Phoenix Mars Lander Extended Mission. Sol 90+ & R.I.P Sol 157.

3488 · Sep 29, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>What is the significance of this find? As always, thanks for the info and discussion. Posted by tampaDreamer</DIV>Sorry tampaDreamer, only just seen your question.This is a very significant find. The PH (8.3) of the regolith is very similar, actually almost a doppleganger of the PH of Earth's Oceans. To prevent acidification (mostly from volcanic sources) a buffering action takes place. With Earth a big part of it is the alkaline left behind by dead sea creatures. My home town in Britain is actually in a huge bowl of the stuff, a form of Calcium Carbonate, Chalk. On Mars the alkaline rich clays takes the role of the buffering, through non biological processes. Calcium Carbonates require long periods (biological or non biological, sounds like a damn washing powder) of liquid water to form & they prevent acidification. On Mars it was assumed that this could never happen (imagine the Sulphuric acid belched out when Olympus Mons, the other Tharsis volcanoes, Elysium volcanoes etc where active), Phoenix has clearly shown that it can & it does indeed happen.I did not quite get the gist of everything, but my scant knowledge is enough to see that Calcium Carbonates are a huge revelation in martian studies & overturns quite a few preconceived ideas. Some of this was hinted at with Mars Pathfinder & the MERs, but Phoenix has really turned the tables on this.Andrew Brown. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> "I suddenly noticed an anomaly to the left of Io, just off the rim of that world. It was extremely large with respect to the overall size of Io and crescent shaped. It seemed unbelievable that something that big had not been visible before". Linda Morabito on discovering that the Jupiter moon Io was volcanically active. Friday 9th March 1979.http://www.launchphotography.com/ http://anthmartian.googlepages.com/thisislandearthhttp://web.me.com/meridianijournal </div>

3488 · Sep 29, 2008

The LIDAR & TEGA Movies I could not get to work, but have still linked to them for others to try. Latest 360 degree Panorama scrolling view. <img src="http://sitelife.space.com/ver1.0/Content/images/store/3/4/9385d678-b826-4a8d-b485-8eff337b770d.Medium.jpg" alt="" /> LIDAR in operation. <img src="http://sitelife.space.com/ver1.0/Content/images/store/5/13/9547f7fe-4335-46a7-ad20-77706a71edc6.Medium.jpg" alt="" />  Full Size Sunrise on Sol 101 01:23 Hrs to 04:41 HRS LMST <img src="http://sitelife.space.com/ver1.0/Content/images/store/11/6/5bdd86c4-b823-48f5-9659-3e2af783616f.Medium.jpg" alt="" />  Delivery to TEGA. <img src="http://sitelife.space.com/ver1.0/Content/images/store/7/12/c7cf2aed-7872-4c14-ac7e-e4d512a09247.Medium.jpg" alt="" />  Andrew Brown. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> "I suddenly noticed an anomaly to the left of Io, just off the rim of that world. It was extremely large with respect to the overall size of Io and crescent shaped. It seemed unbelievable that something that big had not been visible before". Linda Morabito on discovering that the Jupiter moon Io was volcanically active. Friday 9th March 1979.http://www.launchphotography.com/ http://anthmartian.googlepages.com/thisislandearthhttp://web.me.com/meridianijournal </div>

efron_24 · Sep 29, 2008

Snowfall detected !I am soo happy now !http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/phoenix/news/phoenix-20080929.html what a great planet it is <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

MeteorWayne · Sep 29, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Snowfall detected !I am soo happy now !http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/phoenix/news/phoenix-20080929.htmlwhat a great planet it is Posted by efron_24</DIV> Well, more correctly, virga detected so far.Snowfall requires that it reaches the ground, which has not been confirmed so far. Perhaps it will before the lights go out. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

JonClarke · Sep 29, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Well, more correctly, virga detected so far.Snowfall requires that it reaches the ground, which has not been confirmed so far. Perhaps it will before the lights go out. Posted by MeteorWayne</DIV>Does the term virga apply to snow, or is it just rain?Maybe we will have a white Christmas! <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars Arthur Clarke </div>

Swampcat · Sep 29, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Does the term virga apply to snow, or is it just rain?Maybe we will have a white Christmas! Posted by jonclarke</DIV> According to Wikipedia, it applies to precipitation in general. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> ------------------------------------------------------------------- "I hold it that a little rebellion now and then is a good thing, and as necessary in the political world as storms in the physical. Unsuccessful rebellions, indeed, generally establish the encroachments on the rights of the people which have produced them. An observation of this truth should render honest republican governors so mild in their punishment of rebellions as not to discourage them too much. It is a medicine necessary for the sound health of government."Thomas Jefferson </div>

JonClarke · Sep 29, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Snowfall detected !I am soo happy now !http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/phoenix/news/phoenix-20080929.html what a great planet it is Posted by efron_24</DIV>Even more interesting are the other results in that release!Clay mineral morphologies in the AFM.  If correct this is the first -ground truth for their presence.  As far as I know there is no remote sensing for clays in this area, suggesting that, as I suspected, that clays may be more more extensive that shown by spectrometry.  There should we water release spikes at key temperatures if there are indeed significant clays there.Carbonates appear to be almost confirmed. The alkaline results from the MECA suggested that if we were doing to find carbonates, this would be the spot.  The water chemistry results (pH 8.3) is typical of carbonate buffering, and tere was a CO2 spike in TEGA at the right temperature.The SDC story http://www.space.com/missionlaunches/080929-phoenix-update.html mentions that perchlorates may act as soil dessicants.  I wonder where they got it from?  Comments at a press conference?  This is new to me, but many salts are dessicants, so perhaps i should not be too surprised.  Tthere is very little we know about perchlorate minerals as they are so rare on Earth (none even have names).  Dessicants would explain the soil humdity profiles (or lack thereof).Jon <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars Arthur Clarke </div>

franontanaya · Sep 29, 2008

Yes, they commented that one possibility is that perclorates are acting as dessicants. They even suggested the idea of wet ground when the martian axis tilts towards the Sun. That left me wondering about the scaloped terrain at lower latitudes of the Northern Plains. It looks basically the same than the terrain at Phoenix, but it is about 15º closer to the equator. Temperatures must be higher there at midday, and there's clearly sublimation going on, unlike at Green Valley, which seems quite frozen.I posted about them here in 2006:http://uplink.space.com/showthreaded.php?Cat=&Board=sciastro&Number=634717&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=7&o=0&vc=1 After seeing Holy Cow, I really really think that soil falling from slopes or any small meteorite impact could expose ice, and it's going to be hotter there. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

JonClarke · Sep 29, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Yes, they commented that one possibility is that perclorates are acting as dessicants. They even suggested the idea of wet ground when the martian axis tilts towards the Sun. That left me wondering about the scaloped terrain at lower latitudes of the Northern Plains. It looks basically the same than the terrain at Phoenix, but it is about 15º closer to the equator. Temperatures must be higher there at midday, and there's clearly sublimation going on, unlike at Green Valley, which seems quite frozen.I posted about them here in 2006:http://uplink.space.com/showthreaded.php?Cat=&Board=sciastro&Number=634717&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=7&o=0&vc=1 After seeing Holy Cow, I really really think that soil falling from slopes or any small meteorite impact could expose ice, and it's going to be hotter there. Posted by franontanaya</DIV>During periods of maximum (~50 degreees) obliquity the Phoenix site is effectively 25 degrees colser to the sub solar point and still enjoys ~170 days of continuous sunlight.  It is easy to see how it might get warm enough for ice  to melt. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars Arthur Clarke </div>

franontanaya · Sep 29, 2008

That sounds huge.Please, excuse my ignorance. Can calcium carbonate buffer the soil pH without liquid water? If not, I hope they can gather enough data to see how long the pH would remain stable without buffering, and therefore how much time has past since that part of the Northern Plains saw liquid water. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

3488 · Sep 30, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>During periods of maximum (~50 degreees) obliquity the Phoenix site is effectively 25 degrees colser to the sub solar point and still enjoys ~170 days of continuous sunlight.  It is easy to see how it might get warm enough for ice  to melt. Posted by jonclarke</DIV>That's a good point Jon. In fact the seasons would even have been more savage than now. Warmer Summers for sure, but the Winters, surely colder. Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>That sounds huge.Please, excuse my ignorance. Can calcium carbonate buffer the soil pH without liquid water? If not, I hope they can gather enough data to see how long the pH would remain stable without buffering, and therefore how much time has past since that part of the Northern Plains saw liquid water. Posted by franontanaya</DIV>Hi franontanaya,I hoped the time scales would have been mentioned, but as Wayne said a few posts back, it is likely to be chaotic as Mars is often closer to Jupiter & with Mars's small mass, Jupiter may well have a profound long term effects on Mars's obliquity. Jupiter may also have stunted the growth of Mars during the planetary formative period (though not as much as 1 Ceres, 2 Pallas & 4 Vesta, which IMO were trying to form into planets before being cut short) & since Jupiter has continued to play an important role in Mars's long term climatological changes.Andrew Brown.   <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> "I suddenly noticed an anomaly to the left of Io, just off the rim of that world. It was extremely large with respect to the overall size of Io and crescent shaped. It seemed unbelievable that something that big had not been visible before". Linda Morabito on discovering that the Jupiter moon Io was volcanically active. Friday 9th March 1979.http://www.launchphotography.com/ http://anthmartian.googlepages.com/thisislandearthhttp://web.me.com/meridianijournal </div>

JonClarke · Sep 30, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>That sounds huge.Please, excuse my ignorance. Can calcium carbonate buffer the soil pH without liquid water? If not, I hope they can gather enough data to see how long the pH would remain stable without buffering, and therefore how much time has past since that part of the Northern Plains saw liquid water. Posted by franontanaya</DIV>I am not a chemist but I would have thought that liquid water was needed for the buffer to act.I think the olquity changes on mars are on a scale of a million years or so.  So perhalfs half a million years ago this place could ave been relatively warm and moist.Jon <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars Arthur Clarke </div>

JonClarke · Sep 30, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>That's a good point Jon. In fact the seasons would even have been more savage than now. Warmer Summers for sure, but the Winters, surely colder.Hi franontanaya,I hoped the time scales would have been mentioned, but as Wayne said a few posts back, it is likely to be chaotic as Mars is often closer to Jupiter & with Mars's small mass, Jupiter may well have a profound long term effects on Mars's obliquity. Jupiter may also have stunted the growth of Mars during the planetary formative period & since Jupiter has continued to play an important role in Mars's long term climatological changes.Andrew Brown.  Posted by 3488</DIV>Hi AndrewIt certainly would have been different.  At high obliquity the poles would have been more equitable than the equator.  Ice would have accumulated there, rather than at the poles.The Earth too may have experienced great changes in obliquity, and it is the best explanation of the low latitude ice ages of the Precambrian.Jon <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars Arthur Clarke </div>

newtons_laws · Sep 30, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>.Previous thinking was Magnesium Sulphates (Epson Salts) as found by MERs, but Perchlorates appear to be newly found at the Phoenix site..  Posted by 3488</DIV>That should of course be Epsom salt (Epsom is an old spa town in Surrey, England, but as a fellow Brit I'm sure you knew that).  Nothing to do with printer manufacturers!  <img src="http://sitelife.space.com/ver1.0/content/scripts/tinymce/plugins/emotions/images/smiley-laughing.gif" border="0" alt="Laughing" title="Laughing" />   <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

cello · Sep 30, 2008

Is there any theoretical possibility, that Phoenix might resurrect after polar night? Daylight is back. Ice is melted. Solar cells collect light. Could it power on and contact us? Of course, everything would be frozen colder than cold. Anyway.

MeteorWayne · Sep 30, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Is there any theoretical possibility, that Phoenix might resurrect after polar night?Daylight is back. Ice is melted. Solar cells collect light. Could it power on and contact us?Of course, everything would be frozen colder than cold. Anyway. Posted by cello</DIV> While the possibility is not zero, it's darned close. They were asked a question about that and detailed some of the bad things that will happen at winter temps, including the circuit board itself turning glassy which leads to cracks in the printed wiring, batteries being uncharged and frozen. By October 2009 enough sunlight would be available in the unlikely event it survives, so they will try listening as there is a Lazerus mode programmed in to try if it's alive.Realistically, no one expects that.They discussed in some detail how long it is likely to last. By the end of November, it will be consuming more power than available.During summer, input was about 3500 watt-hours, as of Sol 120 it was 2100 wH.By November and December it will be a weather station at best. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

3488 · Sep 30, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Hi AndrewIt certainly would have been different.  At high obliquity the poles would have been more equitable than the equator.  Ice would have accumulated there, rather than at the poles.The Earth too may have experienced great changes in obliquity, and it is the best explanation of the low latitude ice ages of the Precambrian.Jon Posted by jonclarke</DIV>Hi Jon, yes that's a good point. The Earth's snowball phases have never been satifactorarily explained IIRC, but major obliquity  swings would certainly explain a great deal. Mind you, the Moon being quite large & massive in respect to the Earth is thought to help stabilize our planet, but then I suppose the very long term effects in the remote past, are poorly understood. What would be interesting, would be to see what Earth & Mars were both like approx 1 GYA, when Jupiter's moon Ganymede underwent a renewed flush of activity (when the Jovecentric orbit was temporarily changed into a more elliptical one, stoking up internal heating), perhaps clues to a massive object passing through the solar system, a possible rogue planet passing through??????????? Just clutching at straws here!!!!!!!!! Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>That should of course be Epsom salt (Epsom is an old spa town in Surrey, England, but as a fellow Brit I'm sure you knew that).  Nothing to do with printer manufacturers!     Posted by newtons_laws</DIV>Hi newtons-laws.Yes I saw that, a mistyping error. Not too far from my home area. Ever been to put a wager on the horses??????? <img src="http://sitelife.space.com/ver1.0/content/scripts/tinymce/plugins/emotions/images/smiley-laughing.gif" border="0" alt="Laughing" title="Laughing" />Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Is there any theoretical possibility, that Phoenix might resurrect after polar night?Daylight is back. Ice is melted. Solar cells collect light. Could it power on and contact us?Of course, everything would be frozen colder than cold. Anyway. Posted by cello</DIV>Hi cello.Good thought process, but probably, in fact most likely will not happen.Whilst it is not known precisely what will happen to Phoenix, somethings are known regarding how materials behave.Firstly CO2 ice / snow WILL bury Phoenix. That is not an if, but a when. CO2 ice is heavy, even under Mars's 37.8% surface gravity, that ice will weigh heavily on the solar arrays, more than likely snapping them clean off Phoenix & maybe make Phoenix too heavy herself for the support legs, buckling them & pushing the lander into the regolith.If the ice builds up from the ground instead, then weight will not be an issue, BUT the temperatures will be. It was mentioned yesterday, that there is evidence that the Phoenix site could well drop to -150 C / -238 F (unexpected initially as the bottom out point was thought to be -135 C / -211 F, but new information appears to have prompted that statement from the Phoenix Team), that is as cold as Jupiter's moons. The soldering & connectors within Phoenix will glastinate i.e become so hard & brittle that they shrink & snap.Also with Phoenix being encased, any movement of that ice will likely break & twist the lander anyway.Phoenix has been uploaded a LAZARUS software package that will enable Phoenix to call Earth automatically should the solar arrays still work & the lander has survived the Winter with little damage. The next Spring Equinox in not until late October 2009 (Winter Solstice in May 2009). Worth mentioning & I think I've said this several times already, the Sun will NOT rise at all from the Phoenix site, from: Monday 6th April 2009 to Monday 6th July 2009 inclusive. Unless a miracle happens, Phoenix WILL NOT be surviving the Martian arctic Winter.Andrew Brown. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> "I suddenly noticed an anomaly to the left of Io, just off the rim of that world. It was extremely large with respect to the overall size of Io and crescent shaped. It seemed unbelievable that something that big had not been visible before". Linda Morabito on discovering that the Jupiter moon Io was volcanically active. Friday 9th March 1979.http://www.launchphotography.com/ http://anthmartian.googlepages.com/thisislandearthhttp://web.me.com/meridianijournal </div>

3488 · Sep 30, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>While the possibility is not zero, it's darned close. They were asked a question about that and detailed some of the bad things that will happen at winter temps, including the circuit board itself turning glassy which leads to cracks in the printed wiring, batteries being uncharged and frozen. By October 2009 enough sunlight would be available in the unlikely event it survives, so they will try listening as there is a Lazerus mode programmed in to try if it's alive.Realistically, no one expects that.They discussed in some detail how long it is likely to last. By the end of November, it will be consuming more power than available.During summer, input was about 3500 watt-hours, as of Sol 120 it was 2100 wH.By November and December it will be a weather station at best. Posted by MeteorWayne</DIV>That's very true Wayne. I hope the SSI can still take images as it is a low consumption instrument, interesting skies & accumulation of ice, so will be plenty of interest to see, but as you say, really, the priority will be weather monitoring.Andrew Brown. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> "I suddenly noticed an anomaly to the left of Io, just off the rim of that world. It was extremely large with respect to the overall size of Io and crescent shaped. It seemed unbelievable that something that big had not been visible before". Linda Morabito on discovering that the Jupiter moon Io was volcanically active. Friday 9th March 1979.http://www.launchphotography.com/ http://anthmartian.googlepages.com/thisislandearthhttp://web.me.com/meridianijournal </div>

centsworth_II · Sep 30, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>I am not a chemist but I would have thought that liquid water was needed for the buffer to act. Posted by jonclarke</DIV> The buffering capability of the soil is determined in the MECA wet lab after water has been added so they are not relying on the sample to exhibit buffering capabilities as is. (I'm not a chemist either.) <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

MeteorWayne · Sep 30, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>That's very true Wayne. I hope the SSI can still take images as it is a low consumption instrument, interesting skies & accumulation of ice, so will be plenty of interest to see, but as you say, really, the priority will be weather monitoring.Andrew Brown. Posted by 3488</DIV> Oh and Barry Goldstien did say that the requests have been put in to image the site from orbit with MRO during winter. Since he used to work for them, he "thinks" the requests will be honored (wink,wink, nudge,nudge) <img src="http://sitelife.space.com/ver1.0/content/scripts/tinymce/plugins/emotions/images/smiley-wink.gif" border="0" alt="Wink" title="Wink" /><img src="http://sitelife.space.com/ver1.0/content/scripts/tinymce/plugins/emotions/images/smiley-wink.gif" border="0" alt="Wink" title="Wink" /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

3488 · Sep 30, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Oh and Barry Goldstien did say that the requests have been put in to image the site from orbit with MRO during winter. Since he used to work for them, he "thinks" the requests will be honored (wink,wink, nudge,nudge) Posted by MeteorWayne</DIV>Guess who was one of those who put in a formal request for said observations to the HiRISE team??? (cough cough). <img src="http://sitelife.space.com/ver1.0/content/scripts/tinymce/plugins/emotions/images/smiley-wink.gif" border="0" alt="Wink" title="Wink" /> Andrew Brown. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> "I suddenly noticed an anomaly to the left of Io, just off the rim of that world. It was extremely large with respect to the overall size of Io and crescent shaped. It seemed unbelievable that something that big had not been visible before". Linda Morabito on discovering that the Jupiter moon Io was volcanically active. Friday 9th March 1979.http://www.launchphotography.com/ http://anthmartian.googlepages.com/thisislandearthhttp://web.me.com/meridianijournal </div>

exoscientist · Sep 30, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Snowfall detected !I am soo happy now ! http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/phoenix/news/phoenix-20080929.html what a great planet it is Posted by efron_24</DIV>  Once you let the camel's nose under the tent ...   Since it is now known that precipitation can fall from Martian clouds at north polar locations and possibly reach the ground, perhaps it will be accepted the same can happen at other locations: <img src="http://sitelife.space.com/ver1.0/Content/images/store/9/7/794be793-ac18-4496-9764-2123336147cb.Medium.jpg" alt="" />(see for full-size :http://sciforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3999 ) From: Adsorption water driven processes on Mars. D. Möhlmann http://sci.esa.int/science-e/www/object/doc.cfm?fobjectid=36779 See also: Reflectance of fog in Valles Marineris. A. Inada http://sci.esa.int/science-e/www/object/doc.cfm?fobjectid=36724     Bob Clark <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

franontanaya · Sep 30, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>The buffering capability of the soil is determined in the MECA wet lab after water has been added so they are not relying on the sample to exhibit buffering capabilities as is. (I'm not a chemist either.) Posted by centsworth_II</DIV>Good point! But then, the soil pH won't be 8.3. Instead, it may be lower or higher, and it would be stabilized to 8.3 by the calcium carbonates when the sample is mixed with water inside MECA.Either 8.3 pH is the value at the start of the analysis, at the end, or it has been deducted from the analysis. <img src="http://sitelife.space.com/ver1.0/content/scripts/tinymce/plugins/emotions/images/smiley-undecided.gif" border="0" alt="Undecided" title="Undecided" />   <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

3488 · Sep 30, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Good point! But then, the soil pH won't be 8.3. Instead, it may be lower or higher, and it would be stabilized to 8.3 by the calcium carbonates when the sample is mixed with water inside MECA.Either 8.3 pH is the value at the start of the analysis, at the end, or it has been deducted from the analysis.   Posted by franontanaya</DIV>Hi franontanaya,Good point. All readings like those are deduced from the analysis. If the MECA results showed a PH of 8.3, than that was what it was to start with. As you correctly say, the process of examination with MECA using the demineralized on board water, may change it through the process, but the PH of the regolith would have been detectable with immediate effect.IIRC, during the development of MECA on board the assumed crashed Mars Polar Lander in 1999, was deliberately tested as to be able to detect the PH of regolith with immediate effect into the beaker. The MECA on Phoenix is a clone & would have undergone the same prelaunch scrutiny.Andrew Brown.  <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> "I suddenly noticed an anomaly to the left of Io, just off the rim of that world. It was extremely large with respect to the overall size of Io and crescent shaped. It seemed unbelievable that something that big had not been visible before". Linda Morabito on discovering that the Jupiter moon Io was volcanically active. Friday 9th March 1979.http://www.launchphotography.com/ http://anthmartian.googlepages.com/thisislandearthhttp://web.me.com/meridianijournal </div>

centsworth_II · Sep 30, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>... the soil pH won't be 8.3. Instead, it may be lower or higher, and it would be stabilized to 8.3 by the calcium carbonates when the sample is mixed with water... Posted by franontanaya</DIV> I don't know if there is a continual measure of pH as the sample is stirred, or if they just get the end point.  It's interesting to wonder what the soil pH would be without the carbonates present, but then it would be different soil, not the soil found by Phoenix. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

Phoenix Mars Lander Extended Mission. Sol 90+ & R.I.P Sol 157.

3488

Guest

3488

Guest

efron_24

Guest

MeteorWayne

Guest

JonClarke

Guest

Swampcat

Guest

JonClarke

Guest

franontanaya

Guest

JonClarke

Guest

franontanaya

Guest

3488

Guest

JonClarke

Guest

JonClarke

Guest

newtons_laws

Guest

cello

Guest

MeteorWayne

Guest

3488

Guest

3488

Guest

centsworth_II

Guest

MeteorWayne

Guest

3488

Guest

exoscientist

Guest

franontanaya

Guest

3488

Guest

centsworth_II

Guest

Similar threads

TRENDING THREADS

Latest posts

Moderators online

Share this page