Time

MeteorWayne · Feb 1, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Hi Everyone,Time is a universal mass of movement that is constant everywhere. We base time on our Earth's rotation around our Sun. You cannot apply this to other worlds & space. Its like trying to condense the Entire Earth's existice of 4 billion years into a 1 year timeline. Where would you fit the existance of man. We would not even fit between a second. Time as we know it (hours, minutes & seconds) is designed for humans living on Earth. We are comfortable with it. It is not a proper & true measurement of time. Time is travelling so fast we cannot capture it at it's slowest point. It never stops moving. We measure things in Hundreds, thousands & millionths of a second. These measurements are innacurate. We assume it is near these figures. That is why we have discrepencies. Did the Dinosaurs exist 60 million years ago. It could have been 58,768,426 years ago. Trying to make sense of Time & space from our point of view is going to create discrepencies.Gary Posted by Gary_Peck</DIV> Actually, we base our time on the rotation of the earth on it's axis. We base our calendar on our orbit around the sun.The measurements of time we make are not inaccurate, it fact since we define the term based on our measurements they are quite accurate. Other beings on other planets might call the intervals different things, and the intervals might be different sizes, but the amount of time measured will be exactly the same.Your dinosaur argument is irrelevant. Everyone (but you apparently) realizes it is an approximation.All measurements in the distant past also have known or approximated errors associated with them, since the means we use are not exact. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

Gary_Peck · Feb 1, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Welcome to SDC. That's an interesting post. Time is such a complex topic that even the Wiki page on Time runs around 10,000 words. There are so many aspects to it, it is nearly impossible to discuss all of them in one thread. Just Time Dilation would be grist for a single thread. Posted by boris1961</DIV> Space was created for movement. Time uses space. They have now merged as one. Time & space go hand in hand. Why & how does Time have an affect on everything? The end product of time is age. So how does every molecule and it's components in your body age? How come the moon is younger than the Earth? How come your heart is the same age as your left thumb and why? It is really easy to answer these questions. By the way that diagram is totally wrong and misleading.

R1 · Feb 1, 2009

(There is  a simultaneous Time thread in the physics department )  <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

Gary_Peck · Feb 1, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Welcome to SDC. That's an interesting post. Time is such a complex topic that even the Wiki page on Time runs around 10,000 words. There are so many aspects to it, it is nearly impossible to discuss all of them in one thread. Just Time Dilation would be grist for a single thread. Posted by boris1961</DIV> If I were to travel from London to Wolverhampton on foot. What requirements would I need to achieve this.1. Time2. SpaceLight requires the same components as me. It needs Space & time to get from A to B.If you shine a light from John O groats to Lands End. If I was standing in it's path at carlisle and my mate was standing in its path at Bristol. In reality I would be the first to observe it. You cannot manipulate Time or Space nothing is faster than Time. Everything requires time to work. That is why Light is slower than Time. Without Space how would you get distance. Space allows movement. If you and your mates were locked in a cupboard and you were so tightly packed non of you could move. You would still age and In real terms you would still be travelling about 166,000 mph. Because the Earth would still be travelling around the Sun.

MeteorWayne · Feb 1, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>If I were to travel from London to Wolverhampton on foot. What requirements would I need to achieve this.1. Time2. SpaceLight requires the same components as me. It needs Space & time to get from A to B.If you shine a light from John O groats to Lands End. If I was standing in it's path at carlisle and my mate was standing in its path at Bristol. In reality I would be the first to observe it. You cannot manipulate Time or Space nothing is faster than Time. Everything requires time to work. That is why Light is slower than Time. Without Space how would you get distance. Space allows movement. If you and your mates were locked in a cupboard and you were so tightly packed non of you could move. You would still age and In real terms you would still be travelling about 166,000 mph. Because the Earth would still be travelling around the Sun. Posted by Gary_Peck</DIV> First, that is what I said. Time is the same no matter what you call it, or how you measure it.Second, the earth travels around the sun approximately 60,000 mph, not 166,000 mph.This thread (especially since it is a duplicate) seems destined for "The Unexplained" since the rambling thoughts are not expressed in a manner that makes much sense. Unless someone else can divine any.... <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

Gary_Peck · Feb 1, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>First, that is what I said. Time is the same no matter what you call it, or how you measure it.Second, the earth travels around the sun approximately 60,000 mph, not 166,000 mph.This thread (especially since it is a duplicate) seems destined for "The Unexplained" since the rambling thoughts are not expressed in a manner that makes much sense. Unless someone else can divine any.... Posted by MeteorWayne</DIV> Well you might be right about the speed of the Earth. Did you know in 6 months time we will be 16 light minutes (approx) from where we are now.

Gary_Peck · Feb 1, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>(There is  a simultaneous Time thread in the physics department )  Posted by R1</DIV> Im new to all this I put 2 posts there earlier on. Did you read them.

MeteorWayne · Feb 1, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Im new to all this I put 2 posts there earlier on. Did you read them. Posted by Gary_Peck</DIV> Yes, and since it is against the rules here to post duplicate threads, it is likely that one or the other will be closed and/or moved.The other one made a bit more sense than this one, so it may be the one that survives. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

MeteorWayne · Feb 1, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Well you might be right about the speed of the Earth. Did you know in 6 months time we will be 16 light minutes (approx) from where we are now. Posted by Gary_Peck</DIV> Trust me, I am right. The earths average orbital speed is about 60,000 mph, the maximum speed for anything in orbit around the sun at 1 AU (The earth's orbital distance) in a highly elliptical orbit is about 100,000 mph. Hence the speed of the Leonid meteors, which hit us nearly head on orbiting the sun in the opposite direction is about 160,000 mph.Of course I know that in 6 months we will be on the other side of the orbit. I don't understand what that has to do with time, other than the sun is a bit more than 8 light minutes away. Did you know the moon is about 1.3 light seconds away from the earth? Did you know the nearest star is about 4.3 light years away? Did you know the furthest object that can been easily seen with the unaided eye is about 2.5 million light years away?  <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

Gary_Peck · Feb 2, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Yes, and since it is against the rules here to post duplicate threads, it is likely that one or the other will be closed and/or moved.The other one made a bit more sense than this one, so it may be the one that survives. Posted by MeteorWayne</DIV> I have not duplicated any threads. I have reached all this by applying common sense. I am new to all this. This is great fun. That's why people do it. They enjoy trying to unravel the mysterys surounding the universe. So do I. I have my own theory on time and how it affects everything, what a great place to post them. I think our sense of time is flawed & we think it is perfect because it suits us on Earth. A typical example is in europe they a decimal calculation to measure weights. Kilos, kilograms. We use pounds & ounces (16 stone 7 pounds & 2 and a quarter ounces). There must be a Space time that is compatible for everything including Space.

origin · Feb 2, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>I have not duplicated any threads. I have reached all this by applying common sense. I am new to all this. This is great fun. That's why people do it. They enjoy trying to unravel the mysterys surounding the universe. So do I. I have my own theory on time and how it affects everything, what a great place to post them. I think our sense of time is flawed & we think it is perfect because it suits us on Earth. A typical example is in europe they a decimal calculation to measure weights. Kilos, kilograms. We use pounds & ounces (16 stone 7 pounds & 2 and a quarter ounces). There must be a Space time that is compatible for everything including Space. Posted by Gary_Peck</DIV> The moderator is pointing out that you are duplicating your own thread.  In other words do not make 2 threads that are both about time.  Bad form you know... <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

Gary_Peck · Feb 2, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Actually, we base our time on the rotation of the earth on it's axis. We base our calendar on our orbit around the sun.The measurements of time we make are not inaccurate, it fact since we define the term based on our measurements they are quite accurate. Other beings on other planets might call the intervals different things, and the intervals might be different sizes, but the amount of time measured will be exactly the same.Your dinosaur argument is irrelevant. Everyone (but you apparently) realizes it is an approximation.All measurements in the distant past also have known or approximated errors associated with them, since the means we use are not exact. Posted by MeteorWayne</DIV> All our calender and time measurement are incorrect and have to be corrected now and again. A typical example is the leap year and on New years eve, they had to add  a extra second. There must be a universal time where time can be measured accuratley. and not differ wherever you are. Reaching light speed does not put you in the future. It is just that the time we use is flawed. Time cannot be altered. Only the way we measure it.

MeteorWayne · Feb 2, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>I have not duplicated any threads. I have reached all this by applying common sense. I am new to all this. This is great fun. That's why people do it. They enjoy trying to unravel the mysterys surounding the universe. So do I. I have my own theory on time and how it affects everything, what a great place to post them. I think our sense of time is flawed & we think it is perfect because it suits us on Earth. A typical example is in europe they a decimal calculation to measure weights. Kilos, kilograms. We use pounds & ounces (16 stone 7 pounds & 2 and a quarter ounces). There must be a Space time that is compatible for everything including Space. Posted by Gary_Peck</DIV> The point is that whether you call it kilograms and grams, or pounds and ounces. the amount of weight is the same. The units and numbers may be different, but the weight is the same. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

MeteorWayne · Feb 2, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>All our calender and time measurement are incorrect and have to be corrected now and again. A typical example is the leap year and on New years eve, they had to add  a extra second. There must be a universal time where time can be measured accuratley. and not differ wherever you are. Reaching light speed does not put you in the future. It is just that the time we use is flawed. Time cannot be altered. Only the way we measure it. Posted by Gary_Peck</DIV> They are not incorrect, since the size of the units are what we say they are.The reasons for the leap second and leap year adjustments are because the numbers do not exactly match the common units in even numbers. There are fractions left over.For example the day, hours, minutes and seconds were derived from the time it takes the earth to spin around once.The calendar adjustments (leap years with an extra day) are required because the earth's orbit takes a tiny bit less than 365.25 days. Not exactly 365. So to keep the caledar in sync with the seasons we add about 1 day every 4 years to match that extra quarter of a day that our orbit takes. It works quite well with the current system.The reason for the leap second is because the earth's rotation rate is slowing as momentum is shifted to the moon (as well as some variations due to shifting mass on the earth).Some years ago the definition of the second was changed from 1/86400 of a day to:Under the International System of Units, the second is currently defined as<blockquote><div>The second is the duration of 9,192,631,770 periods of the radiation corresponding to the transition between the two hyperfine levels of the ground state of the caesium 133 atom.[1]</div></blockquote>This definition refers to a caesium atom at rest at a temperature of 0 K (absolute zero). The ground state is defined at zero magnetic field. The second thus defined is consistent with the ephemeris second, which was based on astronomical measurements. This was to standardize the value so it did not change as the earth's rotation slowed. To keep the clock in sync with the sun, a leap second is inserted when needed. It can be twice a year in some years, and some years have no adjustement. The reference point is the position of the earth relative to the stars (ephemeris second) which does not vary at a substantial rate.That does not mean the second is inaccurate, it just means the definition was changed so that the amount of time measured does not vary as the earth's rotation slows.The amount of time being measured is the same as 1/86400 of a day when the new definition was adopted.Wayne <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

Mee_n_Mac · Feb 2, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>All our calender and time measurement are incorrect and have to be corrected now and again. A typical example is the leap year and on New years eve, they had to add  a extra second. There must be a universal time where time can be measured accuratley.Posted by Gary_Peck</DIV> MW has already explained this.Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'> and not differ wherever you are. Reaching light speed does not put you in the future. It is just that the time we use is flawed. Time cannot be altered. Only the way we measure it. Posted by Gary_Peck</DIV> Really ?!?  Consider the following thought experiment.  We take 2 clocks, set them to the same time and verfy they keep the same time.  Now we take one of the clocks on a very high speed trip, eventually returning to it's starting place where the other clock has been sitting all the whole.  As I think you know the clocks now read out a different time (from each other).  How would you consider this to be a flaw in the way we measure time vs Einstein's theory that time runs differently ?  FWIW we can predict, accurately, the time that each clock is reading at any point in the trip. We know what time it is and both are "correct".  <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> -----------------------------------------------------Ask not what your Forum Software can do do on you,Ask it to, please for the love of all that's Holy, STOP ! </div>

MeteorWayne · Feb 2, 2009

Since the duplicate Time thread in physics has been closed, I have copied over Gary_Peck's original post from that thread to this one for the Time Being. (And the Time Being appreciates it....get it?)Gary Peck                              E:mail      gary.peck@yahoo.com                                 TimeTime...... What is time? Without time nothing would exist. You, me, planets, stars and galaxies they all exist because of time. Time was the second thing ever created. How was it created? We will never know and like so many other objects we can only assume. For years scientists have believed that light is the fastest thing in the universe. Without time, light would not be possible. So therefore light must be slower than time. Time has an effect on everything. They calculate the Earth is about 4 billion years old. As for me I’m 50 years old. Without time this would not be possible.How does time work?Time is a constant universal mass of movement that is everywhere. What is happening here now is also happening, 50 billion light years away, or even a 100 million light years away. Yet you cannot see it or touch it. As you get older you can feel the effect it has on your body. As you reach old age, you cannot do most of the things you did, when you was a teenager.  Time is the biggest thing in the entire cosmos. It is travelling so fast you cannot capture it. Taking a photo with a shutter speed of 1,000,000 of a second will not capture time at its slowest point. It might seem you can but you can also take a photo with a 1.5 millionth of a second. So there is a limit to what man can achieve. Go beyond this and it is truly mind blowing.How does time affect everything?Time is so big it is everywhere. It penetrates everything in the entire cosmos. Stars, Planets even a 50 inch plate of solid steel cannot stop time penetrating through it. So how does it have an effect on everything? Imagine the atom being a single item. Then you magnify it 1000 times. You then magnify it another 1000 times. You keep repeating this process. You then come to the point when you are inside the atom, and you cannot see it because the molecules that make the atom up are now spread out so far away from each other, it now seems that  you are standing in emptiness. Not even the particles of light from a 1000 watt light bulb can be seen. All this space is filled with time. It is also being affected by time as it moves. This is how it manages to have an affect on everything. Basically it is so small it can penetrate & affect everything. This affect it has on everything is what we call age.How is time used?We measure time based on the Earth’s rotation, & its journey around the Sun. Yet if you applied the same measurements to the planet Uranus things would be totally different. Everything is based on reproduction. We think that only Animals & plants can reproduce themselves. We can observe this. We can make babies, we can grow plants from other plants and time is used to achieve this. Yet we can watch these changes. Planets, stars, even galaxies are reproducing themselves. It takes more time for this to happen. It seems that time has a quicker effect on life. Yet it appears to take longer on things without life. Light travelling from other stars uses time to travel. If you were to travel from London to Wolverhampton, we need to use time.  When you switch on your TV. The ions needed to power your TV, use time to travel from the power station to get to your TV. We use time as a measurement.Can time be manipulated?Scientists and science fiction writers from all over the world believe time travel is possible. All these theory’s of punching a hole and bending time and space to create time travel. I wonder how much money is going into these experiments trying to create and make time travel possible. The truth is we will never be able to achieve this. Because time is so big, yet so small and travelling so fast, nothing can manipulate it. Using a nuclear blast to try to punch a hole through time will have no effect whatsoever. The Nuclear blast itself  will be using time, it will not be able to travel faster than time. Therefore no matter what ever you try you cannot manipulate or control time. This is nothing compared to the unimaginable power of a star thousands of times bigger than the Earth exploding. Everything needs time to work. If time required something else to work, would it then be possible to manipulate it? Time needs one other component to work, and that we cannot manipulate.Final thought.      Man is so intelligent, and achieved so much. Yet we are so small compared to the size of the universe. We are therefore limited to what we can achieve. When you are young, we seem to have all the time in the world. It is only when you get older you really appreciate  its true value, and just  how precious it is. Time passes us by at a nice steady pace. How you use it is entirely up to you. G. Peck       26th January 2009   <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

tampaDreamer · Feb 2, 2009

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>If I were to travel from London to Wolverhampton on foot. What requirements would I need to achieve this.1. Time2. Space</DIV> You would also need tennis shoes and some water.  Also maybe an iPOD and some babes and a six pack of ale.  But then whether or not you bring Ale depends on what TIME you start at.  And the number of batteries your iPOD will need depends on the amount of TIME you expect to need on the trip.  So I guess you are right.. it's all about time.  To quote Kevin Nealon on the subject: "It’s like a carousel. You put the quarter in, you get on the horse, it goes up and down, and around. Circular, circle. Feel it." <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

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