Would this be a good first scope?

[jsontag]

I have been into Astronomy for a long time. I'm thinking of getting my first scope and I really like the Celestron C6-RGT Computerized Telescope. It's a 6" refractor. What do you guys think or recommend for a first scope?

High quality 6" refractor
Heavy Duty (CG-5GT) computerized German Equatorial mount
9x50 finderscope with bi-directional alignment screws and a spring loaded pivot support
2" focuser allows for use with 2" or 1.25" eyepieces
Star diagonal provides more comfortable viewing position when observing objects that are high in the sky
Ultra sturdy 2" diameter steel tripod with accessory tray
Includes CD-ROM "The Sky" Astronomy Software which provides education about the sky and printable sky maps

Proven NexStar computer control technology
40,000 object database with over 100 user-definable objects and expanded information on over 200 objects
Custom database lists of all the most famous deep-sky objects by name and catalog number; the most beautiful double, triple and quadruple stars; variable star; solar systems; objects and asterisms
DC Servo motors with encoders on both axes
Flash upgradeable hand control software and motor control units for downloading product updates over the Internet
Autoguider port for long exposure astrophotography
Double line, 16-character Liquid Crystal Display Hand Control with backlit LED buttons for easy operation of goto features
Compatible with optional NexRemote telescope control software, for advanced control of your telescope via computer
RS-232 communication port on hand control to control the telescope via a personal computer
GPS-compatible with optional CN16 GPS Accessory (93966)

 

[crazyeddie]

I have been into Astronomy for a long time. I'm thinking of getting my first scope and I really like the Celestron C6-RGT Computerized Telescope. It's a 6" refractor. What do you guys think or recommend for a first scope?

I wouldn't recommend it as a first scope. A 6" refractor on a german equatorial mount is going to be considerably heavy and bulky. Unless you can leave it assembled on some sort of cart that you can wheel in and out of the garage, you will have to painstakingly assemble it each time you use it. After doing this a few times, you may decide it's too much trouble just to get a quick look at the moon or Jupiter, and it will wind up gathering dust. Also, this an achromatic refractor with a relatively short focal ratio of F/8. To keep the level of false color down in refractors, they need to either be the very expensive apochromatic type, or else they need to have a long focal ratio of F/10 to F/18 to avoid the violet fringe around bright objects and the reduced contrast you will get with this instrument. This is probably not a bad scope, but there are better choices.

 

[Sterculius]

I too would strongly recommend against it as a first scope.

I would suggest a Dobsonian like this.....

http://www.telescope.com/control/produc ... t_id=27182

For $400 you get a 6 inch reflector with a Computerized Object Locator (manual).

For a little more money you can get even bigger.

Dobsonian's are very easy to transport and set up and for a first telescope something you are more likely to enjoy.

If nothing else it's cheap enough that you are not out too much if you decide having a telescope isn't for you.

I suggest researching some telescope and astronomy forums to get advice from people who buy and use telescopes and get as many opions as you can before diving in.

Good Luck and many nights of happy viewing!


All glory to the Hypnotoad!

 

[Saiph]

My advice for first scopes, look first to PORTABILITY! Which is basically what the previous posters said.

If you do not want to lug it around, you will not use it. Even if it's an awesome scope. And new telescope hobbyists are far more often put off by complicated equatorial mounts, or overly large mirror assemblies than any other factor IMO.

So 6" may be a fine diameter, but go with a dobsonian mount first.

 

[jsontag]

I too would strongly recommend against it as a first scope.

I would suggest a Dobsonian like this.....

http://www.telescope.com/control/produc ... t_id=27182

For $400 you get a 6 inch reflector with a Computerized Object Locator (manual).

For a little more money you can get even bigger.

Dobsonian's are very easy to transport and set up and for a first telescope something you are more likely to enjoy.

If nothing else it's cheap enough that you are not out too much if you decide having a telescope isn't for you.

I suggest researching some telescope and astronomy forums to get advice from people who buy and use telescopes and get as many opions as you can before diving in.

Good Luck and many nights of happy viewing!


All glory to the Hypnotoad!

That is a nice Dob. The one that is a step up is even nicer and still not that expensive. Would you recommend Orion? Looking at those two Dobs, what do you use for a base? Do I have to get the tripod separate? Thank you guys for all your help. I'm really interested in Deep Sky and planetary observing, so would the Dob be perfect for that?

 

[MeteorWayne]

A dobsonian has a base cradle that sits on the ground, and the scope just sits in it. There is no tripod. You move it by hand. That would be an excellent choice for deep sky, and good for planets. I have an Orion 8 inch and have enjoyed it for many years when I am not meteor observing. It takes about a minute to set up, but of course like any scope takes a while to cool down. I'll set mine up when I start meteor watching, then look at a few objects when my session ends.
MW

 

[jsontag]

Thank you for the info MeteorWayne. You seem like you are happy with your Orion 8 inch. I may have to check them out some more.

What about Celestron Advanced Series C8-NGT Newtonian Reflector? Or, the Celestron Advanced Series C6-SGT Schmidt-Cassegrain Telescope? Are any of those two good for both planetary and deep sky?

What can you all tell me about Skywatch Telescopes?

 

[crazyeddie]

What about Celestron Advanced Series C8-NGT Newtonian Reflector? Or, the Celestron Advanced Series C6-SGT Schmidt-Cassegrain Telescope? Are any of those two good for both planetary and deep sky?

What can you all tell me about Skywatch Telescopes?

The C8-NGT would be an excellent deep-sky telescope, and just OK as a planetary instrument, due to it's short focal ratio and large contrast-robbing secondary mirror obstruction. The C6 is a schmidt-cassegrain, a good all-purpose design, but it's only 6" in aperture, so it won't be so good for deep-sky. I think your best bet is an 8" F/6 dobsonian, such as the Orion XT8. If you live with severe light pollution, go with the Intelliscope version. Save the GOTO for a future scope, once you've gained some experience and have a better idea of what kind of observing you like. There's no point in spending a lot of money on a fancy computerized telescope before you even know how much you like this hobby.

 

[jsontag]

What about Celestron Advanced Series C8-NGT Newtonian Reflector? Or, the Celestron Advanced Series C6-SGT Schmidt-Cassegrain Telescope? Are any of those two good for both planetary and deep sky?

What can you all tell me about Skywatch Telescopes?

The C8-NGT would be an excellent deep-sky telescope, and just OK as a planetary instrument, due to it's short focal ratio and large contrast-robbing secondary mirror obstruction. The C6 is a schmidt-cassegrain, a good all-purpose design, but it's only 6" in aperture, so it won't be so good for deep-sky. I think your best bet is an 8" F/6 dobsonian, such as the Orion XT8. If you live with severe light pollution, go with the Intelliscope version. Save the GOTO for a future scope, once you've gained some experience and have a better idea of what kind of observing you like. There's no point in spending a lot of money on a fancy computerized telescope before you even know how much you like this hobby.

Thank you very much Crazyeddie. The Orion XT8 is that good for both planetary and deep sky?

 

[crazyeddie]

Thank you very much Crazyeddie. The Orion XT8 is that good for both planetary and deep sky?

Well, it has 8" of aperture, which, in my opinion, is the minimum you need to get decent views of deep-sky objects. It has a longer focal ratio of F/5.9 than the other one you were considering, which means the secondary mirror can be smaller (less diffraction and better contrast for planetary viewing), and it can work well with inexpensive eyepieces (short F/ratio telescopes need premium eyepieces to work well). And it's neither too bulky or too heavy, so you will probably use it often. I recommend that you buy the optional cooling fan for the primary mirror, and if you buy the standard version, add the 8x40 or 9x50 finderscope to use in conjunction with the zero-power finder.....it will make locating objects much easier. Add a higher-power eyepiece or two, and an observing stool or chair so you can be comfortable as you view, and you will be all set.

 

[jsontag]

Well, it has 8" of aperture, which, in my opinion, is the minimum you need to get decent views of deep-sky objects. It has a longer focal ratio of F/5.9 than the other one you were considering, which means the secondary mirror can be smaller (less diffraction and better contrast for planetary viewing), and it can work well with inexpensive eyepieces (short F/ratio telescopes need premium eyepieces to work well). And it's neither too bulky or too heavy, so you will probably use it often. I recommend that you buy the optional cooling fan for the primary mirror, and if you buy the standard version, add the 8x40 or 9x50 finderscope to use in conjunction with the zero-power finder.....it will make locating objects much easier. Add a higher-power eyepiece or two, and an observing stool or chair so you can be comfortable as you view, and you will be all set.

Wow, that is some great information. I take it you have an Orion XT8? If I were to go with the Orion XT8 and the optional items you recommended, that would be a good start for planetary and deep sky viewing?

 

[crazyeddie]

Wow, that is some great information. I take it you have an Orion XT8? If I were to go with the Orion XT8 and the optional items you recommended, that would be a good start for planetary and deep sky viewing?

Um......no, actually, I don't own one myself But I DO know a lot about telescopes.....I could talk about them all day. I started out with small refractors: 50mm, 60mm, 90mm, and then finally a premium Televue 102 apochromatic. Then I owned a 10" dobsonian, an 11" dobsonian, and now I only own a 128mm Takahashi apo refractor. But I find myself wishing for another smaller dob, and Orion is a very good brand. They have outstanding customer service, and that means a lot in the world of telescopes, so I can't recommend them enough.

I think an 8" F/5.9 dob is an ideal starter scope. It's not too expensive, so you're not out a lot of money if you decide you don't like the hobby as much as you thought. It's big enough to show you a lot, but not so big that you won't use it often.....it can keep you busy for years before you feel the need to upgrade. And you'll probably want to hang on to it, even if you someday buy a different or larger scope.

 

[jsontag]

Um......no, actually, I don't own one myself But I DO know a lot about telescopes.....I could talk about them all day. I started out with small refractors: 50mm, 60mm, 90mm, and then finally a premium Televue 102 apochromatic. Then I owned a 10" dobsonian, an 11" dobsonian, and now I only own a 128mm Takahashi apo refractor. But I find myself wishing for another smaller dob, and Orion is a very good brand. They have outstanding customer service, and that means a lot in the world of telescopes, so I can't recommend them enough.

I think an 8" F/5.9 dob is an ideal starter scope. It's not too expensive, so you're not out a lot of money if you decide you don't like the hobby as much as you thought. It's big enough to show you a lot, but not so big that you won't use it often.....it can keep you busy for years before you feel the need to upgrade. And you'll probably want to hang on to it, even if you someday buy a different or larger scope.

Wow! You own a Takahashi. That must be a sweet scope. I have read some good things online about the Celestron C6-RGT refractor online, being great for planetary and very good for deep sky. For some reason I love that scope. I would love to own it one day. I have requested a catalog from Orion and the XT8 you say will be good for planetary and deep sky, so I may start with that. You an talk about scopes all you want as I'm learning fro what you say. Do you have a sketch pad to draw what you see? Do a lot of people really do that as I've seen it in Backyard Astronomy book?

What can you tell me about Schmidt-Cassegrains? How do they compare to a dob or refractor?

 

[crazyeddie]

Wow! You own a Takahashi. That must be a sweet scope. I have read some good things online about the Celestron C6-RGT refractor online, being great for planetary and very good for deep sky. For some reason I love that scope. I would love to own it one day. I have requested a catalog from Orion and the XT8 you say will be good for planetary and deep sky, so I may start with that. You an talk about scopes all you want as I'm learning fro what you say. Do you have a sketch pad to draw what you see? Do a lot of people really do that as I've seen it in Backyard Astronomy book?

What can you tell me about Schmidt-Cassegrains? How do they compare to a dob or refractor?

No, I've never been into sketching what I see....I just enjoy the view. I don't know how common a practice it is.

I don't see how a 6" F/8 achromatic refractor could be viewed as "great" for planetary use, given it's chromatic aberration, and 6" in aperture is rather small for deep sky viewing. A much cheaper 6" F/8 Orion XT6 dobsonian would give you sharper views than this refractor, and the deep sky views would be identical, so why spend 4 times as much? If it's the clock drive and GOTO you're after, I'd probably spend a few hundred dollars more and buy a Celestron NexStar 8 SE, which would be a much more versatile scope, and lighter, and less bulky. As for Schmidt-Cassegrains, they are good all-purpose telescopes, and it's amazing how affordable they have become compared to when they were first introduced. I prefer Celestron over Meade, because I think they have better quality control, better optical coatings, and a better warranty. Their C9-1/4 is a unique design that supposedly delivers outstanding sharpness and contrast. The down side of the SC design is that they can take a long time to cool down to ambient temperature, and they will not perform well until they do. Also, they have a relatively long focal ratio of F/10 (although focal reducer accessories are available than bring them down to F/6.3, for wider-angle views). The front corrector plates easily dew up in humid weather, so a dew guard is a must-have accessory. And while they can deliver very good views of most objects, they will not have the sharpness or contrast that you would find in a refractor or newtonian reflector of equal aperture, due to their relatively large secondary mirror obstruction.

But I still think your first scope should be a simple dobsonian. You might even want to consider the Orion StarBlast 6", which is a great beginner's scope, and reportedly so easy to use, a caveman can do it!

 

[jsontag]

No, I've never been into sketching what I see....I just enjoy the view. I don't know how common a practice it is.

I don't see how a 6" F/8 achromatic refractor could be viewed as "great" for planetary use, given it's chromatic aberration, and 6" in aperture is rather small for deep sky viewing. A much cheaper 6" F/8 Orion XT6 dobsonian would give you sharper views than this refractor, and the deep sky views would be identical, so why spend 4 times as much? If it's the clock drive and GOTO you're after, I'd probably spend a few hundred dollars more and buy a Celestron NexStar 8 SE, which would be a much more versatile scope, and lighter, and less bulky. As for Schmidt-Cassegrains, they are good all-purpose telescopes, and it's amazing how affordable they have become compared to when they were first introduced. I prefer Celestron over Meade, because I think they have better quality control, better optical coatings, and a better warranty. Their C9-1/4 is a unique design that supposedly delivers outstanding sharpness and contrast. The down side of the SC design is that they can take a long time to cool down to ambient temperature, and they will not perform well until they do. Also, they have a relatively long focal ratio of F/10 (although focal reducer accessories are available than bring them down to F/6.3, for wider-angle views). The front corrector plates easily dew up in humid weather, so a dew guard is a must-have accessory. And while they can deliver very good views of most objects, they will not have the sharpness or contrast that you would find in a refractor or newtonian reflector of equal aperture, due to their relatively large secondary mirror obstruction.

But I still think your first scope should be a simple dobsonian. You might even want to consider the Orion StarBlast 6", which is a great beginner's scope, and reportedly so easy to use, a caveman can do it!

I'm not sure either how coomon the practice of sketching is. Here's the review on the C6-RGT

http://www.cloudynights.com/item.php?item_id=1281

Can you give me what the reviewer said as if I were a six year old?

I really appreciate all the information you have given me and answering my questions. I too prefer Celestron over Meade, so you think the Orion XT8 would be the best first scope, then get the Celestron C6-RGT?

 

[crazyeddie]

Can you give me what the reviewer said as if I were a six year old?

I really appreciate all the information you have given me and answering my questions. I too prefer Celestron over Meade, so you think the Orion XT8 would be the best first scope, then get the Celestron C6-RGT?

Well, he calls the C6-RGT a "yard cannon" for a very good reason: it's bulky and heavy when assembled, which is why I don't think it's a good choice for a first telescope. I also question this line:

"With just shy of 6-inches clear aperture, the C6-RGT is an instrument capable for "serious" deep sky work. I've used the telescope to catalog numerous lesser-known open clusters, but the instrument also excels on galaxies."

I'm sorry, but that just doesn't make sense to me. To see galaxies well, you need a LOT of aperture, and 6 inches will only give you decent views of the biggest and brightest. I consider this to be a dubious claim. But he's right about one thing: refractors give relative sharp, contrasty views that "snap" into focus. But on bright object like the moon or planets, you will see a considerable amount of false color, in the form of a bluish-violet fringe or halo. This does not seem to bother some people, but it bothers me a lot, which I why I own an expensive apochromatic.

My advice: get the XT8 first. If you still lust for a refractor, make sure you look through a number of them first before buying this "yard cannon", because you may be disappointed in the view, compared to the XT8.

 

[MeteorWayne]

Another piece of advice, which can't be repeated too much.

Find a local astronomy club. Look through some of their scopes so you know what you are going to be spending your money on based on your own eye, and your own effort you want to spend. I like a dob, because I can set it up in 5 minutes, and be observing as soon as it cools down, with no setup. For mounted scopes, making sure it's level, and aligning it with the stars, etc is not worth the effort to me. YMMV. If that's important to you, then that extra $1000 might be worth it. To me it's not worth the extra money. How do I know that? Because I went to my local astronomy club....

 

[jsontag]

Thank you both, crazyeddie and meteor wayne. I'll definately check out the Orion XT8. Can you recommend a Celestron dob?

I think there is an Astronomy club here in San Antonio. I'll have to check out a star party.

 

[crazyeddie]

Thank you both, crazyeddie and meteor wayne. I'll definately check out the Orion XT8. Can you recommend a Celestron dob?

I think there is an Astronomy club here in San Antonio. I'll have to check out a star party.

I don't think Celestron makes dobsonian telescopes any longer, although they do import a very cheap 76mm toy scope that looks like the Orion Starblast. The Chinese manufacturers have pretty much taken over in the entry-level market. Most of the dobs sold by Orion and Skywatcher are all made by two major Chinese manufacturers, Guan Sheng Optical on Taiwan and Synta Optical on the mainland. One or the other of these telescope makers undoubtedly also makes the tube assembly for the refractor you are interested in. I think they both make scopes of comparable quality, but this is where it's important to choose a good dealer: Orion Telescopes has very high quality-control standards and an excellent customer service and return policy. Other dealers may not be so fussy about the telescopes they sell, so be careful about purchasing telescopes from internet distributors that don't have solid reputations.

Now, if you want a step-up in quality, you might want to go with an American manufacturer, such as a Discovery dobsonian. They use more rugged and expensive materials, and they hand-figure the final parabola on every mirror they make, so you know you'll have great optics. You can view some of their products here:

http://www.discoverytelescope.com/discovery/pdhq.html

Finally, the sky's the limit on the premium dobsonian telescope makers: Obsession, Skymaster, Starsplitter, Mag 1 Portaballs, Teleports, etc. They use Zambuto Optics, which are considered the best mirrors available to amateur astronomers. But these instruments are for serious stargazers, with serious bucks to spend on this hobby!

 

[jsontag]

I don't think Celestron makes dobsonian telescopes any longer, although they do import a very cheap 76mm toy scope that looks like the Orion Starblast. The Chinese manufacturers have pretty much taken over in the entry-level market. Most of the dobs sold by Orion and Skywatcher are all made by two major Chinese manufacturers, Guan Sheng Optical on Taiwan and Synta Optical on the mainland. One or the other of these telescope makers undoubtedly also makes the tube assembly for the refractor you are interested in. I think they both make scopes of comparable quality, but this is where it's important to choose a good dealer: Orion Telescopes has very high quality-control standards and an excellent customer service and return policy. Other dealers may not be so fussy about the telescopes they sell, so be careful about purchasing telescopes from internet distributors that don't have solid reputations.

Now, if you want a step-up in quality, you might want to go with an American manufacturer, such as a Discovery dobsonian. They use more rugged and expensive materials, and they hand-figure the final parabola on every mirror they make, so you know you'll have great optics. You can view some of their products here:

http://www.discoverytelescope.com/discovery/pdhq.html

Finally, the sky's the limit on the premium dobsonian telescope makers: Obsession, Skymaster, Starsplitter, Mag 1 Portaballs, Teleports, etc. They use Zambuto Optics, which are considered the best mirrors available to amateur astronomers. But these instruments are for serious stargazers, with serious bucks to spend on this hobby!

Crazyeddie, thank you again for the great information. I really liked the Discovery Dob. It's an 8" and it is really nice. Orion's XT10" is very nice as well. What can you tell me about the Discovery 8" f/7 PDHQ?

Do you know why Celestron doesn't make Dobs anymore? Do the Chinese manufacturers also make Celestron and Meade?

Al the information you have provided has been very informative and helpful.

 

[crazyeddie]

Crazyeddie, thank you again for the great information. I really liked the Discovery Dob. It's an 8" and it is really nice. Orion's XT10" is very nice as well. What can you tell me about the Discovery 8" f/7 PDHQ?

Do you know why Celestron doesn't make Dobs anymore? Do the Chinese manufacturers also make Celestron and Meade?

Al the information you have provided has been very informative and helpful.

All I can tell you about the Discovery is that it's a very good brand, and it has some nice features, such as the adjustable altitude bearings so that you can balance the tube for heavier or lighter eyepieces. It will have a better mirror than the Orion, although you may be hard-pressed to tell the difference in image quality except under ideal observing conditions. Of course, it costs more than twice as much as the Orion, so you have to decide if it's worth the extra money.

The Orion XT10 is a pretty bulky, heavy instrument, so I would not recommend it as a first scope unless you can store it very close to where you expect to use it. It has a very fast focal ratio of F/4.7, so it really needs premium eyepieces to perform at it's best.

I don't know why Celestron no longer makes dobs. The only scopes Celestron and Meade don't import from China are the expensive schmidt-cass designs and the premium mounts.

 

[jsontag]

All I can tell you about the Discovery is that it's a very good brand, and it has some nice features, such as the adjustable altitude bearings so that you can balance the tube for heavier or lighter eyepieces. It will have a better mirror than the Orion, although you may be hard-pressed to tell the difference in image quality except under ideal observing conditions. Of course, it costs more than twice as much as the Orion, so you have to decide if it's worth the extra money.

The Orion XT10 is a pretty bulky, heavy instrument, so I would not recommend it as a first scope unless you can store it very close to where you expect to use it. It has a very fast focal ratio of F/4.7, so it really needs premium eyepieces to perform at it's best.

I don't know why Celestron no longer makes dobs. The only scopes Celestron and Meade don't import from China are the expensive schmidt-cass designs and the premium mounts.

Would you recommend the Discovery 8" Dob for a first scope? I guess you would recommend the Orion XT8" for a first scope?

 

[MeteorWayne]

Have you visited your local astronomy club yet, to look through some of these types of scopes so you know what you are going to be spending your money on?

If you haven't, I wouldn't recommend anything to you

 

[crazyeddie]

Would you recommend the Discovery 8" Dob for a first scope? I guess you would recommend the Orion XT8" for a first scope?

I'd recommend them both. I've you've got the bucks to burn, go for the Discovery. But Wayne's suggestion that your go to a star party first is a good one. Some dealers will also have many different telescopes set up and will invite the public to scheduled "viewing nights"....Oceanside Photo and Telescope (OPT), a local vendor here in San Diego, does this several times a year. I'm sure it's a great way to drum up business!

 

[nailpounder]

I think it's awesome you are buying your first telescope! Congrats on your choice of getting some excellent info from all these experts! A "dobsonian" ( a newtonian reflector on a dobsonian mount) is an excellent choice for a beginner! I have a 10" Discovery telescope that is nearly 10 yrs. old. It was my first and possibly the last telescope I'll ever own! Discovery is an excellent choice of manufacturers, and they have always responded to my needs. The 8" you mentioned would be a great choice! I would also suggest you keep a few hundred $ set aside for a couple of quality eyepieces, a moon filter, and some star charts.
I have taken my 10" on numerous camping trips where we rode dirt bikes or went shooting. I say this to let you know these scopes are hardy, and can handle 20-50 mi. of dirt roads easily. WARNING: When you do purchase a scope, and you do take it camping with you, you will be approached by several previously unknown persons from other campsites who suddenly find what you are doing is fascinating! This is the funnest aspect! Several years ago I went to a very "public" star party. It was downtown (mega light pollution) and 3/4 mi to the ocean (lots of moisture in the air). A comet, Saturn and Jupiter were all visible. There were apo's, SC's, refractors and my lone "dobsonian". Lines at the scopes were 10 and 20 deep! Person after person told me I had the best views, and I had the least expensive scope there! Imagine that! I went to Griffith Observatory, got to look through the giant refractor focused on Saturn. How glum. The views in my scope were at least twice as good from my backyard, in the city, 5 mi. from the beach. Go figure.
Whatever you decide, I wish you many years of observational bliss......................al
ps. Yes, sketching is sometimes relevant. While trying to find Uranus and Neptune last year, many sketches were made and used and then referenced with some star charts to confirm my observations.