From a drop of water....

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Reading again and more, today news of sciences being pursued, I read about the 'holographic principle' and 'holographic universes (actually a horizon principle and horizon universes, as I see the principle to actually be); and seeing where scientists are digging in to discover 'mirror' universes in large and small makes me more relaxed concerning the future possibilities of the scientific establishment and the future of humans and the rest of life in space.

Discrete quanta, quantum weirdness, waves, particles, Heisenberg 'uncertainty principle', Schrodinger' wave function, Planck Horizon and its other self the Big Bang Horizon, infinity nonlocality, multi-dimensional multiverse and more if there is such, altogether ultimately spell (mean) HOLOGRAM and HOLOGRAHY . . . and Mirror and upscale / downscale 'fractal zoom structure universe', mirroring.

None of it, though, indicates hologram holography, Mirror and mirroring, in the local finite more than Relativity. And all it altogether is secondary to everythingness is nothingness / nothingness is everythingness in mirror. That is in direct contradiction of the idea that that type, those types, of universality could disappear at any moment. It is as immortally eternal (sic) as immortally eternal can get. Surpassing -- [a priori] -- reality.
The third of the trinity if SPACE, TIME, and SPACETIME, SPACETIME I've called "so-so" since it is is best described by simple geometry, curving and straightening lines to be exact.

The straightest line to the universe is a wormhole, and secondarily a soliton, producible only by and through self-propulsion / self-acceleration that opposes the tethering of the curves because self-propulsion universally not only does not follow but actively / reactively resists the curvatures of universe (verse: turn: turning unity). Curvatures which become vortices throwing objects toward the outside of the universe when resisted. And ever more ferociously in tightening vortex curvature the more resisted.

Light lines naturally follow the curvatures of the universe (the turns), a massless-ness in vacuum -- not being self-propelling / self-accelerating -- ready to be transformed to vacuum energy and change to something else. To speed into a light line, period! is to speed into a curve that grows in curvature, grows in vortex (into itself), the more speed picks up, period! As continuously illustrated a wormhole is the straightest line of all in the universe, and the most unobservable line for being the straightest line between two points that does not follow universe curvature. But then this geometry gets very funny!

You straighten out, flatten out, the universe's curvatures into 2-dimensional 'Flatland', you arc -- you curve -- the wormholes into space outside space, time outside time. You do hyper surface hyperspatial "fractal zoom universe." Example: the shortest distance, the straightest line, in one dimensional geometry between Seattle and Tokyo is a great arc . . . is by way of Anchorage, Alaska.

To be continued....
If two people are exactly opposite each other on Earth and one of them wants to walk all the way around the world to shake hands then it makes no difference which direction they set out, as long as they follow the great circle.

In this case, the decision on the initial bearing would default to such considerations as "has more of the finer restaurants".
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From Article commentary, continuing a probable realization expressed here and elsewhere:

"How did supermassive black holes get so big so fast just after the Big Bang?"

You are looking through a super-version microscope, that's why.
The process that slows everything down is heat rejection. Must get rid of excess gas pressure, which requires radiating heat away. Problem is, ionized gas won't let photons escape. This occurred at an early time in the universe when all there was was H and He. Such metal free clouds do not exist today thus we have limited ability to study the physics of contracting clouds of hydrogen. It is apparent that we need to figure out how these clouds lose heat so fast.
I know that I've badly confused some who read my posts with the thread "The James Webb Telescoping MICROSCOPE." Rather than go more into it there. I will try to straighten it out here.

Is the universe a hypersphere in every direction up and out from center-point here and now (everywhere that center-point here and now is)? Thus, an infinity of center-points . . . thus also, concomitantly, an infinity of hyperspheres . . . thus, following, each and every point of the infinity of points having duality with its hypersphere, therefore an infinity of hyperspheres the hypersurface 14 billion, or 28 billion, or 40 billion, whatever, light years from center-point. And the JWTS MICROSCOPE looking up and out toward the PLANCK Big Bang (Black Hole) collapsed cosmological constant Horizon of the Infinite MULTIVERSE (Horizon set of all of an infinity of horizons) Universe (Universe of all of an infinity of universes).

Yes, the JWTS MICROSCOPE looks up and out to the "point" of that hypersphere hypersurface Horizon.

We, and it, happen to sit on and in that curvature of hypersphere hypersurface Horizon peering into the center-point point of all center-points, the PLANCK Big Bang (Black Hole).... Which is why the Webb beyond an uncertain point is the James Webb telescoping MICROSCOPE looking in into, and dealing in, the microscopy of the point of points.

O. K. all you great mathematical physicists out there, this intuitive visual mathematician who is no mathematician beyond the average, has pointed out the curving hyper-spherical hypersurface of our universe, a surface that we also happen to be on and in, what is the total surface area, at this moment in TIME, of the sphere of the universe we sit on, in, like sitting on the surface of the Earth? Not what is the volume, mass, or energy, what is the total surface area of the 'Flatland' "universe?" . . . er, the total surface area of the "point horizon?" . . . er, the total surface area of the "hypersphere?"

Remembering that the famous mathematician Kurt Godel tried for something like it, measuring a point and points, and it helped him lose his sanity. His closest friend Albert Einstein, who walked and talked with him almost daily (I read), didn't even try for it.

The James Webb telescoping MICROSCOPE looks 'Through the Looking Glass' up and out, down and in, toward it!
Continuing #156 above, I don't think even Rod with his astronomy calculators can measure what is really infinity. His calculators deal only in TIME's finitely closed systemic SPACETIME. They do not deal in -- work with -- the equal but opposite dimensionality of the 'open system'. Our hypersphere (singular) and the music of the spheres (infinitely plural), so to speak.
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What is a hypersphere? Can you show me a physical example? What is a point? What do they look like? What is a point made of? What can fit inside a point? Can we put a point into another point? Can we pull a point out of a point? Why not? Can points only do point things? Can a point do a real thing?

If I can think it there?
What is a hypersphere? Can you show me a physical example? What is a point? What do they look like? What is a point made of? What can fit inside a point? Can we put a point into another point? Can we pull a point out of a point? Why not? Can points only do point things? Can a point do a real thing?

If I can think it there?
Don't tell me you can't understand the JWST's inside-out / outside-in viewpoint?! Or ours, period?!
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Sorry. Pardon me. Not familiar with the "JWTS's inside-out / outside-in viewpoint". I was just reading your last post and used the term hypersphere, so I looked it up, seems to have many meanings to many people. But to me it's just math la-la land.

I look and listen for physical dynamics. And just like the mysteries of pyramid construction we had for so long, the solutions to such mysteries always turn out to be plain old fashion physical engineering. And rather simple once understood.

I believe it will be the same for light and matter. But with math in the way, it will take much longer. They will bump up against reality sooner or later.

Pardon me again and I won't disturb your thread further.
Returning to SPACE minus TIME, minus SPACETIME:

I've described SPACE many ways, many times, as the collapsed fixed constant background Horizon, nonlocal "at a distance" . . . thus, if I may borrow from Einstein, the spookiest of all "action at a distance" for being infinity collapsed and closed up to horizon, the Horizon of all horizons, where then TIME = 0 (null unity) and/or 1 (unity) . . . and parity.

SPACE, short TIME (t=0), is then always the background infinity (the Nothingness (the Everythingness)) versus the local foreground finite (the Somethingness).

Sheesh! Family matters. Got to go. To be continued, again....
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Gee, the way I start describing SPACE above in #162 it begins not at some billions of light years away but at just 100 miles above the surface of the Earth.

As for the collapsed cosmological constant Einstein defined as '0', then disowned, it is that but infinitely, or simply non locally, at a distance. Whether infinite '0' and/or '1' non locally at a distance, or 300,000kps finitely locally, it is the same constant of 'c'.

Either way, either place, what has it to do with SPACE here in the 'what' of SPACE I'm talking about? Einstein took his mind's eye trip to the speed of light, a TIME-less SPACE, is exactly as I have it to be, 'c'='0' (null unity) and/or'1' (unity) REAL ('c'='300,000kps' RELATIVE)! The frozen clock, zeroed in TIME, hanging at and over the dead center of Hawking's "Grand Central Station" of universe(s), is exactly as I have it to be, 'c'='0' and/or '1' REAL ('c'='300,000kps'RELATIVE).

SPACE is the fixed collapsed constant background vacuum void: Nowhere-land and Nothingness (Everywhere-land and Everythingness all-in-one all at once . . . all at the same time). Its hypersurface hyperspace structure is gravitational / antigravitational strong binding force (GSBF) infinitely open systemic "fractal zoom universe." You can call it infinitely in-depth and breadth Flatland(s), or infinite numbers of universe spheres, whatever dimensionality you want to picture, but you'd be seeing and talking the same hypersurface hyperspace universe(s) no matter if you visualize a base Flatland and pyramid it in dimensions to magnetic monopole (dipole moment) point-singularity (point-singularities) apex, or a Sphere of countless spheres (thus a duality of countless centers, too; countless center points) . . . blended and blending,
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Yep! Didn't I mention somewhere, "bubble wrap" SPACETIME?!

And it almost promptly gets illustrated in another context, not at all entirely separated from my context, though there are those few who might think otherwise. Whether from my SPACETIME context, or entirely independent of it, that illustration fits both contexts to a tee.
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I studied error correcting codes in college. Simplest code is a parity bit. It can only tell you an error occurred but it can't tell you in which position. If you add more bits you can correct errors. Eventually you add as many bits as it took to compose the initial message, in order to be able to correct any given bit. You are basically sending it twice.
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I studied error correcting codes in college. Simplest code is a parity bit. It can only tell you an error occurred but it can't tell you in which position. If you add more bits you can correct errors. Eventually you add as many bits as it took to compose the initial message, in order to be able to correct any given bit. You are basically sending it twice.
How far back do you go? I go back to IBM 1410s, 360s and 370s, Burroughs and Sperry systems. A lot of blinking lights that made me want to **** every time they froze, and they froze a lot . . . far too often as far as I was concerned.
I started by taking CompSci 101, fall semester 1970 at Penn State. We programmed on punch cards, read at remote terminals around campus. Line printer right there. I had an orange card, good for unlimited runs of one second each of CPU time on the IBM-360-70. We had to fit program and data into 512k RAM. My degree is EE. My career was in ME.
As you could probably tell from the varied systems my career was military. I even worked and wired the plugboards of a couple of IBM 407s, plus collators, and so on out of mobile vans. Those were the good old bad old days. Talk about technology revolutions and evolutions, I sped through millions of years of evolution crammed, speeded up, into fifty years of computer technology advance between military and university careers. I retired burned out.

Just thinking more about it, all of my kids and grandkids, and even one of my great grandkids so far, are computer taught and literate, but not one of them understands them -- how they really work below the surface -- like this old man of the family does.
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One more. The largest monster mainframe I ever worked with was a Honeywell Multics System that took up a warehouse size facility with all its disk and tape drives, plus! Admiral Grace Hopper told us one day on a visit, kind of in (open) private, it was the biggest hunk of security overloaded junk she had ever been around.
I can see the future in and of Mainframe Worlds (Earth and Mars) and networked individual Personal Colony (PC) city-states and stations, and so on, on the surface of space the same way I saw them modeled in computers and cyberspace, and now quantum systems, over the last sixty years of direct living and working with an evolutionary event.
When I was 14 I got Electronics Illustrated and followed the diections and made a flip flop circuit from discrete components I got at Radio Shack. It would flip back and forth, lights going on and off, and then settle on one state. An electronic coin toss. A homebuilt computer with one bit. Smallest possible computer. My Mom threw it, and a whole bunch of other junk, away when I went to college. Oh well!
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Bill, you sound like my father. He was good at anything he could do with mind and hands together . . . electronics, mechanics, you name it, a natural without even a high school degree (he ran away from home to become a handyman in several skill sets in the oil fields, then WWII+ military) until my mid-teens when I helped him get the GED he needed for a upward gain in career, short teaching him the math he turned out to be a whiz with the formulas (just the opposite of me who could and did shortcut formula (drove my teachers mad in high school finding out I wasn't cheating and didn't need to cheat)). He tried to teach me the mechanics of things, including electronics, and failed. Told me to go back to my books. Early in the military, still almost a mid-teen wanting the adventure I had found in my reading, especially history, the peoples and events, but being what I was, most of all the complex-chaotic structure of it, which I also found from the authors of sciences, especially physics, cosmology, and possible futures science-fiction. Then, as I said, I discovered a natural affinity with information and communication systems and technology. Separate from the things you learned to do, I could do, and I could instruct, and I could venture, and eventually after an upscale switch of military branches, I gained a career tailor made for me for what I naturally am, within another career tailor made for me. My second career, the staff at university, a type of regimented workplace society that did not exist in the military -- surprise! surprise! -- that within twelve years had imbittered me and burned me out.
Sounds like a great career trajectory! I worked 24 years for a Fortune 10 multinational in the tissue papermaking process. As engineer, production management, outside consultant, contract labor. I started at the bottom as project engineer, worked my way up through management to Dept Head, retired 25 years ago, went right back as consultant and most recently working the floor to fill in for COVID losses. I went from the bottom to the top and back to the bottom. But I had "Authority by competence". When the big boss got into a big crunch he would find me out on the floor and ask what to do. He told me his mother had not been born when I first set foot on that same operating floor.
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"From a drop of water, a logician could infer the possibility of an Atlantic or a Niagara without having seen or heard of one or the other...." -- A. Canon Doyle, Sherlock Holmes: A Study In Scarlet.

Our own potentially observable universe is but a drop of water in the ocean of our own probable unobserved and unobservable universe. Though I will always insist -- for reasons I've stated many times -- that there are infinities of universes to the Infinite MULTIVERSE Universe 'set' of all of them, we will never need them when our own (hypersurface hyperspace) hypersphere is just as infinite in its way as all of them put together, extending out omni-directionally as it does 14- to 28-, to potentially 50-billion light years in radius from every single point in it (3 diameter dimensions of a sphere, x, y, z, 28- to 56-, to potentially 100-billion light years in diameter). That is trillions and trillions, and trillions, and..., essentially infinities more of galaxies, stars, and everything else omni-directionally out from all points in our own hyper spherical "fractal zoom universe." Never mind the infinities of the others.

Fundamental Binary Base2 base infinite '0' (null unity) [and/or] base finite '1' (unity) . . . and parity.

Always in change and turnover in TIME . . . when you really think about it, an observed, and very observable, "endless beginning!" Entropy always in inexorable return to the 'Frontier Wild' of an "endless beginning!"

Our own universe is so omni-directionally vast, so infinite in its frontiers, and so amazing, that we can and should forget the infinities of the rest of an Infinite MULTIVERSE Universe, right?!

Not a chance!!!!

Don't forget the code of quantum mechanics that a particle will take every possible path, thus every possible universe, at every decision point crossroads, and so will everything else, including us! We, our minds, our information if you will, are not immortal in this one universe, but in the infinities of universes, we, our minds, our information, are immortal . . . always in Deja vu, always somewhere (from the cave of our evolution to "Star Trek" and "Star Wars," ....) in the divided SPACE and TIME of infinities of universes (the Infinite MULTIVERSE Universe). Infinity of frontiers: thus, infinity of mind; immortality of being.

So NOT a chance! of NOT being mindful of the infinities of horizon universes of the Infinite MULTIVERSE Universe!

So, this our own [frontier] universe in its own way will always be far more than life can ever spread out in, but not even the beginning of enough to branch out the tree of immortality in. For such, I, for one, can quite reasonably be sure all those other countless universes exist.

"From a drop of water, a logician could infer the possibility of an Atlantic or a Niagara without having seen or heard of one or the other...."
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The thought experiment of Einstein's as I interpret it:

You have a screen with a slit in it. You have a hemispherical curved phosphorescent plate on the other side from a swarm of electrons. The electrons go through the slit and strike the plate at all points at the same time along the curve of the plate.

You have the same screen, same, slit, same curved plate, same electron swarm. Only a single electron goes through the slit. Limited, it is a particle and strikes a single point of the plate. Unlimited, it is a wave and strikes every point of the plate just as the swarm of individual particle electrons did.

As a limited particle striking the plate at a single point, the single electron may be a matter of electromagnetism.

As an unlimited wave striking the plate at every point of the curved plate all at once, taking every path possible to it all at once, all at the same time along the whole of the curvature of the plate, the single electron may not be a matter of electromagnetism but may be a matter of quantum gravity.