Opportunity Mission Update Thread

[najab]

These ATVs - tearing up the landscape. Somebody needs to do somthing....

 

[centsworth_II]

<i>"Maybe Opportunity can make an extended trek to very deep crater in the spring."</i><br /><br />Do you mean another crater, besides Endurance? I don't think there is one in range. Also, the risk has been judged too great to go even half way to the bottom of Endurance so I don't think they'd be sending it deeper in another crater.<br /><br />I think that by the time spring arrives, the rover planners will have a case of cabin fever and will be ready to head out of Endurance and south to the etched terrain, with a stop at the hole excavated by the heat shield impact. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[centsworth_II]

<i>"These ATVs - tearing up the landscape. Somebody needs to do somthing...."</i><br /><br />We could start by declaring Guseve and Meridiani Planum national parks. I wonder what international space law would have to say about that?<br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[jaredgalen]

So close yet so far.... <img src="/images/icons/frown.gif" /><br /><br />http://qt.exploratorium.edu/mars/opportunity/navcam/2004-08-23/1N146560905EFF35B8P0643R0M1.JPG

 

[fangsheath]

Actually, there are some larger craters around. The top crater (unfortunately I only have a piece of it) is only about a mile and a half to the northwest. The bottom is no more than 5 miles southwest. Both of these craters are at least a quarter of a mile in diameter. The nice thing about these larger craters is that they actually tend to have more gently sloping walls. Must be quite a view from the rim of either.<br /><br />Please note that these 2 images are not exactly at the same scale.

 

[mah_fl]

Centsworth_II....Oppy is at the bottem of Endurance crater....She's just not venturing into the sand dunes.

 

[centsworth_II]

<i>"The top crater... is only about a mile and a half to the northwest. The bottom is no more than 5 miles southwest."</i> -- fangsheath<br /><br /><i>"A deeper hole might be 50km away..."</i> -- borman<br /><br />Boy, you guys have a very optimistic idea about the range of Opportunity! Actually, the mile and a half is not bad, but in the opposite direction of the etched terrain to the south, which probably is the next target of choice for most. And who knows, In my wildest dreams I could see reaching the crater five miles to the southwest after a trek through the etched terrain. Now <i>that's</i> something to hope for!<br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[centsworth_II]

<i>"Oppy is at the bottem of Endurance crater...."</i><br /><br />I guess it depends on what you call the bottom. In this image, I've circled the dune field in blue. I think this represents the outline of the bottom. The walls slope up from the blue line. I've indicated with a yellow line what I think is the approximate path of Opportunity, from its decent down the slope of Karatepe to its current location at the band of rocks it has been studying. In my view, this band of rocks is about half way to the bottom. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[radarredux]

Thanks for the annotated picture.<br /><br />Speaking for myself, I was under the impression that Oppy was nearly at the bottom (i.e., where slope flattens out at the bottom of the bowl). This picture really shows a different story.

 

[fangsheath]

It is important to read these releases with great caution. Let me quote Squyres from the last press briefing, concerning the stratigraphy at Karatepe:<br />"...once we have gotten deep down into the stack, the appearance of the rocks has changed. Now it's still fundamentally the same kind of rock, it's got the same general sort of chemistry, it looks like it was laid down in liquid water, but it's telling us something about changing conditions as we look further into the Martian past."<br />"....it's really kinda variations on a theme....The spectral properties, the characteristics as we work our way down, fundamentally similar sorts of rocks, but it's expressing itself differently."<br /><br />Now how are we to reconcile this with the statement in the press release you linked to? It is as follows:<br />"The rover has found that chlorine and pyroxene (a signature of basaltic, or volcanic, rocks) increase in concentration with deepening layers of rock. Scientists also hope to study the dunes, or 'ripples,' visible at the bottom right of this image. These dunes show strong signatures for basalt and could further develop the history of this area of Meridiani Planum."<br /><br />I submit that the reconciliation comes in realizing that despite the reference to rocks in the second quote, this is in fact based on Mini-TES observations of the surface, not RATed rocks. It is a statement about the composition of the surface only. The surface of Endurance consists primarily of exposed rock near the rim versus primarily drift on the floor. The rock is mainly evaporite, the drift is mainly basalt. This explains the increasing pyroxene with depth.<br /><br />The important distinction is that the basalt is primarily exigenous and reflects more recent Martian history. It is the evaporite that is the older, indigenous material. I am not suggesting that there may not be basaltic rock beneath it, I am merely trying to clarify what I think has been found thus far. <br />

 

[exoscientist]

<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p><i>I question the efficacy of long-range mineralogy by Mini-TES. Thank goodness boldness prevailed and they weren't satisfied with merely observing from the rim. </i><p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br /><br /> I agree. That's why I wanted Spirit to investigate Bonneville crater. The expected water features in Gusev may have been exposed by this crater. <br /> Long-range sensing by mini-TES didn't descern any water related minerals so Bonneville was deemed "uninteresting".<br /><br /><br /> Bob Clark <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[thechemist]

According to the latest Aug 25 Flight Director's Update Oppy uncovered by mistake a rock described as an "...amazing science target .." while trying to come up the crater from a previous slippage.<br />This forward hazcam image was shown, and the rock in question is the one in the center with the parallel stripes on it.<br />More detailed views of this rock can be seen in the Sol 208 PanCam images. <br /><br />Opportunity is indeed very lucky <img src="/images/icons/smile.gif" /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <em>I feel better than James Brown.</em> </div>

 

[fangsheath]

You may be right about the pyroxene, we shall see. But I find it odd that after making a big deal about getting to the bottom of Karatepe to find basalt "because we know it's down there," Squyres didn't say a peep about it at the last press briefing. In fact he gave every indication that the rocks at the bottom of the stack are "variations on a theme" of sediments laid down in water.<br /><br />I do not claim any particular scenario for the formation of these deposits. I'm sure we could come up with many. My point is that we cannot come up with any scenario until we know what has been found, and we need to be cautious about statements from anyone, including NASA and JPL, that are not backed up with actual data, assignable to a particular instrument and target, preferably in quantitative form. The chlorine data I can see. The pyroxene I do not.

 

[thechemist]

Well, I think now that the "amazing science target" was always there, and not uncovered.<br />I have indicated it with an arrow in the Sol 203 NavCam image seen below.<br />I am not 100% sure, but hope that future imaging might clear this up. <br /><br /><i> Edit: Actually, one can see it in past images also, for example in this Sol 204 rear HazCam image , so it seems clearly it was there before, only not recognized as important. </i> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <em>I feel better than James Brown.</em> </div>

 

[fangsheath]

Your arrow does indeed point to the "amazing science target." I'm not exactly sure what is so amazing about it, though.

 

[thechemist]

<i><font color="yellow">"I'm not exactly sure what is so amazing about it, though."</font></i><br />The fact that the guy doing the update was the same one that a couple of weeks ago announced that Opportunity was leaving the crater, makes me hesitant, but, let's wait and see <img src="/images/icons/smile.gif" /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <em>I feel better than James Brown.</em> </div>

 

[mikehoward]

Well, part of it does look kind of "honeycombed". What's that about? I mean, we've seen plenty of rock plates, but this looks like it's on a smaller scale and just one rock.<br /><br />I was going to attach a picture, but it's too big, so here are some links instead: <br />http://qt.exploratorium.edu/mars/opportunity/pancam/2004-08-26/1P146647757EFF35B8P2423L2M1.JPG<br />http://homepage.mac.com/michaelhoward/marsupdate/slideshow/1/all/208/1P146647757_fcL2L5L7.htm<br /><br />Also, maybe, the layering seems to me to be unusually pronounced and widely spaced, unless I have missed previous instances like this. <br /><br />However, I know nothing of this "geology" of which you speak, so maybe this stuff is perfectly ordinary.

 

[centsworth_II]

<i>"...the guy doing the update..."</i><br /><br />He does seem very offhanded with his comments. Maybe this is the 'locker room talk' version of the mission. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[mikehoward]

By the way, no one has mentioned the "rock" that Oppy appears to have partly (accidentally) "crushed". I don't think that was the science target he was talking about in the report, but that seemed rather extraordinary to me. [Update: Looking at some "before" pictures, maybe it's not really crushed (much).]

 

[radarredux]

Great dune shots today.<br /><br />http://qt.exploratorium.edu/mars/opportunity/pancam/2004-08-26/1P146558877EFF35B8P2561R2M1.JPG<br />http://qt.exploratorium.edu/mars/opportunity/pancam/2004-08-26/1P146558829EFF35B8P2560R1M1.JPG<br /><br />Full day's shots at<br />http://qt.exploratorium.edu/mars/opportunity/pancam/2004-08-26/

 

[silylene old]

Those dunes are so amazingly perfect. The interface between the facing edge of the dune and the ground surface is practically knife-sharp, even at millimiter-scale resolution. They look like they were built by a mathematical algorithm wielded by a perfectionist, not the chaotic vagaries of nature. captivating.<br /><br />Those dunes are the eye-candy of this mission. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature" align="center"><em><font color="#0000ff">- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -</font></em> </div><div class="Discussion_UserSignature" align="center"><font color="#0000ff"><em>I really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function.</em></font> </div> </div>

 

[exoscientist]

Borman, did they report anywhere the results of the APXS that can measure lighter elements that might be combined with the chlorine?<br /><br /> Bob Clark <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[Leovinus]

I looked at those dune shots. It made me want to get a printout, show it to a layman, and ask him where the picture was taken. I bet he'd never guess Mars. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[thechemist]

Ok now, these are fresh MI from Oppy.<br />http://qt.exploratorium.edu/mars/opportunity/micro_imager/2004-08-27/1M146828625EFF35BGP2957M2M1.JPG<br /><br />Have we seen before this "lamellar" (?) morphology ?<br /><br />http://qt.exploratorium.edu/mars/opportunity/micro_imager/2004-08-27/1M146828418EFF35BGP2957M2M1.JPG<br /><br />Edit: bad choice of word for "lamellar", ignore it. After reexamining the images, I saw just small stones stuck together in the "isles" of the rock.<br /><br />2nd Edit: I just saw the lamellae again ! It was an optical illusion <img src="/images/icons/smile.gif" /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <em>I feel better than James Brown.</em> </div>

 

[thechemist]

Dunes, tendrils, ripples and mini-ripples, and small-scale ripples.....<br />Amazing !<br /><br />http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/all/1/p/207/1P146558920EFF35B8P2561L5M1.HTML<br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <em>I feel better than James Brown.</em> </div>