Will sick people be allowed to go into space?

[grokme]

With the new space tourism around the corner, what do you think will be the standards for allowing sick people to go up? Are we excluded from this right, or do you just have to have enough money? If you have a non communicable disease, can you go up, or will they say that there's no medical infrastructure in place to handle an emergency. Has anyone even thought of this? I know they always had real strict standards for the astronauts, but now we are talking about civilians, and we know a lot more about survivability in speace.

Also, what benefits could sick people reap in space? I mean, aren't there diseases that could benefit from zero gravity? Would people with hip and knee problems actually obtain relief from being in space. Could it be a way to heal quicker?

 

[grokme]

Woops, I meant to post this in Space Business. Could the mods move it? Or is there a more suitable spot?

 

[bdewoody]

I have an even better question. Will they allow handicapped people to become permanent space station or moon base personnel. I talking about those of us who primarily have to get around in wheelchairs because we are too weak in our legs to walk. Muscle atrophy would not be an issue here and we might be able to adapt to weightlessness or reduced gravity better than those who are physically robust. I know it would be a one way trip and some would probably not like that aspect, but for me personaly I would go in a heartbeat.

 

[grokme]

I have an even better question. Will they allow handicapped people to become permanent space station or moon base personnel. I talking about those of us who primarily have to get around in wheelchairs because we are too weak in our legs to walk. Muscle atrophy would not be an issue here and we might be able to adapt to weightlessness or reduced gravity than those who are physically robust. I know it would be a one way trip and some would probably not like that aspect, but for me personaly I would go in a heartbeat.

Yes that was what I was wondering about with the people with knee and hip problems. If space is beneficial to some, and harmful to others, we are going to have a lot of discontent people on our hands. I could foresee a whole new specialty that looks into the effect of space on certain health conditions and determines outcomes for patients in space. Maybe the insurance would pay for the trip if space would help your health!! That would be cool.

For example, I have an aortic aneuryism. Is that good or bad in space. Seems like my heart rate would be lower and my heart would not have to work as hard in lower gravity. So, would that prolong the need for surgery? I know the cost right now for travel outweighs the benefit, but maybe one day it would be cost effective.

 

[MeteorWayne]

I'll move it for you- Wayne

 

[grokme]

Thanks for moving it. I was thinking about this some more, and I think this could be huge once they get people up to space cheaply, probably about the time we get a space elevator. You could take a health holiday up there and relax, rest those weary bones. I imagine there will be a lot of study on the effects to cancer and other diseases to see how those mature in space.

 

[DarkenedOne]

With the new space tourism around the corner, what do you think will be the standards for allowing sick people to go up? Are we excluded from this right, or do you just have to have enough money? If you have a non communicable disease, can you go up, or will they say that there's no medical infrastructure in place to handle an emergency. Has anyone even thought of this? I know they always had real strict standards for the astronauts, but now we are talking about civilians, and we know a lot more about survivability in speace.

Also, what benefits could sick people reap in space? I mean, aren't there diseases that could benefit from zero gravity? Would people with hip and knee problems actually obtain relief from being in space. Could it be a way to heal quicker?

The anwser will probably be no because experiements aboard the ISS have indicated that bateria and viruses seem to be more virulent in a microgravity environment. Thus an individual with an illness will probably not fair too well in space.

 

[moonfie]

Hi everyone! This is my first post on SDC

That's an interesting question! I'd like to think that as long as the disease isn't communicable, that it should be the potential space tourist's choice whether they want to take the risk of going into space or not. However, I have a feeling that most space tourism companies would keep them grounded in order to avoid lawsuits should the worst happen. I don't like it, but that's the way society is, at least in America. In other countries it might be different, but I'm not sure.

I remember in the movie version of Contact (not sure about the book, it's been awhile) one of the characters has terminal cancer and lives permanently on a space station because the microgravity supposedly slows the disease. Unfortunately I'm no biology, so I have no idea if this was based on scientific possibility or it was just there to drive the plot .

I agree with a previous poster, though, that I'd really be interested in seeing how the physically handicapped fare in microgravity. I think in that specific case that it would actually be very beneficial in several ways. The person going into space would benefit because in this specific case I think being in microgravity would allow more freedom of movement than being on Earth, and it would also benefit the space program because those who aren't as concerned about muscle atrophy might be able to adapt to the microgravity environment, and then re-adapt to life on Earth, more quickly. I'd never really thought about it, but it's really interesting.

 

[bdewoody]

Thank's for the backup moonfire but I have a feeling that a handicapped person such as myself would be unable to return to earth after staying in a microgravity environment for any length of time. My point was that I would be willing to pass on a return to earth in return for the increased mobility that living in space would provide.

 

[grokme]

Well, I think it is something that should be explored in detail. First, for the disabled people, and then for people with other conditions. Like I mentioned earlier, I have an aortic aneuryism in my chest, and I'm not allowed to do anymore than 30 minutes of walking a day. They think it would task my heart too much to do any more than that. Getting me into space would be a problem as I'm sure the g forces would kill me. However, when they create all this cool space elevator stuff, then that would not be a consideration anymore. Then, people like me could go up and may benefit from living in that type of environment.

I think they should take it on a case by case basis, but we will see. Usually we are hit with some blanket exclusion and cut out of bits and pieces of society here and there. Can't join a health club. Can't go on roller coasters. Must get releases for this and that. It would be nice if someone would think this through and come up with a protocol for handling specific cases. I think this is a market that could open up one day.

 

[grokme]

Hi everyone! This is my first post on SDC

I remember in the movie version of Contact (not sure about the book, it's been awhile) one of the characters has terminal cancer and lives permanently on a space station because the microgravity supposedly slows the disease. Unfortunately I'm no biology, so I have no idea if this was based on scientific possibility or it was just there to drive the plot .

I agree with a previous poster, though, that I'd really be interested in seeing how the physically handicapped fare in microgravity. I think in that specific case that it would actually be very beneficial in several ways. The person going into space would benefit because in this specific case I think being in microgravity would allow more freedom of movement than being on Earth, and it would also benefit the space program because those who aren't as concerned about muscle atrophy might be able to adapt to the microgravity environment, and then re-adapt to life on Earth, more quickly. I'd never really thought about it, but it's really interesting.

Welcome to SDC! I too thought of Contact when creating the thread. There seems to be a whole field that could be created just on this question alone. Can't wait until they get ordinary people into space on a regular basis. Then this floodgates will open for all kinds of innovation.

 

[docm]

Stephen Hawking is slated to have a ride on VSS Enterprise and has taken his ride in a vomit comet, so if you're healthier than him....

Medically you wouldn't want someone with an active infection or compromised immune system (HIV, uncontrolled diabetes etc.), but if those are out and the person is in reasonable cardiovascular health I don't see a problem. These days you can pull more than 3-4 G's on a roller coaster.

 

[grokme]

I guess you can go if you're as famous and rich (is he rich?) as Stephen Hawking anyways. That's always been the rule though. If you're rich, you can pretty much do anything. I guess I'm talking about the point in time when the middle class can go. Oh, and I probably can't ride coasters anymore if I ask my cardiologist.

 

[EarthlingX]

I think, that advances in interfacing human nervous system with electronics will enable many people, with what is currently considered disability or sickness, to be at least as effective as the rest, in not more, considering that they are more focused on making most of what they have healthy. I'm referring to examples like better use of remaining senses for people that loose one of them. We humans are adaptable, most of all known life-forms.
There are also many advances in remote medicine and remote operations, and i think all apply.

I'm just afraid that first will go people, with whom is expected to be the least trouble, but there is a future in this idea, and possible hope for many.

 

[bushuser]

As long as there is money to be made, someone will eventually offer this to the wealthy.
Considering the trouble that the return to earth causes for healthy folks, I think you must view it as a 1-way trip for the unhealthy.

I find the prospect of a lifetime of isolation on the ISS, away from family/friends, to be unappealing. But if you can build a sustainable community for disabled folks to enjoy [indeed, to work and participate meaningfully in]--then it becomes a great service for humanity. A lunar colony at 1/6 G might work well for this.

 

[moonfie]

Yeah, I suppose in retrospect returning to Earth wouldn't be such a possibility, so it would be a serious decision for anyone thinking about living in space for that reason. If space tourism becomes affordable, though, friends and family could potentially visit space station residents, so it wouldn't be utter isolation. I agree with Bushuser though that it would be better to create an orbital community where the disabled could work and participate, rather than just becoming a big floating nursing home -- although, come to think of it, an orbital retirement home or assisted living type thing might be interesting, too, provided there was a way of getting there that was less, um, gravitationally intense.

As I recall, wasn't this one of Tsiolkovsky's prime motivations for studying rocketry? I remember learning that he was really frail, and wanted to live in microgravity so that he could be on an equal footing, so to speak, with stronger folks.

 

[EarthlingX]

I had to check, which was a pleasure, great man Tsiolkovsky:
The life of Konstantin Eduardovitch Tsiolkovsky

He was born on September 17,1857, in the village of Ijevskoe, Ryasan Province, Russia, the son a a Polish forester who had emigrated to Russia. He was not from a rich family, but a very large one; Konstantin Tsiolkovsky had 17 brothers and sisters. At the age of 10 he lost his hearing as the result of scarlet fever. After that he couldn't attend school, and he never recieved any formal education. The knowledge and education he attained were acheived by himself. His books were his teachers, and he read every book in his father's library. Tsiolkovsky later remembered that his hearing loss influenced greatly his future life: during all his life he tried to prove to himself and to others that he was better and more clever than others, even with his disability.

We have Net now for a library

He preferred solitude of his cabin, i'm guessing, he would feel quite comfortable in a far-side moon observatory

 

[neilsox]

I'm a strong believer in self determination, so I think rich people should be allowed to go to space, and stay as long as they like, if they can pay big bucks, even if all the doctors advise no. The only ban is for persons likely to infect the rest of the crew and serious cases of mental illness. Present rockets can max at two g instead of 3 or 4g, but it does reduce the payload at least a little. Let's try it and see what the survival rate is. It might be surprisingly good for nearly all infirmities as people typically are healthier if the can do big adventures. Neil

 

[Eman_3]

At present, the only way to get into space as a tourist is via the Russians, and that used to involve a short stay at the ISS. Obviously, a communicable disease would not be tolerated. But even that avenue is closing, the Russians will not do this much longer.

For the future, Virgin Galactic appears the way to go, but it's nothing but a glorified elevator trip. And there is only six minutes of zero-G.

But obviously, this kind of adventure will remain the domain of the rich and adventurous for now. And really, what well-heeled person would tolerate sharing a ride with someone with the sniffles? They paid two hundred grand for this?

One interesting book by Heinlein, called "Waldo.

Waldo (1942) is a short story by Robert A. Heinlein originally published in Astounding Magazine in August 1942 under the pseudonym Anson MacDonald. It is available in the book Waldo & Magic, Inc., as well as other collections. This story is not related to the story "Magic, Inc." other than both stories being about magic in one form or another.

The essence of the story is the journey of a mechanical genius from his self-imposed exile from the rest of humanity to a more normal life, conquering the disease myasthenia gravis as well as his own contempt for humans in general. The key to this is that magic is loose in the world, but in a logical and scientific way.

Waldo Farthingwaite-Jones was born a weakling, unable even to lift his head up to drink or to hold a spoon. Far from destroying him, this channeled his intellect, and his family's money, into the development of the device patented as "Waldo F. Jones' Synchronous Reduplicating Pantograph". Wearing a glove and harness, Waldo could control a much more powerful mechanical hand simply by moving his hand and fingers. This and other technologies he develops make him a rich man, rich enough to build a home in space.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waldo_(short_story)

 

[grokme]

I'm a strong believer in self determination, so I think rich people should be allowed to go to space, and stay as long as they like, if they can pay big bucks, even if all the doctors advise no. The only ban is for persons likely to infect the rest of the crew and serious cases of mental illness. Present rockets can max at two g instead of 3 or 4g, but it does reduce the payload at least a little. Let's try it and see what the survival rate is. It might be surprisingly good for nearly all infirmities as people typically are healthier if the can do big adventures. Neil

Wow, really? Just 2gs? That's not bad. So are the physical requirements for being an astronaut being lowered any? The days of having the "right stuff" seem to be changing as technology advances.

 

[tanstaafl76]

Are we excluded from this right,

Wait, what? How do you figure riding someone else's space ship to orbit is your right?

You certainly have the right to build your own spaceship, but there's no "right" to space travel otherwise.

 

[docm]

Once commercial access to space starts up I give some lawyer 3.5 seconds to determine that unfettered access, as long as you aren't infectious and have the bank assets, should be covered under the Americans with Disabilities Act (ADA) and the various State disabled persons statutes.

The rocket ride and a commercial space station could be looked upon as just another "public space" where people go to do business, seek education and enjoy entertainment, so accommodations would have to be made. On Earth that's handicapped parking, a ramp, an automatic door, an elevator and in some places an electric cart for customers. In space it may mean access, special seats etc.

For those with mobility issues, who are mostly limited by their lower extremities, they'd be pretty much be on the same level as normals once in orbit since no one's doing much walking in microgravity.

Hell, lower limb amputees could have distinct advantages in space: they're lighter, shorter, have fewer problems with blood pooling in their legs at high G's (depending on the degree of amputation; above or below the knee) and generally have a lot of upper body strength due to driving wheelchairs and the other daily maneuvering they have to do.

Have a friend who's a wheelchair athlete - one of the strongest persons I've ever met, in many ways.

 

[rekk1986]

This is a sily question that i've ever heard. If they can go into the space, they can die before they get the terminals.