AMMONIA DETECTED ON MARS

[marslauncher]

Ammonia may have been found in Mars' atmosphere which some scientists say could indicate life on the Red Planet. <br />Researchers say its spectral signature has been tentatively detected by sensors onboard the European Space Agency's orbiting Mars Express craft. <br /><br />Ammonia survives for only a short time in the Martian atmosphere so it must be getting constantly replenished. <br /><br />There are two possible sources: either active volcanoes, none of which have been found yet on Mars, or microbes. <br /><br />Excitement <br /><br />"Ammonia could be the key to finding life on Mars," one US Space Agency (Nasa) scientist told BBC News Online. <br /><br />Spectral evidence of the gas was seen by the Planetary Fourier Spectrometer (PFS) on Mars Express. <br /><br />Professor Vittorio Formisano, principal investgator for the instrument, is expected to release details of new findings from the PFS at an international conference being held next week in Paris. <br /><br />The PFS is sensitive to radiation in the spectral region of 1.2 - 5 microns and 5 - 50 microns - a region rich with important molecules such as water and carbon dioxide. Ammonia has a spectral line at 10 microns. <br /><br />Although Mars Express has been in orbit around Mars since December 2003, scientists have so far only analysed a fraction of the data the PFS has produced. <br /><br />Researchers say this is because they are still coming to terms with the complexities of the PFS as well as coping with some nagging power problems on Mars Express. <br /><br />So far the PFS has observed a depletion of carbon dioxide and an enrichment of water vapour over some of the large extinct volcanoes on Mars. <br /><br />But it is the detection of minor compounds, possible in the sensors high-resolution mode, that is causing excitement. <br /><br />The detection of ammonia comes just a few months after methane was found in the Martian atmosphere. Methane is another gas with a possible biological origin. <br /><br />Ammonia is not a s

 

[najab]

First the Viking controlled-release experiment, then methane, now ammonia. One wonders how many odd, "possibly biological" findings Mars has left for us...

 

[marslauncher]

This is just awesome news, Do we have anyone here who can explain why <br />"There are no known ways for ammonia to be present in the Martian atmosphere that do not involve life,"<br /><br />

 

[centsworth_II]

With the Mars Express collecting this kind of potentially Mars-shattering data, I can see why the program planners would be <i>very</i> reluctant to risk the instuments by deploying the Marsis antenna. The search for water can wait. The direct detection of life via the detection of gasses produced exclusively by living organisms would be a giant step. I hope they can pinpoint the production sites of such gasses, if indeed they have been found. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[marslauncher]

Very good point "If indeed they have been found" <br /><br />As much as I dont really support the Phoenix (Wish it werent a lander although it can have more science equipment on it) I hope it does discover some evidence of possible life.<br /><br />There are 3 missions I am currently looking forward to,<br /><br />MRO (this should just be awesome especially if the Rovers are still alive at that point)<br />MSL (Finally a nuke powered rover (just hope the "SkyCrane" works))<br />and the European Sample Return Mission (haha before NASA <img src="/images/icons/smile.gif" /> )<br />

 

[mah_fl]

Unbelievable !!!! If its true then the MER's can be parked up and forgotten about ?? Just joking.......

 

[backspace]

Except for volcanism, right. <br /><br />And there's no way they're going to use that as an explanation.<br /><br />Levin is probably jumping up and down on the bed right now, 80yrs old or not.<br /><br />

 

[marslauncher]

It does bring in to question the findings of the Viking landers does it not? <br /><br />What were the complete findings of the Viking Life experiment, does anyone have a link?

 

[backspace]

that depends whose version you want. Both are rife with spin. Gil's are pretty good and all the major ones (including point-by-point shootdown on all of NASA's refutory theories) are avaliable here:<br />http://mars.spherix.com<br /><br />

 

[marslauncher]

Cool Thanks for the Info

 

[marslauncher]

Ok, If life is detected on Mars (or even Active Volcanism) what then? where do we go from here, What would be the logical next step? A Sample Return Mission surely once the location of these Bioactive critters is found. Also if Life is detected I wonder how soon we could get Humans to Mars.

 

[marslauncher]

After all what better way to greet life than with life, Seems fitting to me, Hello we are from Earth, You are a lesser intelligence (if at all) than us, prepare to be assimilated <img src="/images/icons/smile.gif" />

 

[abq_farside]

Thanks for the info. <br />The news just keeps getting more and more interesting. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p><em><font size="1" color="#000080">Don't let who you are keep you from becoming who you want to be!</font></em></p> </div>

 

[decepticon]

Great news.

 

[radarredux]

Your post got me interested in planned launches to Mars over the next several years. Below are some of missions and dates I could find; at the end are some references. I wonder how much is changing in the light of the recent discoveries?<br /><br />2005 Aug 10-30: MRO Launch Window<br />2006 Mar 10-16: MRO MOI, Start of Aerobraking Phase<br /><br />2007 Aug. 9-28: Mars Phoenix Launch window<br />2008 May 18 – June 9: Mars Phoenix arrival window<br /><br />2009 October 2009 -- Mars Science Laboratory launch window<br /><br />2011 -- ESA sample return return-capsule launched<br />2013 -- ESA sample return descent/ascent vehicle launched<br /><br /><br />http://mepag.jpl.nasa.gov/Calendar/MarsSciCal_Jun2004.html<br />http://www.nasa.gov/missions/solarsystem/phoenix_water.html<br />http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/marssciencelab_science_040427.html<br />http://mars.jpl.nasa.gov/mro/<br />http://centauri.larc.nasa.gov/msl/<br />http://www.spacedaily.com/news/mars-msr-03a.html<br />http://centauri.larc.nasa.gov/msl/PIP-Drft_FBO-RevA-031113.pdf

 

[radarredux]

> <i><font color="yellow">if Life is detected I wonder how soon we could get Humans to Mars.</font>/i><br /><br />I suspect reaction will be complex and polarized. One one side will be the people who say we now have proof of something valuable (in a scientific and religious kind of way) on Mars, so lets put boots on the ground able to do real interactive science.<br /><br />On the other side are two groups of people. The first group, Mars environmentalists, will not want us to contaminate Mars with our germs that we will surely bring. The second group, Earth presevationists, may not mind humans going to Mars but they don't want them to return, potentially bringing back devastating disease.</i>

 

[marslauncher]

A very good point and thanks for the links and Info. Science is a dynamic and flowing entity whose information is often rationed, The Missions should also be flowing and dynamic as I am sure they are.<br /><br />There is no subsitute for Human exploration.

 

[centsworth_II]

<i>"Ok, If life is detected on Mars (or even Active Volcanism) what then? where do we go from here, What would be the logical next step?"</i> -- Marslauncher<br /><br />The next step would be pinpointing the location(s), which should be possible, especially when the Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter gets there, and then landing the Mars Science Laboratory <i>right on top</i> of one of those babies!<br /><br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[backspace]

If life is detected on mars it's going to be a full-on global race to the Red Planet. Every space program in the world is going to cobble together their missions as fast as possible to put boots on the ground there. Sample return missions don't guarantee you got the critters in your sample. You need humans for that. Not to mention life elsewhere would give every government ALL the political leverage they needed to dump enogh money into their respective programs. No enviro-concern in the world is going to have a loud enough voice to shout down a manned mission at that point. There would be your pundits on CNN and Fox spelling out doom and gloom... but it wouldn't stop any of them.<br /><br />And, as for potentially lethal martian microbes? Well, what government wouldn't like to have some of those to study, maybe replicate, stick in a bomb or two... even if you didn't plan on making a weapon, you certainly don't want the other guys getting there first, before you've had time to find your antigen....<br /><br />**ok, that's all a bit of tongue in cheek humor**, but I do think the race would be on.

 

[yurkin]

Hi Marslauncher<br /><br />It seems that media is only considering two explanations for ammonia and methane being discovered on mars.<br />Active volcanoes<br />Life<br /><br />But there is a third less exciting explanation. Past volcanic activity, I don’t think anyone questions that there was indeed past activity. The methane and ammonia could be trapped underground from collapse lava channels that will never be active again. Then it will slowly leak out over the ages. Just like it is here on earth in the form of natural gas. Not only is this the least exciting answer, it is also the most likely.<br />

 

[radarredux]

> <i><font color="yellow">then landing the Mars Science Laboratory right on top of one of those babies!</font>/i><br /><br />I remember seeing a TV show (Discovery channel?) in which they identified all the places the current MERs could land. Because of solar angles, need for a minimum amount of atmosphere to slow down descent, wind, terrain, etc., the actual number of safe potential landing sites was relatively small.<br /><br />If MRO, ESA, and other efforts can really pin down the source of the ammonia, but it is in a risky location, will NASA be willing to substantially change the MSL mission so that it can visit the site(s)? For example, could the payload be substantially lightened in order to land at a higher altitude?</i>

 

[alexblackwell]

<i>What an unpleasant dilemma! If we find life on Mars, it will be one of the greatest scientific finds in history...</i><br /><br />It's still early days but I'd be very careful with the science-by-press-release approach, especially regarding any "life on Mars" claims. That said, as with the PFS/methane issue, I'll wait until I see what Formisano et al. are able to get through peer review. Science conferences are notorious for hype and, in some cases, misinformation.<br /><br />As an aside, I know some U.S. scientists must be more than a little envious that the Mars Express science team can sit on their data. I guess Europe doesn't have the equivalent of the "angry American taxpayer," though I guess merely being angry at America is sufficient these days ;-)<br />

 

[alexblackwell]

<i>...could the payload be substantially lightened in order to land at a higher altitude?</i><br /><br />I doubt it, though I guess it would depend on how much of a higher altitude. Note that even Beagle 2, which was much lighter than any lander in the works, had a fairly low altitude constraint.<br />

 

[mrmorris]

<font color="yellow">"But it would also create a powerful ethical arguement against human colonization and terraforming, which I think is essential to help ensure the survival of the human race. I can't decide if the news would make me happy, or sad!"</font><br /><br />The plusses to space exploration of finding life on Mars <b>far</b> outweigh the minuses. The discovery of life on another planet -- would be the single most important finding in the space program to date. It will provide the best hard evidence that life is not unique to the planet Earth. <br /><br />The nay-sayers who claim that the creation of life is so incredibly unlikely that Earth is unique in having life despite untold trillions of other stars in the universe will have to change arguments. Doubtless the argument will switch to something along the lines of our solar system being unique rather than Earth being unique, but this is obviously grasping at straws.<br /><br />It might mean that we could never colonize Mars (although perhaps if it's just a few microbes -- we could create a 'reservation' on Phobos Or Deimos to send them to <img src="/images/icons/smile.gif" /> ) . However -- it would almost certainly mean more public support for space exploration and therefore more money. We <b>can</b> colonize space without using Mars. We <b>can't</b> colonize space without a heck of a lot of money.<br />

 

[redracer02]

I don't think sending the microbes to the moons would work, they probably need the atmosphere.<br /><br />If it is life, in the form of microbes, they'll just have to deal with us. We have an exsistence to look out for too, survival of the fittest.<br /><br />The best way to go about colonization is to leave the larger colonies in protected zones while human inhabit doomed cities. No matter what we'll never be able to not come in contact with them ever. Envirocons here need to understand that we aren't going to Mars to destroy it like here (although we are trying to resverse it here), we are going there to learn and try to make it a living world. Ok, also to set up a staging point and factories to get us even farther from here.