Dark matter detected dangling from the cosmic web for 1st time

[Admin]

Astronomers have indirectly detected dark matter hanging from the "loose ends" of filaments that comprise the cosmic web in the Coma Cluster of galaxies.

Dark matter detected dangling from the cosmic web for 1st time : Read more

 

[bwana4swahili]

"... an effect that gravity has on light to indirectly observe dark matter "
Yup, I've heard that scientists have seen nonexistent dark matter before, but it helps them drum up more money for useless research into something that simply doesn't exist!

 

[jamestmallow]

"... an effect that gravity has on light to indirectly observe dark matter "
Yup, I've heard that scientists have seen nonexistent dark matter before, but it helps them drum up more money for useless research into something that simply doesn't exist!

OK, so what's your alternative theory? You need to do more than dismiss the prevailing one.

 

[Questioner]

"...astronomers have detected dark matter..."

That is an unfounded overreach.

What is present is some kind of 'attractive' property.
Maybe gravity maybe something else.

The implied attribute they are conferring to DM is some kind of structural characteristic. That it has some kind of self connected property.
It would be similar to water & as with water would in all likelihood create some resistance to inertia for bodies traveling through it.
I have doubts that the likely slowing of the galactic stars embedded in DM 'halos' have been demonstrated.

I did see one story/report that said observed binary stellar objects showed greater than expected degredation of orbits and attributed that to a presence of DM.

 

[Icepilot]

Dark Matter - Fudge Factor cosmologists invented to explain what they don't understand.
Dark Energy - see Dark Matter.

 

[Atlan0001]

Cosmic "shifts" here and there of the universe in the universe. An existence of hyperspace. Now that is more like it.

Shift yourself in the hyperspace universe, as in rapid travel, and parts just might become visible to you, as you lose sight of, losing relativity to, other parts. "Relativity breaks down" . . . and builds up, in self-similar fractal zooms universe structures, set and reset.

 

[Adrenaline]

Astronomers have indirectly detected dark matter hanging from the "loose ends" of filaments that comprise the cosmic web in the Coma Cluster of galaxies.

Dark matter detected dangling from the cosmic web for 1st time : Read more

I'd heard about this. But I'd hoped it wasn't really. I'd hoped it was just a SF horror story. I'll just keep hoping. Best Wishes to your team.

 

[ianwhi16]

"... an effect that gravity has on light to indirectly observe dark matter "
Yup, I've heard that scientists have seen nonexistent dark matter before, but it helps them drum up more money for useless research into something that simply doesn't exist!

Yep, that is the usual rhetoric we hear from the science denial brigade. Most of them follow some form of pseudoscience or other.
You see, anybody that wanted to make a serious post would discuss the evidence, and explain why it might be something other than dark matter. We never get that though, do we? Rhetorical.

 

[ianwhi16]

Dark Matter - Fudge Factor cosmologists invented to explain what they don't understand.
Dark Energy - see Dark Matter.

So, deal with the evidence for DM and DE. Yes?

 

[Atlan0001]

You can present and discuss your "evidence" from yesterday to doomsday and if it isn't the evidence wanted it just won't be evidence at all but just "magic" and "pseudoscience."
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"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds...!" -- Albert Einstein.

 

[ianwhi16]

You can present and discuss your "evidence" from yesterday to doomsday and if it isn't the evidence wanted it just won't be evidence at all but just "magic" and "pseudoscience."
----------------------

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds...!" -- Albert Einstein.

Sorry? Want to qualify that statement? I was asking the OP to discuss the evidence in favour of DM and DE. I doubt he/ she knows what it is, but if you are going to dismiss something, you'd better deal with the evidence for it, eh?

 

[Questioner]

The problem with DM is the LACK of evidence.

Some of the bizarre ('magical') properties it 'demonstrates' or would be required to have:

1) No where does DM respond to gravity. Which means it demonstrates no inertia.

2) DM doesn't block, absorb, reflect or refract light.

3) Oddly there is an unexpectedly tight correlation between the proposed quantity for DM in a given galaxy and size of that galaxy’s central black hole.

4) Additionally galactic 'halos' of DM somehow center themselves on the central black hole of each galaxy.

5) The sculpting physics of DM must be themselves invisible and not influence visible matter.

6) When a galaxy orbits another galaxy the DM 'halo' slaves itself to the visible matter's inertia.

Honestly DM seems well fit for the pseudoscience moniker.

 

[ianwhi16]

The problem with DM is the LACK of evidence.

Some of the bizarre ('magical') properties it 'demonstrates' or would be required to have:

1) No where does DM respond to gravity. Which means it demonstrates no inertia.

2) DM doesn't block, absorb, reflect or refract light.

3) Oddly there is an unexpectedly tight correlation between the proposed quantity for DM in a given galaxy and size of that galaxy’s central black hole.

4) Additionally galactic 'halos' of DM somehow center themselves on the central black hole of each galaxy.

5) The sculpting physics of DM must be themselves invisible and not influence visible matter.

6) When a galaxy orbits another galaxy the DM 'halo' slaves itself to the visible matter's inertia.

Honestly DM seems well fit for the pseudoscience moniker.

Of course it responds to gravity! And the lensing observations of colliding galaxy clusters show that DM is there.

 

[bwana4swahili]

OK, so what's your alternative theory? You need to do more than dismiss the prevailing one.

How about simply confirming that gravity is consistent across the universe? A small tweak in gravitational forces would eliminate the need for fictitious dark matter.

 

[ianwhi16]

How about simply confirming that gravity is consistent across the universe? A small tweak in gravitational forces would eliminate the need for fictitious dark matter.

Tweaked gravity does not cause gravitational lensing.

 

[bwana4swahili]

Yep, that is the usual rhetoric we hear from the science denial brigade. Most of them follow some form of pseudoscience or other.
You see, anybody that wanted to make a serious post would discuss the evidence, and explain why it might be something other than dark matter. We never get that though, do we? Rhetorical.

As far as dark matter is concerned there is no science to deny. It is pseudoscience and a great way to raise research funds, nothing more!

 

[ianwhi16]

As far as dark matter is concerned there is no science to deny. It is pseudoscience and a great way to raise research funds, nothing more!

Deal with the evidence that says dark matter exists. Simple. Get on with it. The usual anti-science rhetoric doesn't cut it. What is causing the lensing observed in colliding galaxy clusters? Last time I checked, even the MONDists required 'some' dark matter to explain those observations. Got an explanation?

 

[jamestmallow]

How about simply confirming that gravity is consistent across the universe? A small tweak in gravitational forces would eliminate the need for fictitious dark matter.

Either dark matter exists or gravity is inconsistent. At the largest scales objects behave differently via gravity. What is your "small tweak?" You haven't even mentioned MOND.

 

[ianwhi16]

Either dark matter exists or gravity is inconsistent. At the largest scales objects behave differently via gravity. What is your "small tweak?" You haven't even mentioned MOND.

The problem with MOND is that it fails at large scales. As in the lensing observations of colliding galaxy clusters that I mentioned upthread. It really does a bad job with the CMB, as well. IMHO, it is on its death bed. An interesting hypothesis that has outlived its usefulness. Those lensing observations, plus the simultaneous detections of gravitational waves, and the EM signature, from the neutron binary merger a few years ago, pretty much killed it off.

 

[jamestmallow]

The problem with MOND is that it fails at large scales. As in the lensing observations of colliding galaxy clusters that I mentioned upthread. It really does a bad job with the CMB, as well. IMHO, it is on its death bed. An interesting hypothesis that has outlived its usefulness. Those lensing observations, plus the simultaneous detections of gravitational waves, and the EM signature, from the neutron binary merger a few years ago, pretty much killed it off.

I agree it isn't a good explanation. I was just trying to see what Bwana's alternative theory to dark matter is, which he has failed to provide.

 

[ianwhi16]

I agree it isn't a good explanation. I was just trying to see what Bwana's alternative theory to dark matter is, which he has failed to provide.

And almost certainly won't provide. I've seen his type of anti-science rhetoric before. If I had to guess? I'd say an 'electric universe' follower. A neo-Velikovskian cult with no science and no scientists. Plenty of anti-science rhetoric, but no science!

 

[jamestmallow]

And almost certainly won't provide. I've seen his type of anti-science rhetoric before. If I had to guess? I'd say an 'electric universe' follower. A neo-Velikovskian cult with no science and no scientists. Plenty of anti-science rhetoric, but no science!

Yea, EU people are nutters.

 

[Questioner]

Of course it responds to gravity! And the lensing observations of colliding galaxy clusters show that DM is there.

There is a law of gravity where masses are drawn together.
Where is DM drawn towards ANY visible matter's mass?
Either as some fluid pooling in a visible gravity well or as a lump with an identifiable center of mass?

Please feel free to point to a single case.

What you cite is light responding to curvature NOT DM responding to anything.
So might want to bring some accuracy to your comments, yes?

 

[ianwhi16]

There is a law of gravity where masses are drawn together.
Where is DM drawn towards ANY visible matter's mass?
Either as some fluid pooling in a visible gravity well or as a lump with an identifiable center of mass?

Please feel free to point to a single case.

What you cite is light responding to curvature NOT DM responding to anything.
So might want to bring some accuracy to your comments, yes?

Try at least to make sense. When clusters collide, the 'ordinary' matter gets hung-up in the middle due to it interacting with other 'ordinary' matter. It is visible at various wavelengths. With dark matter, we predict that it should not interact with that 'ordinary' matter, nor even with itself much, and just pass on through the collision. Therefore, as dark matter carries the bulk of the mass, we should see the mass to be on the outskirts of the collisions, and not in the centre where the 'ordinary' matter is. And that is what we see. We do not see that in non-colliding clusters, which suggests, rather strongly, that the bulk of the mass is not from the 'ordinary' matter. Eh?

 

[Classical Motion]

I don't think we understand gravity. I think g converges into a shell area, not a point. And the larger that area, the more velocity is needed to remain in orbit. It's not a one to one fall. Because it's not a point fall. It's an area fall.

How would this gravity shell of the inner galaxy appear to a far orbiting star? The net g flux would appear as a large sphere. The stars fall is not counter to a point, has has to counter to an area of fall. It will need more velocity to counter that area fall.

And I also believe that mass is constantly decreasing and so g is constantly decaying. And this can not be stopped.

A slow spread forever for all leftover mass and matter. And as we have seen now, creation happened long before any BB.

But instead of realizing that, there will be a new entity physics to form a large galaxy.