Creating a planetary magnetic field

[3488]

I though nrrusher meant Mars?????<br /><br />Perhaps I misunderstood.<br /><br />Andrew Brown. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080">"I suddenly noticed an anomaly to the left of Io, just off the rim of that world. It was extremely large with respect to the overall size of Io and crescent shaped. It seemed unbelievable that something that big had not been visible before".</font> <em><strong><font color="#000000">Linda Morabito </font></strong><font color="#800000">on discovering that the Jupiter moon Io was volcanically active. Friday 9th March 1979.</font></em></p><p><font size="1" color="#000080">http://www.launchphotography.com/</font><br /><br /><font size="1" color="#000080">http://anthmartian.googlepages.com/thisislandearth</font></p><p><font size="1" color="#000080">http://web.me.com/meridianijournal</font></p> </div>

 

[MeteorWayne]

Or perhaps there really should be two threads. It's gotten very confusing, it's not you <img src="/images/icons/smile.gif" /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080"><em><font color="#000000">But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id.</font></em> </font></p><p><font color="#000080">I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function</font><font color="#000080"> </font></p> </div>

 

[silylene old]

A superconductor material has many advantages compared to using iron or some other conventional metal for the purpose of generating a magnetic field (field strength, current densities, no resistance).<br /><br />Leo, I agree with you that a high temperature superconductor (good to 50C+) would be necessary for Mars, the materials for which would need to be invented. The highest Tc superconductors we have now still require cooling to somewhat above liquid N2, which is still very cold.<br /><br />With known materials, we could however give Pluto a strong magentic field using an equitorial superconducting cable with a strong current running through it. The temperature on Pluto is always cool enough for a cuprate-perovskite superconductor, also known as YBCO materials (record Tc = 130K or so).<br /><br />In fact, using known YBCO superconductor materials, we could give Titan a magnetic field . The temperature of the Titanese surface is a chilly 95K or so.<br /><br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature" align="center"><em><font color="#0000ff">- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -</font></em> </div><div class="Discussion_UserSignature" align="center"><font color="#0000ff"><em>I really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function.</em></font> </div> </div>

 

[nrrusher]

<br />I did mean Mars in the satellite issue. Even if we couldn't create a GREAT magenetic field, even a partial one woud help, or just create a safe zone as I said.<br /><br />Would a rotating satellite configuration be more effective than a stationary magnetic planetary belt? <br /><br />If the opposing rotational forces within a planet's layers are what, in part anyway, create a magnetic field, wouldn't it follow that the next best thing would be to create a surrogate layer to rotate up above it? <br /><br />An opposing circling system that would use the planet itself ( or installations that we build into the infrastructure, such as a belt) and an opposing system of satellites, working together to create a magnetic field.<br /><br />It could be partically powered from the surface as well, and even use the planet itself if it has enough iron content to assist the process......<br /><br />Thoughts?<br /><br />

 

[kelvinzero]

A magnetic field does not explicitly require power. Play with some fridge magnets <img src="/images/icons/smile.gif" /><br /><br />What magnetism needs is current. (presumably even fridge magnets contain this permanent frictionless current in some sense)<br /><br />Super conductors are great, but a charged particle moving through vacuum is also a current with essentially no resistance.<br /><br />I did a rough stab at the current requirements of giving the moon a magnetic field of the same strength as the earth and got a value of around a billion amps. That sounds a lot, but remember that is current, not power usage. If you could just put charged particles into orbit and they stayed there, there would be no power usage after set up. It all comes down to losses.<br /><br />As for saying satellites cannot ever effect a planets magnetic field, I would have to see some numbers to understand what is actually meant by that statement.

 

[nrrusher]

All right, here goes a college try.<br /><br />A magnetic field is created by two opposing electrical charges separated by a not-easily-conducting medium. <br /><br />For instance, before lightning strikes, the hair on your head will stand up, because the charge of your hair is trying to climb the magnetic field that is created by the difference between the charge in the air and the one on the ground. It is trying to take the path of least resistance. The positive charge in your hair finds it more appealing to be among all the negative charges in the air....and the magnetic field is the tenuous connection that is the only way there (unless a solid provides one of course, or the charge gets so great that it causes the magnetic field to act like a solid....??)<br /><br />OK<br /><br />If that is correct, at least in part, and I do not know for sure that it is, then we would need to create two opposite electrical charges hosted on a sphere, separated by a medium. On earth the two are the inner core and the outer crust, mantle, whatever. The charge here is created by the liquid friction in the core versus the mantle...in the style of static electicity perhaps...I don't know, I am just rambling/brain-storming here. <br /><br />The kick for our fake field is that we also would need to create a rotation so that the fields are twisted in a spherical fashion to surround the planetoid. <br /><br />My guess would be that, with enough charge/power, we could have two charged rails, think of train tracks, that circled the planet. One would be directly above the other, maybe 200 ft or something, and would not be connected to the lower one. Now if we create opposing charges in these two, and then spin one, or both, in opposing directions, we could create a sizable magnetic field that would start to resemble the sphere we need.<br /><br />If we did not spin, then we would just have like what we have with the lightning and the field would not take any particular shape.<br /><br />There is my

 

[kelvinzero]

Thats an electric field. A magnetic field is created by current, ie moving charges. Its the old right hand rule: Your thumb points in the direction of the current and the curl of your fingers gives the direction of the magnetic field around the wire.<br /><br />An electric field could also divert charged particles perhaps, but by a different mechanism. <br /><br />Power is energy per time. There is no specific power requirements to maintain a magnetic or an electric field, any more than gravity takes power to maintain.<br /><br />This is good news, on all counts <img src="/images/icons/wink.gif" /><br /><br />(edit: hmm.. just noticed at the end that you are talking about spinning the rings. This WOULD create a magnetic field, but Im guessing a much easier way of creating your current is conduction. Not sure.)

 

[nrrusher]

<br />I may see if I can dig some stuff up that might allow a test of some sort. This has really got me intrigued. None of the components are high tech or anything, at least, they wouldn't have to be for a test.<br /><br />In fact, with some hotter/higher tech equipment, what would stop you from building a personnal magnetic field? Astronauts could literally wear one.......<br /><br />NR

 

[arkady]

Yeah, exactly my line of thinking. Although I believe the idea was to make a planetary field. Possibly as a means to contain an atmosphere without it getting stripped away by the solar wind.<br /><br />Again I gave the math a shot, but had to give up. Seems relatively simple to calculate the (at least roughly) the amount of power needed for creating say a moon- or mars-sized field with the same intensity as here on Earth. Gogo physics wizzies!<br /><br />It also occured to me that as the ionosphere is also generating a magnetic field (magnetosphere), wouldn't that intensify aswell if the atmosphere was denser? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> "<font color="#0000ff"><em>The choice is the Universe, or nothing</em> ... </font>" - H.G Wells </div>

 

[nrrusher]

Well, if we can build a personall one, building one for a planet is just a matter of scale, so I don't believe we would be getting off topic here.<br /><br />

 

[kelvinzero]

I had a go at some maths in this thread:<br />http://uplink.space.com/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=businesstech&Number=705317<br /><br />I wasnt taking it very seriously though. I was just using the model of a band at the equator, creating sufficent magnetisim at the pole. I ended up with a value of a billion amps as already mentioned... but remember that is a measure of current, not power.<br /><br />There is no specific requirement that it consumes any power as far as I can see.

 

[arkady]

Ah yes, that was the thread i was referring to. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> "<font color="#0000ff"><em>The choice is the Universe, or nothing</em> ... </font>" - H.G Wells </div>

 

[nrrusher]

<br />This site has significant information on the idea of using a magsail to protect from solar and interstellar radiation....very complete and interesting, you just need to scroll down a little.<br /><br />NR<br /><br />http://www.asi.org/adb/06/09/03/02/107/lunar-studies-part2.html