Orion asteroid mission?

[mithridates]

Yeah, plus I wasn't thinking about re-entry either. That's what happens when I get excited. Well, it should be easy enough to just touch down really gently or keep the ship a short distance away, assuming that the asteroid is round enough that gravity fluctuations wouldn't be a problem.<br /><br />What about setting up a telescope while they're there and leaving it to make observations for as many years as it's able to? I don't see any problems with the idea myself. No worries about degrading orbits either, just put the telescope down and you're done. With a quickly-rotating asteroid night might only be two hours or so, letting the batteries stay small and light as they only have to last through the quick night before day comes around again to recharge them. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p>----- </p><p>http://mithridates.blogspot.com</p> </div>

 

[qso1]

I see the potential for an asteroid mission to actually be the basis for gaining a lot of experience for going to mars. Especially in areas where such experience is not readily available on the lunar missions.<br /><br />Radiation protection being one of the areas where experience can be gained. And as you mentioned, there may not be a requirement for that much shielding on an asteroid mission. OTOH, the tendency to over engineer may actually cause NASA to have slightly more protection on an asteroid mission and once the mission data is in...and if it allows, there could be a slight reduction in shielding on mars missions. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><strong>My borrowed quote for the time being:</strong></p><p><em>There are three kinds of people in life. Those who make it happen, those who watch it happen...and those who do not know what happened.</em></p> </div>

 

[bpfeifer]

I really like the idea of an asteroid mission. If your goal is Mars, then it fits neatly into NASA's usual incrimental increase in duration/difficulty/capabilities. Plus, if you built a reusable Interplanetary Transport Vehicle, then a NEO asteroid mission provides an excellent destination for an advanced shakedown cruise. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Brian J. Pfeifer http://sabletower.wordpress.com<br /> The Dogsoldier Codex http://www.lulu.com/sabletower<br /> </div>

 

[alokmohan]

Preparatoy to mars mission.Correct qso.

 

[rocketman5000]

that sounds like a great idea on sheilding. I remember a thread here several weeks ago talking about the 95% confidence of radiation levels and that with more data we can shrink the size of our 95% confidence leve.

 

[qso1]

bpfeifer:<br />I really like the idea of an asteroid mission. If your goal is Mars, then it fits neatly into NASA's usual incrimental increase in<br /><br />Me:<br />I definetely like the idea. Imagine the astronauts on an asteroid, they will really be able to leap. Although there will be much in the way of safeguards to prevent that I would imagine. Jumping up 10-12 feet or more could pose serious problems on coming down despite the fact you would not come down hard and fast as you would on earth or even the moon.<br /><br />Great TV coverage however. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><strong>My borrowed quote for the time being:</strong></p><p><em>There are three kinds of people in life. Those who make it happen, those who watch it happen...and those who do not know what happened.</em></p> </div>

 

[qso1]

And I suspect the confidence levels will bounce up and down a few times before human missions to the asteroids or mars get underway. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><strong>My borrowed quote for the time being:</strong></p><p><em>There are three kinds of people in life. Those who make it happen, those who watch it happen...and those who do not know what happened.</em></p> </div>

 

[mithridates]

What is the minimum diameter (assuming a rocky asteroid) an asteroid needs for the gravity to be strong enough that a human can't escape simply by jumping?<br /><br />Something else that would make an asteroid mission more fun would be the possibility to just throw objects from the surface into space. I could see a lot of student participation there where astronauts would agree to take a number of tennis ball-sized probes made by schools that they would then throw or shoot with a gun-like object along the rotational axis of the asteroid to propel it into its own orbit around the sun that the students could then measure themselves. That's yet another thing you can do on an asteroid that you can't on a planet or on the Moon.<br /><br />And the telescope idea again - is that feasible and/or desirable? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p>----- </p><p>http://mithridates.blogspot.com</p> </div>

 

[willpittenger]

<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p>Something else that would make an asteroid mission more fun would be the possibility to just throw objects from the surface into space.<p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br />Actually, it could be quite dangerous. In order to leave, you have to risk hitting your missle, which would be impossible to track from Earth and downright close from the spacecraft. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Will Pittenger<hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Add this user box to your Wikipedia User Page to show your support for the SDC forums: <div style="margin-left:1em">{{User:Will Pittenger/User Boxes/Space.com Account}}</div> </div>

 

[holmec]

Hey for an extended compartment, ESA was thinking of using the Columbus module frame as one for a moon mission with RSA. So why not try to get ESA to make one for an asteroid mission with the Orion capsule? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p><font color="#0000ff"><em>"SCE to AUX" - John Aaron, curiosity pays off</em></font></p> </div>

 

[holmec]

"Compliting matters, that gravity would pull you in were the rock bulges out towards your orbit. "<br /><br />Nothing like getting smacked around by an asteroid....lol <img src="/images/icons/laugh.gif" /> <br /><br />"And here's the pitch out here in deep space. Orion throws a curve astronaut. Asteroid swings, and just glances off the astronaut causing him to spin out of control...foul ball!" <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p><font color="#0000ff"><em>"SCE to AUX" - John Aaron, curiosity pays off</em></font></p> </div>

 

[holmec]

Why a ship??? Just give an astronaut a beefed up jetpack and you should be good to go. Throw a tent down and viola ...smors! <br /><br />Its an asteroid...not the moon!!! <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p><font color="#0000ff"><em>"SCE to AUX" - John Aaron, curiosity pays off</em></font></p> </div>

 

[nyarlathotep]

<font color="yellow">Actually, it could be quite dangerous. In order to leave, you have to risk hitting your missle, which would be impossible to track from Earth and downright close from the spacecraft. </font><br /><br />If it was thrown while in a stiff space suit it would only be traveling at 10-20m/s. Unless you're flying in a tinfoil LEM it would harmlessly bounce off.

 

[galactichalo]

another jack of all trades spacecraft ?

 

[qso1]

The shuttle was criticized for being tasked to do too much. But what seems to have gone altogether unnoticed by critics making that charge is that the shuttle did all the tasks assigned to it very well. It was technically very successful, just not economically so.<br /><br />A craft like Orion should be able to handle going to an asteroid. Although it will have to be modified for that task. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><strong>My borrowed quote for the time being:</strong></p><p><em>There are three kinds of people in life. Those who make it happen, those who watch it happen...and those who do not know what happened.</em></p> </div>

 

[bpfeifer]

"The shuttle was criticized for being tasked to do too much. But what seems to have gone altogether unnoticed by critics making that charge is that the shuttle did all the tasks assigned to it very well. It was technically very successful, just not economically so."<br /><br />I don't think anyone criticises the Shuttles technological achievements. It's the economics that fell far short of expectations. And the economics fell in the pot because of all of the roles the vehicle was required to fulfill. It's an amazing machine, and no other vehicle is likely to duplicate it's ability to retrieve satellites or return large amounts of mass to the Earth during my lifetime. It just takes too many people and too many man-hours to get the thing into orbit. Important parts are too fragile, and it hauls unneded dead-weight into orbit on every flight. I love the Shuttle, that's why I'm disappplointed with it.<br /><br />The CEV was originally envisioned as a simple vehicle to get people to and from LEO. If you want to do any other mission, you tack on additional systems launched into orbit separately. This could easliy include a pod with an arm for satellite servicing. It could be a habitat module for month-long asteroid missions. It could be an earth-departure stage and a lunar lander for Moon missions. The CEV is supposed to bethe core of a tinker-toy style system. It's an interesting idea. I hope it works. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Brian J. Pfeifer http://sabletower.wordpress.com<br /> The Dogsoldier Codex http://www.lulu.com/sabletower<br /> </div>

 

[mrmorris]

<font color="yellow">"GalacticHalo: another jack of all trades spacecraft ?"</font><br /><br />The CEV is being designed specifically for the purpose of 'Missions beyond LEO'. This was initially aimed at the Moon and Mars. However Near Earth Asteroids certainly fit within the intent of the mission profile without stretching it at all.<br /><br /><br /><font color="orange">"qso1: A craft like Orion should be able to handle going to an asteroid. Although it will have to be modified for that task. "</font><br /><br />Orion isn't a spacecraft, it's a program. This would be like referring to the Command Module as 'A craft like Apollo'. <br /><br />The CEV itself shouldn't have to be modified for an NEA mission. They will certainly need something more powerful than the proposed Earth Departure Stage to get the CEV to said asteroid. Also they may well need an additional module to provide more space, or a means of grappling with/landing on/etc. with the NEA. Perhaps an 'Asteroid Module' (henceforth AM) something like a cross between the Apollo LM and the Soyuz Orbital module, that docks to the front of the CEV once it's in EO. It would have no engines per se, the gravity of the asteroid won't require a lander. However, I can see it providing:<br /><br />- Additional space/ECLSS during the flight.<br />- An airlock for EVAs to the asteroid.<br />- A means for the AM-CEV-Service Module/EDS to 'land on'/'grapple to' the asteroid without risk of damage to the CEV.<br /><br />When the crew is ready to depart the asteroid, the AM would likely remain -- providing continuing science capabilities.<br /><br />I went a bit further than I really intended to with this... but the point is, the CEV shouldn't have to change. Some additional module will need to be developed to provide the missing capabilities.

 

[qso1]

bpfeifer:<br />I don't think anyone criticises the Shuttles technological achievements.<br /><br />Me:<br />Sometimes it comes across that way. Anytime one reads comments such as jack of all trades it implies that a mistake was made in having the shuttle do too much when the facts are that the shuttle did just about everything it was tasked to do except rescue Skylab.<br /><br />And I certainly agree the shuttle has been a technical marvel, just not an economical one. But the opposite of tasking a craft to do a lot is making special purpose craft which can get just as expensive relatively speaking.<br /><br />Its like having a car with a trunk but being tasked to carry people but no cargo. The CEV should be capable of multitasking as long as the main task is getting to LEO. CEV or Orion will have to include modified designs to undertake asteroid missions. Mainly to increase propulsion/power and ECLSS, all of which should be well within our capabilities now. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><strong>My borrowed quote for the time being:</strong></p><p><em>There are three kinds of people in life. Those who make it happen, those who watch it happen...and those who do not know what happened.</em></p> </div>

 

[willpittenger]

FYI: Now that I think about it, the <i>Discovery Channel</i> had a show simulating a manned interplanetary mission. It went to more than just an asteroid, resulting in a longer trip. It included Venus, Mars, IO, and Saturn. The trip from Venus to Mars took them well inside the Venusian orbit. They had to use their engine section (which was large diameter) as a shield.<br /><br />By the time they left IO, one of the crew was suffering from a from of cancer. He died while they were at Saturn. The remaining crew voted to cut the mission short and return home. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Will Pittenger<hr style="margin-top:0.5em;margin-bottom:0.5em" />Add this user box to your Wikipedia User Page to show your support for the SDC forums: <div style="margin-left:1em">{{User:Will Pittenger/User Boxes/Space.com Account}}</div> </div>

 

[qso1]

I'd like to have seen that show. I can imagine someone dying of cancer especially if they were in the vicinity of Io and Jupiter, radiation city. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><strong>My borrowed quote for the time being:</strong></p><p><em>There are three kinds of people in life. Those who make it happen, those who watch it happen...and those who do not know what happened.</em></p> </div>

 

[JonClarke]

See<br /><br />http://www.bbc.co.uk/sn/tvradio/programmes/spaceodyssey/ <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><em>Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars</em>  Arthur Clarke</p> </div>

 

[no_way]

Wow, looks to be a great show, just read all the comments on IMDB ( http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0395417/ ) and its a definite must see, once it comes out on DVD or something EDIT: Its there http://www.amazon.com/Voyage-Planets-Beyond-Hyperspace-Suchet/dp/B0007Z0O0Y

 

[qso1]

Thanks JonClarke. I'm going to be perusing that link for a bit. Some nice CGI stuff too. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><strong>My borrowed quote for the time being:</strong></p><p><em>There are three kinds of people in life. Those who make it happen, those who watch it happen...and those who do not know what happened.</em></p> </div>

 

[docm]

Saw that on satellite a while back. An excellent piece of work.<br /><br />2 thumbs in LEO. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[JonClarke]

Not perfect, but very good all the same.<br /><br />Jon <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><em>Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars</em>  Arthur Clarke</p> </div>