When are we going to Mars??

[spacester]

Personal attacks deleted <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[arobie]

JonClarke,<br /><br />It is a true fact that as time goes on our science and technology continue to advance. They are constantly evolving as new ideas come forth and are put to practice to alter the way we do things. The way medicine is practiced now is much different than it was 50 years ago. This concept of change, of evolution, of advancement is common. In fact, as they say, change is the only thing that is permanent.<br /><br />Science and technology is the easiest field in which to illustrate change because of the rapid rate at which we are advancing, but change is also evident in society, in government, and in languages to name a few.<br /><br />It is not commonly thought, but can the methodologies of organizations and businesses change as well? I don't see why not. If new ideas and concepts are introduced which have a practicality about them, then they can be tried, tested, and might come to be used. Businesses and organizations can and do evolve just like the rest of humanity. It is simply not evident because it occurs at such a slow pace. <br /><br />And now is it not possible that a new type of organization might emerge which would be able to overcome the challenges towards settling Mars, settling the Moon, to breaking into space that current businesses and organizations cannot overcome? Of course it is possible. And not only is it possible, but thinking about it, it appears likely that the emergence of new methodologies will happen if current organizations and businesses cannot overcome the problems of emergence into space because our advancement into space is absolutely essential to our continued existence, growth, and prosperity as a species. If none of our current organizations and businesses are able to break into space, then something new must, and likely will, emerge to solve this bottleneck in human expansion that we are, nay that we have already reached.<br /><br />This is the point that spacester is trying to make. It might take a new type of organization

 

[no_way]

<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p>It is not commonly thought, but can the methodologies of organizations and businesses change as well? <p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br />A good example of this happening in recent history is open-source software development which is becoming more successful every day, and spinning off into "open-source" hardware development, design and so on, although the term "source" does not fit there very well. Such method of organization and pooling efforts simply did not really exist before internet came about. Its definitely a new paradigm in organizing peoples efforts.<br /><br />( note that i am not talking about sharing your sources per se, this happened with mainframes too, im talking about forming communities around one software project across the globe, which can all actively contribute )

 

[JonClarke]

Yep, I agree, organisations and methodologies do evolve. <br /><br />And it may well be that to actually settle beyond earth we need to evolve institutions that are able to take on such a long term goal.<br /><br />I suspect that such organisation will have common features with a range of current institutions.<br /><br />Like vision oriented communities there will be a common committment to a high level goal.<br /><br />Like government institutions, they will be linked to systems of governance and whole of community accountability.<br /><br />Like businesses, they will have to make a surplus to build a hedge against failures and allow for growth and expansion.<br /><br />I suspect it will take a long to evolve such institutions. Kudos to those who try, like the four frontiers foundation.<br /><br />In the meantime, in the short term (the next 40 years say), we have to work with the types of institutions we currently have and what they both can and cannot do:<br /><br />Government institutions - highly capable technically but restricted by policy and structurally unable to build commerical oppotunities.<br /><br />Business - variable technical capabilities, ideally equipped for commerical development, but respcted by the need to show returns on investments.<br /><br />Non profit organisations - limited technically and financially, but highly innovative conceptually.<br /><br />Adventurers - limited technically and financially, highly innovative conceptually, limited long term goals.<br /><br />Jon<br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><em>Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars</em>  Arthur Clarke</p> </div>

 

[quasar2]

i too, have mentioned the underwater connection. we have underwater test facilities for Space Products. what we need to identify right off the bat is this: products which can be used now. if SpaceSuits are used if only for testing purposes underwater, sell em. & i`ve run into brick walls on here w/ this concept. & i`m certainly going out on a limb here because this information has value to those who know how to use it. take the profits from sales of underwater testing equipment & put towards a fund. also there aren`t enough Mars Globes being sold right now. these should be in Walmart or somewhere. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[quasar2]

another thing would be a kinda Mars Commune. this would lower overhead costs, among other things. there are paople who spend much of their above & below the water who aren`t tied to the land. most everything they own is geared toward water. there should be people now who are geared towards PermRes. oh yeh, clothes, i`ve comeup with a PermRes Jumpsuit. the basic jumpsuit hasn`t been upgraded in a longtime. i think they`re waay outdated. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[halman]

newsartist,<br /><br />I was under the impression that Jacques Cousteau and Emile Gagnan developed the Aqua-lung privately, during World War Two. This invention has had the greatest impact on underwater exploration of any invention, I believe. From the Wikipedia entry, I get the impression that the regulator they used was an adaptation of a regulator developed during the war in France to allow a gasoline engine to run on coal gas.<br /><br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> The secret to peace of mind is a short attention span. </div>

 

[JonClarke]

They were funded by the French navy to do the development work. Cousteau was a serving officer at the time.<br /><br />Jon <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><em>Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars</em>  Arthur Clarke</p> </div>

 

[fatal291]

Wow I had no Idea this topic would be so huge. I am still trying to learn as much as I can so that some day I can step foot on to Mars. I love the comments u guys left and I'll have to catch up on some of the others.