Claim for discovery of a locked-locked star-planet system

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h2ouniverse

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<p>This article on ESA's site</p><p>http://www.esa.int/esaCP/SEMSIFXIPIF_index_0.html</p><p>The CoRoT team has discovered a Jupiter transiting a star with a 9-day period, that they observed over several months.</p><p>But the strange thing about their analysis is that "the team has found that the star, which is slightly larger than our Sun, is rotating at the same pace as the planet's period of revolution. " That would mean a DOUBLE tidal locking, Pluto-Charon style... A first for a star-planet duo.</p><p>The rotation period of the planet has been determined by comparative photometry.</p>
 
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MeteorWayne

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Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>This article on ESA's sitehttp://www.esa.int/esaCP/SEMSIFXIPIF_index_0.htmlThe CoRoT team has discovered a Jupiter transiting a star with a 9-day period, that they observed over several months.But the strange thing about their analysis is that "the team has found that the star, which is slightly larger than our Sun, is rotating at the same pace as the planet's period of revolution. " That would mean a DOUBLE tidal locking, Pluto-Charon style... A first for a star-planet duo.The rotation period of the planet has been determined by comparative photometry. <br />Posted by h2ouniverse</DIV><br /><br />Corot Results? Cool! <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080"><em><font color="#000000">But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id.</font></em> </font></p><p><font color="#000080">I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function</font><font color="#000080"> </font></p> </div>
 
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emperor_of_localgroup

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<p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>This article on ESA's sitehttp://www.esa.int/esaCP/SEMSIFXIPIF_index_0.htmlThe CoRoT team has discovered a Jupiter transiting a star with a 9-day period, that they observed over several months.But the strange thing about their analysis is that "the team has found that the star, which is slightly larger than our Sun, is rotating at the same pace as the planet's period of revolution. " That would mean a DOUBLE tidal locking, Pluto-Charon style... A first for a star-planet duo.The rotation period of the planet has been determined by comparative photometry. <br />Posted by h2ouniverse</DIV></p><p><font size="2">In other words, a solar-synchronous orbit&nbsp; instead of geo-synchronous?</font></p><p><font size="2">It's expected somewhere in the universe, all it needs are correct distance and speed.</font></p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <font size="2" color="#ff0000"><strong>Earth is Boring</strong></font> </div>
 
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derekmcd

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<p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>This article on ESA's sitehttp://www.esa.int/esaCP/SEMSIFXIPIF_index_0.htmlThe CoRoT team has discovered a Jupiter transiting a star with a 9-day period, that they observed over several months.But the strange thing about their analysis is that "the team has found that the star, which is slightly larger than our Sun, is rotating at the same pace as the planet's period of revolution. " That would mean a DOUBLE tidal locking, Pluto-Charon style... A first for a star-planet duo.The rotation period of the planet has been determined by comparative photometry. <br /> Posted by h2ouniverse</DIV></p><p>I would highly doubt that tidal mechanisms are the cause here.&nbsp; I can see the star influencing the planet to be tidally locked, but not vice versa.&nbsp; Not in that short a period of time. </p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <div> </div><br /><div><span style="color:#0000ff" class="Apple-style-span">"If something's hard to do, then it's not worth doing." - Homer Simpson</span></div> </div>
 
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MeteorWayne

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<p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>I would highly doubt that tidal mechanisms are the cause here.&nbsp; I can see the star influencing the planet to be tidally locked, but not vice versa.&nbsp; Not in that short a period of time. <br />Posted by derekmcd</DIV><br /><br />Do we know how short a period of time it is?</p><p>Edit- Aha, yes we do. It's a young'un!</p><p>Perhaps it's just coincidental?</p><p>After all, 9 days is not an unrealistic rotation rate for a star at that age.</p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080"><em><font color="#000000">But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id.</font></em> </font></p><p><font color="#000080">I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function</font><font color="#000080"> </font></p> </div>
 
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silylene old

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<p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>I would highly doubt that tidal mechanisms are the cause here.&nbsp; I can see the star influencing the planet to be tidally locked, but not vice versa.&nbsp; Not in that short a period of time. <br />Posted by derekmcd</DIV></p><p>This reminds me of the debate of possible tidal effects on our sun from Jupiter and other planets.</p><p>There have been several refereed journals articles linking the 11.3 yr solar sunspot cycles with tidal effects from Jupiter, one good paper which showed that minor variations in daily sunspot numbers are linked to tidal contributions from&nbsp;Mercury, and the 178.7 year Gleissberg cyclex2 has been linked to the combined tidal influence of Jupiter, Venus, Earth&nbsp;and Saturn.&nbsp; However, none of this is proven, and there are other papers disagreeing.&nbsp; Let us just say that this hypothesis&nbsp;is still contested.</p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature" align="center"><em><font color="#0000ff">- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -</font></em> </div><div class="Discussion_UserSignature" align="center"><font color="#0000ff"><em>I really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function.</em></font> </div> </div>
 
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h2ouniverse

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<p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Do we know how short a period of time it is?Edit- Aha, yes we do. It's a young'un!Perhaps it's just coincidental?After all, 9 days is not an unrealistic rotation rate for a star at that age. <br />Posted by MeteorWayne</DIV><br /><br />Or may be it's both:</p><p>* the period happened to be similar by chance</p><p>* then there has been some second-order tidal effect that could adjust the spin period of the star over the billion years of existence of this system</p>
 
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MeteorWayne

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<p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Or may be it's both:* the period happened to be similar by chance* then there has been some second-order tidal effect that could adjust the spin period of the star over the billion years of existence of this system <br />Posted by h2ouniverse</DIV><br /><br />Yeah, that's what I mean. What's been shown is that</p><p>A. The planet is locked to the star, and</p><p>B. The stellar rotation rate (at least as far as what they've measured) is nearly the same.</p><p>It has not been proven that the star is tidally locked to the planet; it could be conicidental.</p><p>Another issue is, what latitude are they measuring on the star. As you all know, out star rotates at different rates at the equator and at higher latitudes.</p><p>If they really are claiming that the star is tidally locked, we'll need to see more data, and a mathematical/physical&nbsp;theory as to how that could occur</p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080"><em><font color="#000000">But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id.</font></em> </font></p><p><font color="#000080">I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function</font><font color="#000080"> </font></p> </div>
 
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3488

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<p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'><font color="#ff0000">Yeah, that's what I mean. What's been shown is thatA. The planet is locked to the star, andB. The stellar rotation rate (at least as far as what they've measured) is nearly the same.It has not been proven that the star is tidally locked to the planet; it could be conicidental.Another issue is, what latitude are they measuring on the star. As you all know, out star rotates at different rates at the equator and at higher latitudes.If they really are claiming that the star is tidally locked, we'll need to see more data, and a mathematical/physical&nbsp;theory as to how that could occur <br /> Posted by MeteorWayne</font></DIV></p><p><font size="2"><strong>That's true, I would suspect most stars like our Sun have differential rotation.</strong></font></p><p><font size="2"><strong>Some years ago, though now it is not thought so anymore, that Aldebaran / Alpha Tauri may had been tidally locked to a planet, both with rotational / orbital period of two years.</strong></font></p><p><font size="2"><strong>The planet is now not thought to exist, but Aldebaran /Alpha Tauri & Arcturus / Alpha Bootis are both slow rotators, 2 years & 20 months respectively.</strong></font></p><p><font size="2"><strong>I wonder if a star that is tidally locked with a planet or another companion star like Capella / Alpha Aurigae still have differntial rotation or if it is just the equators that are locked?</strong></font></p><p><font size="2"><strong>Andrew Brown.&nbsp;</strong></font></p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080">"I suddenly noticed an anomaly to the left of Io, just off the rim of that world. It was extremely large with respect to the overall size of Io and crescent shaped. It seemed unbelievable that something that big had not been visible before".</font> <em><strong><font color="#000000">Linda Morabito </font></strong><font color="#800000">on discovering that the Jupiter moon Io was volcanically active. Friday 9th March 1979.</font></em></p><p><font size="1" color="#000080">http://www.launchphotography.com/</font><br /><br /><font size="1" color="#000080">http://anthmartian.googlepages.com/thisislandearth</font></p><p><font size="1" color="#000080">http://web.me.com/meridianijournal</font></p> </div>
 
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h2ouniverse

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<p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>If they really are claiming that the star is tidally locked, we'll need to see more data, and a mathematical/physical&nbsp;theory as to how that could occur <br />Posted by MeteorWayne</DIV><br /><br />Hi Wayne.</p><p>I agree with "need to see more data". As they say, extraordinary claims require extraodinary evidence.</p><p>But strongly disagree with "mathematical/physical&nbsp;theory as to how that could occur". That would go towards a disastrous current trend in science where observational facts are disregarded because they do not fit with "models". It is unfortunately generalizing in science these days, although highly unscientific. An engineer that would proceed this way when dealing with an anomaly (i.e. refusing to consider the anomaly because he has no theoretical explanation) would be fired immediately. Rightly imo.</p><p>Best regards.</p>
 
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MeteorWayne

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<p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Hi Wayne.I agree with "need to see more data". As they say, extraordinary claims require extraodinary evidence.But strongly disagree with "mathematical/physical&nbsp;theory as to how that could occur". That would go towards a disastrous current trend in science where observational facts are disregarded because they do not fit with "models". It is unfortunately generalizing in science these days, although highly unscientific. An engineer that would proceed this way when dealing with an anomaly (i.e. refusing to consider the anomaly because he has no theoretical explanation) would be fired immediately. Rightly imo.Best regards. <br />Posted by h2ouniverse</DIV><br /><br />That's not quite what I'm saying. Right now, there is no <em>imaginable</em> mechanism that would lock the star to the planet under the current age and distance conditions. All I'm saying is there's nothing even approaching "proof" that the star is locked to the planet. So when someone has a hypothesis, then we can begin testing it. Right now, it's an observation, which could be a pure coincidence.</p><p>I'm still reading to determine what stellar latitude the observations suggest the locking has occurred.</p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080"><em><font color="#000000">But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id.</font></em> </font></p><p><font color="#000080">I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function</font><font color="#000080"> </font></p> </div>
 
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