect inclination changes.<br /><br />Ok I know that the space tether propulsion system does not actually push against the earths magnetic field but against nearby ionized molecules in the earths upper atmosphere. How about a sort of bussard ramscoop in miniature coupled with ion drives? the tether maintains orbital speed and the ion drives get there tanks refilled in close approaches. With so many new technologies being tested on this purely hypothetical project I think the first one should concentrate on being a space debris rendzevous and deorbit operation. I know, most orbital debris that is in an orbit that space tethers can function will not be in orbit for very long. but the tether can stil be used at the lower end of eliptical orbits while the ion drive would work while the the rendzevous would actually occur.