STS-114 Mission Update Thread (Part 5)

[erioladastra]

Yes, gloved hands with up to 5-10 lbs force, then forceps, then hacksaw that is bent (works pretty well but of course makes people nervous), then scissors but that is is not idea since can't cut to less than 1/4 inch and danger of damaging TPS. Steve will be on the SSRMS witht he OBSS giving additional views. The EVA will start with the ESP2, then while the arm is walking off the crew will do some shorter tasks, then go do the gap filler removal.

 

[Astrosag]

Don't mean to be ignorant at all, but low on time so I was hoping to get an answer as to what these "gap-fillers" are. Are they tools, or devices accidentally left on during launch? I can't see how it could be something that was accidentally left on but then again, thats the only thing that comes to mind. Thanks and lets hope for the best...looking better and better for discovery!

 

[Astrosag]

Red is right..they'll try to pull them and then if that does't work, they'll cut them. <br /><br />Why are people judging what to do when it sounds like it involves the aerodynamics of the vehicle and thermal issues that most everyone here probably doesntknow much about?<br /><br />For those of you familiar with aerodynamics and etc, would CFD analysis be done here?

 

[Astrosag]

I agree..partly why I dont understand why people are claiming that one method is better than the other...how would they know (ie. pulling vs. cutting)...by people im talking about some sdc folks. But alls is good. So news, could you tell me what this "gap filler" is?

 

[shuttle_rtf]

Some images on here<br />http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=237&start=31&posts=37<br /><br />Page four if it doesn't go directly to the images.

 

[redgryphon]

This question came up at the mission status briefing. The answer was that station communications should still work, (I'd guess through the UHF antenna often seen on NASA TV) and can then be routed through to the shuttle.

 

[Astrosag]

Thanks news, rtf, and shuttle_guy...makes crystal clear sense. While streaming nasa tv at work I thought I heard that this may not be an isolated event...which is obviously understandable. So in essence, its highly likely its happend before but since this time it caught NASA's eye, they're running numbers and analysis on it..good method. Just a statement, no question nor remark.

 

[bushuser]

I'm sure someone at USA has already considered this, but is there "glue" on these gap fillers? If so, I would worry that simply pulling them out could place traction on that side of the tile & weaken the bonding of the tiles themselves. <br /><br />Maybe cutting off the excess is safer.

 

[najab]

I'm not a TPS expert (nor to I play one on TV) but to the best of my knowledge the gap-fillers are simply friction fit into place.

 

[llivinglarge]

Why can't they be put back into place?

 

[emerrill]

"Why can't they be put back into place?"<br /><br />If the just push them back into place, I would think they risk them falling back down when they start re-entry (and I dont think you want to be pushing toward the tiles, I would think that you have a much higher risk of collateral damage trying to push them back in.).<br /><br />There is no reason to leave them in place, to the best of my knowledge they provide little added value to the heat properties TPS system, they are just there to help in flexing and whatnot.<br /><br />Correct?<br /><br />-eric <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[llivinglarge]

If a tile comes off during the repair, could that be fixed or replaced?

 

[cello]

what was those "ufos"? between station and earth. live nasa tv NOW. gmt 08:21. <br /><br />10 to 20 objects, different speed and trajectories. somebody has explanation of phenomena?

 

[earth_bound_misfit]

I would love to see a replay of that! Some how I think thats not going to happen, not on NasaTv anyhow, though someone will have it recorded somewhere.<br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p> </p><p>----------------------------------------------------------------- </p><p>Wanna see this site looking like the old SDC uplink?</p><p>Go here to see how: <strong>SDC Eye saver </strong>  </p> </div>

 

[cello]

yeah. does somebody recorded nasa tv on that event? maybe shuttle_rtf?

 

[cello]

since there will be extra eva. and planned repair works shouldn't take much time. is it reasonable to add some additional, not planned yet, tasks to that extra eva?

 

[shuttle_rtf]

>yeah. does somebody recorded nasa tv on that event? maybe shuttle_rtf?<<br /><br />I missed it, but we're recording as much as possible by way of image capture on to the update threads for each mission day.<br /><br />Fanstastic air to ground conference just now. Lots of great quotes.

 

[cello]

aha. there is. especially japanese ones. not a clue what they talking about <img src="/images/icons/smile.gif" /><br />and russian. but those i understand <img src="/images/icons/wink.gif" />

 

[halman]

najaB,<br /><br />I have to wonder how many people who post here have any grasp of how incredible the Thermal Protection System is. A method of absorbing heat energy of terrific intensity, without allowing it to travel a few centimeters. Material which must withstand not only high temperatures, but pressure waves and shock waves as well. This system had to be engineered so that, when the tiles absorbed heat and expanded, they did not cause each other to shatter. The evidence of lost tiles, gap filler material, and impact damge has proven over the years that this system has exceded the best hopes of its designers. Any system will fail if abused enough, and foam strikes had been getting worse when Columbia was lost. The failure was not with the Thermal Protection System, it was with the foam installation on the External Tank.<br /><br />Hopefully, someday a Thermal Protection System which is reusable but does not require extensive overhaul after each flight can be perfected. Until that time, we will probably go back to the good old ablative heat sheilds, which were designed to desintigrate, so as to carry the heat away from the capsule. Probably the simplest part of the whole rocket, especially when the capsules will almost certainly be small enough to fit in the payload bay of the shuttle. At least we got to see some inspired engineering! <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> The secret to peace of mind is a short attention span. </div>

 

[shuttle_rtf]

>So they are going to use the Canadarm to access the underbelly of the Shuttle. That means that they could have used the Canadarm to inspect Columbia.<<br /><br /><br />Robinson is being taken out by the Space Station's Robotic Arm. Columbia didn't go to the ISS.

 

[najab]

<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p>So they are going to use the Canadarm to access the underbelly of the Shuttle. That means that they could have used the Canadarm to inspect Columbia.<p><hr /></p></p></blockquote>No. The "Canada Arm" is the <b>space station</b> remote manipulator system, Columbia <b>was not</b> at the station! Also, Columbia did not carry a RMS since it's mission did not require any EVA activity. I humbly suggest that in future you do a little research before you post.

 

[najab]

Okay, explain to me how the (S)RMS could have been used on STS-107 when (a) the Shuttle was not at Station; and (b) the Shuttle did not have the RMS installed?

 

[shuttle_rtf]

Get bedsheets out of SpaceHab, tie them together, swing over prison escape stylee <img src="/images/icons/wink.gif" />

 

[drwayne]

Given the SpaceHab module was in the Columbia cargo bay, could an EVA have started from the normal cargo bay hatch?<br /><br />Given the position of the cargo bay doors, assuming you had someone secured in the cargo bay, could they have seen around the doors and seen the damage site?<br /><br />Wayne <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p>"1) Give no quarter; 2) Take no prisoners; 3) Sink everything."  Admiral Jackie Fisher</p> </div>

 

[ozspace]

Given the success of the OBSS and the fact that it has done a good job of surveying the orbiter, I wonder if they will opt to include as standard equipment for the remaining shuttle flights? Current plans call for it to be used for just the first two "test flights" right? <br /><br />Having said that, am I right in my understanding that the dislodged gap fillers were not, in fact, picked up in the OBSS scans but on the photo survey by the ISS crew?