STS-122 (1E) Updates

MeteorWayne · Dec 9, 2007

Troubleshooting today, see what the results are. Then maybe one more try before it's back to the VAB, I would guess. I'm sure they'll have a presser later to outline current thinking. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

earth_bound_misfit · Dec 9, 2007

Finger Xed. I suppose if it's roll back to the VAB, then a launch before Christmas is off the cards. Better safe than sorry though as the old saying goes eh. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> ----------------------------------------------------------------- Wanna see this site looking like the old SDC uplink?Go here to see how: SDC Eye saver </div>

MeteorWayne · Dec 9, 2007

For sure, a rollback delays launch until 2008. I'm rather pessamistic about making this launch window (through the 13th). <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

bobblebob · Dec 9, 2007

Is there much point them even trying an attempt tomorrow? Clearly there is something seriously wrong with the sensor system and trying tomorrow just seems like a waste of time and money

MeteorWayne · Dec 9, 2007

Well give them some time to troubleshoot and ponder things. I assure you, there are dozens or hundreds of engineers spending every waking moment (and probably a good part of sleep time as well) trying to figure out WTF is going on. They could stand down for 3 days (including today), top off the Fuel Cell tanks, and still have 2 launch attempts at the end of the window, IIRC. Wayne <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

MeteorWayne · Dec 9, 2007

From spaceflightnow: "Launch of Atlantis has been postponed to January, NASA officials have decided. The December launch period ends this week and managers do not expect to reach a resolution to the sensor problems by then. The next liftoff attempt could come as early as Jan. 2 around 5:45 a.m. EST. Mission managers are meeting for their post-scrub discussions. A news conference will follow later today. " From NASA: "Dec. 9 -9:30 a.m. EST The launch of space shuttle Atlantis has been rescheduled for no earlier than Jan. 2, 2008. The postponement will give engineers time to evaluate false readings from the engine cutoff sensor system that measures liquid hydrogen in the external tank. Of the four engine cutoff sensors, ECO sensor number three gave false readings during Sunday's launch attempt. The sensor system is one of several that protect the shuttle's main engines by triggering their shut down if fuel runs unexpectedly low. Atlantis' scheduled launch on Thursday was delayed after two of the four engine cutoff, or ECO, sensors in the shuttle's external fuel tank gave false readings. A third sensor failed after the tank was drained of fuel. The post-Mission Management Team press conference will be conducted at about 10 a.m. It will be broadcast on NASA TV." <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

MeteorWayne · Dec 9, 2007

Post MMT News conference live on NASA TV NET 10 AM EST (10 minutes from now) On now (10:05 AM) <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

MeteorWayne · Dec 9, 2007

Just a quick summary. They will do on the pad troubleshooting for the next few days. Plan of action Tuesday. Aiming for Jan 2 date, pending developments. Without pressure of launch window, will take time needed to either understand root cause, or at least eliminate lots of things the problem is not. Might run another tanking test wih even more instrumentation to identify root cause. They have good access at the pad, so no immediate need to rollback to VAB. Indications are it is not the sensors themselves, and they can access everything else. Should sensors need to be replaced, that likely (but not definately) would require rollback which would delay flight to after Jan 2. No immediate impact to following flighht's launch schedule, should this slide to mid Jan, it would delay Feb launch, but there are 2+ weeks of margin between Feb and April flights, so no long term impact. MW <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

bobblebob · Dec 9, 2007

Shame, but probably the right thing to do.

no_way · Dec 9, 2007

Well, that settles our bet with S_G, doesnt it ? They came close, though.

MeteorWayne · Dec 9, 2007

Yeah I was thinking that. There's been a reversal of beer direction <img src="/images/icons/smile.gif" /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

tanstaafl76 · Dec 9, 2007

Disappointing, but better safe than sorry. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

bobblebob · Dec 9, 2007

Can Columbus stay in the payload bay until the New Year?

Testing · Dec 9, 2007

No, only a delay of beer. Crap <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

radarredux · Dec 9, 2007

So did NASA only launch 3 shuttle missions in 2007 (STS-117, 118, and 120)? I also only count 3 shuttle launches in 2006 (121, 115, and 116).

3488 · Dec 9, 2007

I cannot see why not bobblebob. Perhaps shuttle_guy knows. I great shame for the delay, but it is far better safe than sorry. Lets hope she launches on Wednesday 2nd January 2008. Andrew Brown. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> "I suddenly noticed an anomaly to the left of Io, just off the rim of that world. It was extremely large with respect to the overall size of Io and crescent shaped. It seemed unbelievable that something that big had not been visible before". Linda Morabito on discovering that the Jupiter moon Io was volcanically active. Friday 9th March 1979.http://www.launchphotography.com/ http://anthmartian.googlepages.com/thisislandearthhttp://web.me.com/meridianijournal </div>

SpaceKiwi · Dec 9, 2007

I have to say I'm pleased they've deferred until January. This time of year is too busy for me to give mission coverage the full 18 hours a day attention it deserves. Long term, the continuing ECO sensor problem has the potential to put a real crimp in the 2010 deadline. I can't believe they haven't tracked the root cause down yet after two plus years. A definitive answer seems as far away as ever. It's a real shame. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Who is this superhero? Henry, the mild-mannered janitor ... could be!-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Bring Back The Black! </div>

tanstaafl76 · Dec 9, 2007

Does anyone know exactly how the sensors in question work? Do they rely on temperature to determine whether they are submerged in fuel? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

henryhallam · Dec 9, 2007

"Can Columbus stay in the payload bay until the New Year? " It can however I can not see the troubleshooting being performed with out de-stacking the Orbiter and ET. In that case the payload will probably be removed.

henryhallam · Dec 9, 2007

"I have to say I'm pleased they've deferred until January." The next attempt is no earlier than Jan 2. I expect it will be Feb.

henryhallam · Dec 9, 2007

"Does anyone know exactly how the sensors in question work? Do they rely on temperature to determine whether they are submerged in fuel? " The resistance of the sensor changes with the LH2 temp. That causes the wet indication.

billslugg · Dec 9, 2007

I don't know anything about what is in the ECO sensor. It would seem to me that one of the easiest things in the world to sense would be the presence or absence of LH2. I would take a platinum wire, and put a constant current through it via a set of wires. I would have a second set of wires that would measure the voltage across the wire. If the wire was immersed at neg 450 F, then it is going to be at a certain resistance, and will generate a certain voltage. When the LH2 goes away, the temperature of the gas surrounding it is the same, so the resistance does not change. However, the constant current will generate some heat and the element will warm up. I would love to know where I am wrong on this. I do not presume that they are idiots. I am sure there is a very good reason why they are unable to sense LH2, I just don't know what it is. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

tanstaafl76 · Dec 10, 2007

So the idea is that the liquid hydrogen is of a certain temperature, and if the sensor is not covered by the LH2 the sensor is going to be a different (and I assume, higher?) temperature. Ok I'm a layman, but could it be something as stupid as bubbles in the LH2 that could be throwing off the sensor? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

MeteorWayne · Dec 10, 2007

The sensor itself seems to be working fine, it's more likely a wiring/connector issue. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

earth_bound_misfit · Dec 10, 2007

"The 3 posts above were made by me. I did not notice that Henry hap not logged off." Are you and HH using the same machine SG? Do you two work together? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> ----------------------------------------------------------------- Wanna see this site looking like the old SDC uplink?Go here to see how: SDC Eye saver </div>

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