Mars the anomalies The moon too., part II

[dfrank]

Meteorwayne,<br /><br />Thank you the breakdown. Melting only requires a temp above 0c in pure water, salt could lower that a lot.<br /><br />What is your point?<br /><br />I think you made a derogatory comment implying I did not know what I was talking about. I think I showed you I did. The temperature can get to 35c on the surface of Mars.<br /><br />Glade you learned something today. Just for the folks following along at home. The temperature on Mars is colder at night. It is warmer in the summer. Don’t want to confuse anyone leaving out these very important details. Have you caught up yet Wayne?<br /><br />Dfrank<br />

 

[pierround]

Here’s what I found and my wording was off a bit.<br />First one more clouds.<br />http://photojournal.jpl.nasa.gov/jpeg/PIA09428.jpg<br /><br />This is the one I think.<br />I’m going to have to recheck, here’s a start.<br />http://photojournal.jpl.nasa.gov/catalog/PIA09399<br /><br /><br />

 

[a_lost_packet_]

<font color="yellow">pierround - I like how you always leave out the most likely explanation, that he is who he is. </font><br /><br />ROFL<br /><br />Notice how you completely refused to acknowledge his unprovoked insult to me yet somehow, managed to justify making that post.<br /><br />I have given the person otherwise known as "dfrank" every conceivable chance to demonstrate a working knowledge of atmospheric science. Others have as well. All I see is what any grade school student performing at a C grade level could do. Any claims that dfrank makes regarding professional knowledge or experience are suspect and have not been demonstrated at all in this thread. It should also be noted that those very few times he has spoken directly to knowledge well within his supposed profession he has completely missed the boat.<br /><br />Dude.... Either you know something that we don't about dfrank or you have a very lackadaisical attitude regarding someone's credibility. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <font size="1">I put on my robe and wizard hat...</font> </div>

 

[MeteorWayne]

I would say the latter is the most likely explanation, based on history.... <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080"><em><font color="#000000">But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id.</font></em> </font></p><p><font color="#000080">I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function</font><font color="#000080"> </font></p> </div>

 

[pierround]

<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p> Dude.... Either you know something that we don't about dfrank or you have a very lackadaisical attitude regarding someone's credibility. <br /> a_lost_packet_<br /><p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br />Look this is not peer review it’s a forum Called phenomenon.<br />We all see something different.<br />Even the brainiacs can miss something.<br />That’s a lot of information being brought back and what they give us is all we get.<br /> How would you really prove any thing about anyone any way, who cares, he has an interesting view point.<br />We can make assumptions about the data too.<br /><br />Clay,<br /><br />http://photojournal.jpl.nasa.gov/catalog/PIA09093<br /><br />Ground water would have to show up some how?<br />http://photojournal.jpl.nasa.gov/catalog/PIA09077<br /><br />Clouds not dust.<br />http://photojournal.jpl.nasa.gov/catalog/PIA01887<br /><br /><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr /><p>I would say the latter is the most likely explanation, based on history.... <p><hr /></p></p></blockquote><br /><br />See!<br />I can't prove that you are totally wrong.<br />In this case you are.

 

[dfrank]

Pirround,<br /><br />Your images show a lot of activity, clouds and fluid signatures. Without color we can not say for sure if the clouds are dust or water vapor.<br /><br />In the MRO image we can not tell how old this event was. We have no large scale image to see the area in true context. We have no color to see any mineralology or biological signatures.<br /><br />That’s why they give us grayscale and false color. So we can fight with each other about stupid stuff. <br /><br />Dfrank<br />

 

[bobw]

What filters would you pick to get your ideal color pictures? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[dfrank]

I am not a photographer or image specialist. From my reading it would be L456, there are white balance issues. It is sad that they got to make it so complicated.<br /><br />We had an old saying at the last place I worked, “Don’t tell me about the labor pains, show me the baby.â€<br /><br />Translation, you figure if they could get there they could take a picture. I think they can. Lot of smoke, wonder why?<br /><br />Dfrank<br />

 

[mental_avenger]

Throughout all your dissing of panchromatic images, you have overlooked one extremely relevant point. Panchromatic images would have 3 times the resolution of a color image, from the same camera using 3 filters, and 5 times the resolution of a color image, from the same camera using 5 filters. In addition, that higher resolution image requires less data than a corresponding color image, and therefore uses less memory and can be transmitted faster than a corresponding color image. That is why panchromatic images are used so often in scientific research of this nature. Scientists are more concerned with detail, than with pretty pictures. A real atmospheric scientist would know this. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p style="margin-top:0in;margin-left:0in;margin-right:0in" class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="2" color="#ff0000"><strong>Our Solar System must be passing through a Non Sequitur area of space.</strong></font></p> </div>

 

[dfrank]

So what you are saying is sharper is better. Don’t matter what it might be. That’s the logic I hear a lot. That sure is a sharp some kind of cloud. We going to go that far and spend that much money to guess. I think not. They got the images, in MHO.<br /><br /><br />

 

[mental_avenger]

Thank you for proving my point. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p style="margin-top:0in;margin-left:0in;margin-right:0in" class="MsoNormal"><font face="Times New Roman" size="2" color="#ff0000"><strong>Our Solar System must be passing through a Non Sequitur area of space.</strong></font></p> </div>

 

[dfrank]

Now you are not going to pose a question that could be interpreted in more than one way are you. Don’t be shy, just speak and say what you want to.<br /><br />My point was it don’t matter how sharp it is if you don’t know for sure what it is.<br /><br />What was yours?<br />

 

[MeteorWayne]

Since you post does not contain a coherent thought, it's rather hard what to tell to make of it.<br /><br />As usual. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080"><em><font color="#000000">But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id.</font></em> </font></p><p><font color="#000080">I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function</font><font color="#000080"> </font></p> </div>

 

[dfrank]

Wayne,<br /><br />How long did you need to think to come up with that one. The fact that you can not understand me makes me fill good.<br />

 

[MeteorWayne]

Well it makes me fill (sic) good too.<br />About 5 seconds, if you really want to know. When something makes no sense, it's pretty easy to parse.<br />At least this post had a coherent thought in it. <img src="/images/icons/wink.gif" /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080"><em><font color="#000000">But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id.</font></em> </font></p><p><font color="#000080">I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function</font><font color="#000080"> </font></p> </div>

 

[dfrank]

Wayne,<br /><br />I will try one more time. What color a cloud is matters. It tells you if it is ice or dust. When you look at the ground it would be nice to know if it was snow covered or if it was frost or dust.<br /><br />Bio signatures would be a no brainier. Look for the green and blue. That’s why grayscale is useless to me. Wayne, you caught up yet?<br />

 

[MeteorWayne]

Well you are arguing with Jon about the color thing, while I agree with him, I have other stuff to worry about today.<br /><br />I'm so far ahead of you, if I caught up I'd catch you from behind <img src="/images/icons/smile.gif" /><br /><br />After all, I'm the best there ever was. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080"><em><font color="#000000">But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id.</font></em> </font></p><p><font color="#000080">I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function</font><font color="#000080"> </font></p> </div>

 

[bobw]

<font color="yellow">From my reading it would be L456, there are white balance issues.</font><br /><br />That's fine if you are sitting on the ground and have all day to swap 16 filters to cover the spectrum but for an orbiter your choices would be a real waste of time and money.<br /><br />The top graph (MER Pancam) is normalized but the actual response curve would put the height of the peaks along a line much like the bottom graph (HIRISE).<br /><br /><font color="yellow">It is sad that they got to make it so complicated.</font><br /><br />It is sad that you think everything is simple. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[dfrank]

Bob, <br /><br />If I was in charge and you told me you could not take a color picture I would not have hired you. I would have found someone who could. <br /><br />Some things are simple. <br /><br />Dfrank<br />

 

[bobw]

They did find someone who could. <br /><br />http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu/TRA_000873_1780<br /><br /><font color="yellow">Some things are simple. </font><br /><br />I agree, it is simpler to believe AlienzPwnMarz.com than to read a bunch of pesky details about reality. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[dfrank]

bob,<br /><br />That would be an enhanced color image or false color. Arizona state does not have the guts to call anything true color. They painted themselves in a corner with there own BS campaign<br /><br />That’s reality.<br /><br />Dfrank<br />

 

[JonClarke]

<i>You produced a color image. The reason you produced a color image is because it is the only way you can tell for sure. [/i}<br /><br />You are wrong. I converted colour images to panchromatic to show that the same distinction between dust and cloud could made in both. Which they can.<br /><br />Jon<br /><br />used</i> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><em>Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars</em>  Arthur Clarke</p> </div>

 

[bobw]

What makes you say that your L456 Pancam combination, with almost 40% of the wavelengths in the visible band totally missing, is better than the Blue-Green/Red filter combination on HIRISE which offers continuous coverage of the visible band? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[dfrank]

Hello john,<br /><br />You telling me you can look at that grayscale and tell what is white ice clouds and what is tan dust clouds, get me a bucket.<br /><br />Dfrank<br />

 

[JonClarke]

You had better get that bucket ready then. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><em>Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars</em>  Arthur Clarke</p> </div>