Mirror Matter

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D

Danggali

Guest
My ideas only peoples .... an I'm only new, with a very small brain ...

Matter and anti-matter are two forms of matter. Neither has a 'reality' over the other. Neither is temporary, or both are temporary. We prefer, and are familiar with, matter ... but this is subjective because we are made from it. But anti-matter is just as 'legitimate'.

Regarding matter in its mirror image form (not anti-matter). At first it was believed that they were identical ... that is a 'left-hand-drive' car would behave the same as a 'right-hand-drive' car ...two clocks, one built as a mirror image of the other would both keep the same time. Left cannot (by Physical Laws) be distinguished from right and north cannot be distinguished from south.

In other words by flipping all 3 spatial co-ordinates there is no change under the Laws of Physics. Reflexion Symmetry.

The idea that this may not be true was slowly growing through the first half of the last century and it was suggested that parity may not be conserved. But this was not taken seriously until the Lee-Yang experiment in 1957. Basically the Lee-Yang experiment showed that only the left-handed attributes of particles and the right-handed attributes of anti-particles participate in Weak interactions. it was shown that parity is conserved by the EM force, Gravity, and the Strong Nuclear force ... but not the Weak Nuclear force.

This led Feynman to propose the following hypothesis:

That if we were to build a clock out of matter (wot else ?) that marks time by counting electron flow instead of a spring ... and also to construct another clock (out of matter) as a mirror image of the original then these two clocks would keep different time. It can be easily shown that you must also reverse north-south poles as surely as you reverse all the spatial co-ordinates in a mirror image according to the laws of magnetism and current flow.

The two clocks would record different times. One would count less electrons ejected from the cobalt than the other. This turns out to be true for all matter ? Parity is not respected by the Weak Force. Reflexion symmetry does not hold.



Feynman's hypothesis is that matter comes in all 4 forms .... following diagrams.



If matter <> antimatter (or mirror-image-matter and mirror-image-anti-matter) contact they annihilate, (presumably because they are symmetrical and opposite) [below]



Matter and Mirror-image-matter interact freely and normally (in fact the observable universe is probably made up of both ?) [below]



But Matter and Mirror-image-anti-matter do not interact at all (nor mirror-image-matter and anti-matter) They have the same attributes. [below]




And, in a roundabout way, symmetry is restored by this hypothesis.

These are the components that make up the Universe and the non-interacting parts are candidates for Dark matter/Dark energy. The fact that they do not appear in equal quantities may have its roots in the evolution of the Universe in the first few nano-seconds.

This was proposed by Feynman.

Wot do you think ?

cool bananas ... greg
 
A

adrenalynn

Guest
Re: Matter / Antimatter

Danggali":rip0vmuy said:
MeteorWayne":rip0vmuy said:
Ranch today for me...
Your comment is cryptic ??

greg ??
If you're going to continue making posts like your last couple, you need to learn the concepts of "Word Salad" and "Not Even Wrong". You're going to hear them a bunch.
 
M

Mee_n_Mac

Guest
Re: Matter / Antimatter

Danggali":3jqkvwvl said:
My ideas only peoples .... an I'm only new, with a very small brain ...
{snip}
Wot do you think ?

cool bananas ... greg
I think if you asked a more specific question, you'd have a better chance of getting some response. Are you suggesting that mirror image matter is dark matter ? I also think you should post a link to the source you copied.
 
K

kk434

Guest
Re: Matter / Antimatter

Hold your horses, tremendous breaktrough has been made in anti matter research. CERN has just captured neutral anti hydrogen atoms and soon they will be makeing experiments on them. I think that they will make some revolutionary discoverys that can turn the standard model on it's head. Too bad that we have to wait for some time before the current experiments (ATRAP,ALPHA) are finished.
 
D

Danggali

Guest
Re: Matter / Antimatter

Mee_n_Mac":3vrifoi2 said:
Danggali":3vrifoi2 said:
My ideas only peoples .... an I'm only new, with a very small brain ...
{snip}
Wot do you think ?

cool bananas ... greg
I think if you asked a more specific question, you'd have a better chance of getting some response. Are you suggesting that mirror image matter is dark matter ? I also think you should post a link to the source you copied.
Actually ... I am only suggesting them as candidates ??

As they are my own ideas, and there is no one specific source, nor do I have a specific question .... wot link do you suggest ....... rotflmao

In any case, if you google Feynman's 'Left Handed Frog' you will see that really I have plagiarised this theory. .... it is taken from Feynman's Physics lectures on Symmetry. It has to do with the problem, now solved, of why sugar water always polarises light to the right.

Thanks for your reply ...... Mee n Mac (an you too KK434)... at least you considered first ..... :twisted: :twisted:

cool bananas ... greg
 
D

Danggali

Guest
Re: Matter / Antimatter

adrenalynn":s9d5fmel said:
Danggali":s9d5fmel said:
MeteorWayne":s9d5fmel said:
Ranch today for me...
Your comment is cryptic ??

greg ??
If you're going to continue making posts like your last couple, you need to learn the concepts of "Word Salad" and "Not Even Wrong". You're going to hear them a bunch.
Not even wrong ...... Well .... Yours is a very scientific rebuttal, an I suppose I could manipulate it into a compliment .... but if not ...I'm in good company .... And its good to have it on record, both yours and mine, don't you agree ??

Is this normal Mod behaviour for this site ??

Just for you little one .... CLICK

cool bananas ... greg :twisted: :twisted:
 
D

Danggali

Guest
Re: Matter / Antimatter

Dear Mods .... Is there a way to thank posts ??

cool bananas ... greg v??
 
M

Mee_n_Mac

Guest
Re: Matter / Antimatter

Danggali":2puqxy6t said:
As they are my own ideas .... wot link do you suggest ....... rotflmao

cool bananas ... greg
Sorry but when I saw the "... following diagrams" and the "[below]'s" it appeared to be a cut'n'paste, that lost the pics [below].

Feynman's hypothesis is that matter comes in all 4 forms .... following diagrams.

If matter <> antimatter (or mirror-image-matter and mirror-image-anti-matter) contact they annihilate, (presumably because they are symmetrical and opposite) [below]

Matter and Mirror-image-matter interact freely and normally (in fact the observable universe is probably made up of both ?) [below]

But Matter and Mirror-image-anti-matter do not interact at all (nor mirror-image-matter and anti-matter) They have the same attributes. [below]
 
D

Danggali

Guest
Re: Matter / Antimatter

Mee_n_Mac":3fdo94t0 said:
Danggali":3fdo94t0 said:
As they are my own ideas .... wot link do you suggest ....... rotflmao

cool bananas ... greg
Sorry but when I saw the "... following diagrams" and the "[below]'s" it appeared to be a cut'n'paste, that lost the pics [below].

Feynman's hypothesis is that matter comes in all 4 forms .... following diagrams.

If matter <> antimatter (or mirror-image-matter and mirror-image-anti-matter) contact they annihilate, (presumably because they are symmetrical and opposite) [below]

Matter and Mirror-image-matter interact freely and normally (in fact the observable universe is probably made up of both ?) [below]

But Matter and Mirror-image-anti-matter do not interact at all (nor mirror-image-matter and anti-matter) They have the same attributes. [below]
Wow .... sorry dude .... Can you see the pics or not ?? It makes no sense without the pics ..... probably not much more with the pics ... rotflmao

The pics are mine.

Let me know .... greg
 
M

Mee_n_Mac

Guest
Re: Matter / Antimatter

Danggali":2kkbhx0b said:
Wow .... sorry dude .... Can you see the pics or not ?? It makes no sense without the pics ..... probably not much more with the pics ... rotflmao

The pics are mine.

Let me know .... greg
Sorry, I don't see any. Nor do I see the tags that would work. Alas pic posting on SDC is somewhat limited. They need to be hosted someplace and then hotlinked here using the Img button you'll see in the "Post a reply" box toolbar. It'll generate tags as shown below, in between which you copy the URL to where the pics are posted.

Code:
[img]copy URL to pics here[/img]
 
M

MeteorWayne

Guest
Re: Matter / Antimatter

Danggali":33kk9gt5 said:
Not even wrong ...... Well .... Yours is a very scientific rebuttal, an I suppose I could manipulate it into a compliment .... but if not ...I'm in good company .... And its good to have it on record, both yours and mine, don't you agree ??

Is this normal Mod behaviour for this site ??

:
That was not Moderator Meteor Wayne speaking, I always make it clear when I do so. That was USER Meteor Wayne speaking. Perhaps you should reread the Community Guidelines to understand the difference....
 
M

MeteorWayne

Guest
Re: Matter / Antimatter

Danggali":3d0ovu08 said:
Dear Mods .... Is there a way to thank posts ??

cool bananas ... greg v??
Except by posting, No.
 
D

Danggali

Guest
Re: Matter / Antimatter

Thanks Meteor WAYNE ..... I understand about the mod/poster problem too. I'm a mod as well .... lol :twisted:

Mee n mac, Can you see the images now ??

My ideas only peoples .... an I'm only new, with a very small brain ...

Matter and anti-matter are two forms of matter. Neither has a 'reality' over the other. Neither is temporary, or both are temporary. We prefer, and are familiar with, matter ... but this is subjective because we are made from it. But anti-matter is just as 'legitimate'.

Regarding matter in its mirror image form (not anti-matter). At first it was believed that they were identical ... that is a 'left-hand-drive' car would behave the same as a 'right-hand-drive' car ...two clocks, one built as a mirror image of the other would both keep the same time. Left cannot (by Physical Laws) be distinguished from right and north cannot be distinguished from south.

In other words by flipping all 3 spatial co-ordinates there is no change under the Laws of Physics. Reflexion Symmetry.

The idea that this may not be true was slowly growing through the first half of the last century and it was suggested that parity may not be conserved. But this was not taken seriously until the Lee-Yang experiment in 1957. Basically the Lee-Yang experiment showed that only the left-handed attributes of particles and the right-handed attributes of anti-particles participate in Weak interactions. it was shown that parity is conserved by the EM force, Gravity, and the Strong Nuclear force ... but not the Weak Nuclear force.

This led Feynman to propose the following hypothesis:

That if we were to build a clock out of matter (wot else ?) that marks time by counting electron flow instead of a spring ... and also to construct another clock (out of matter) as a mirror image of the original then these two clocks would keep different time. It can be easily shown that you must also reverse north-south poles as surely as you reverse all the spatial co-ordinates in a mirror image according to the laws of magnetism and current flow.

The two clocks would record different times. One would count less electrons ejected from the cobalt than the other. This turns out to be true for all matter ? Parity is not respected by the Weak Force. Reflexion symmetry does not hold.



Feynman's hypothesis is that matter comes in all 4 forms .... following diagrams.



If matter <> antimatter (or mirror-image-matter and mirror-image-anti-matter) contact they annihilate, (presumably because they are symmetrical and opposite) [below]



Matter and Mirror-image-matter interact freely and normally (in fact the observable universe is probably made up of both ?) [below]



But Matter and Mirror-image-anti-matter do not interact at all (nor mirror-image-matter and anti-matter) They have the same attributes. [below]




And, in a roundabout way, symmetry is restored by this hypothesis.

These are the components that make up the Universe and the non-interacting parts are candidates for Dark matter/Dark energy. The fact that they do not appear in equal quantities may have its roots in the evolution of the Universe in the first few nano-seconds.

This was proposed by Feynman.

Wot do you think ?

cool bananas ... greg
 
A

adrenalynn

Guest
Re: Matter / Antimatter

No images on the forum you mod on either showing up on your post.
 
D

Danggali

Guest
Re: Matter / Antimatter

yes ... A problem .... Since the last upgrade the 'pics' have an ID address instead of a folder address. Will try to fix ...

sorry peoples.

greg
 
M

MeteorWayne

Guest
Re: Matter / Antimatter

Can you explain how a "mirror image" hydrogen atom is supposed to be different than a regular one? You've never satifactorily clarified that. Maybe then we'll have some idea of what you are talking about.
 
C

csmyth3025

Guest
Re: Matter / Antimatter

MeteorWayne":gn25mxg2 said:
Can you explain how a "mirror image" hydrogen atom is supposed to be different than a regular one? You've never satifactorily clarified that. Maybe then we'll have some idea of what you are talking about.
It sounds like he's thinking of atomic structure as being somewhat like the Bohr model of the atom, with a "North" and "South" axis. If this is the case then he's probably speculating about the nature of matter in which the electrons "orbit" the nucleus counter-clockwise (as viewed from the "North") rather than clockwise.

Hopefully, Danggali will clarify this for us.

Chris
 
M

MeteorWayne

Guest
Re: Matter / Antimatter

Of course we already have a name for that. But I'll hold that in my hand until we get a reply.
 
D

Danggali

Guest
Re: Matter / Antimatter

Sorry about the delay peoples.

A 'mirror image' hydrogen atom ?? There is no mirror image hydrogen ?? Anti-hydrogen contains a P-Bar and a positron.

A 'mirror image' object is constructed in the exact shape of an object's mirror image ?

I am not sure I understand ...

cool bananas ... greg
 
D

Danggali

Guest
Re: Matter / Antimatter

Sorry .... but will try once more to upload the images:

My ideas only peoples .... an I'm only new, with a very small brain ...

Matter and anti-matter are two forms of matter. Neither has a 'reality' over the other. Neither is temporary, or both are temporary. We prefer, and are familiar with, matter ... but this is subjective because we are made from it. But anti-matter is just as 'legitimate'.

Regarding matter in its mirror image form (not anti-matter). At first it was believed that they were identical ... that is a 'left-hand-drive' car would behave the same as a 'right-hand-drive' car ...two clocks, one built as a mirror image of the other would both keep the same time. Left cannot (by Physical Laws) be distinguished from right and north cannot be distinguished from south.

In other words by flipping all 3 spatial co-ordinates there is no change under the Laws of Physics. Reflexion Symmetry.

The idea that this may not be true was slowly growing through the first half of the last century and it was suggested that parity may not be conserved. But this was not taken seriously until the Lee-Yang experiment in 1957. Basically the Lee-Yang experiment showed that only the left-handed attributes of particles and the right-handed attributes of anti-particles participate in Weak interactions. it was shown that parity is conserved by the EM force, Gravity, and the Strong Nuclear force ... but not the Weak Nuclear force.

This led Feynman to propose the following hypothesis:

That if we were to build a clock out of matter (wot else ?) that marks time by counting electron flow instead of a spring ... and also to construct another clock (out of matter) as a mirror image of the original then these two clocks would keep different time. It can be easily shown that you must also reverse north-south poles as surely as you reverse all the spatial co-ordinates in a mirror image according to the laws of magnetism and current flow.

The two clocks would record different times. One would count less electrons ejected from the cobalt than the other. This turns out to be true for all matter ? Parity is not respected by the Weak Force. Reflexion symmetry does not hold.



Feynman's hypothesis is that matter comes in all 4 forms .... following diagrams.



If matter <> antimatter (or mirror-image-matter and mirror-image-anti-matter) contact they annihilate, (presumably because they are symmetrical and opposite) [below]



Matter and Mirror-image-matter interact freely and normally (in fact the observable universe is probably made up of both ?) [below]



But Matter and Mirror-image-anti-matter do not interact at all (nor mirror-image-matter and anti-matter) They have the same attributes. [below]




And, in a roundabout way, symmetry is restored by this hypothesis.

These are the components that make up the Universe and the non-interacting parts are candidates for Dark matter/Dark energy. The fact that they do not appear in equal quantities may have its roots in the evolution of the Universe in the first few nano-seconds.

This was proposed by Feynman.

Wot do you think ?

cool bananas ... greg
 
D

Danggali

Guest
Re: Matter / Antimatter

Dear Mods ... if at last the images are viewable then please delete this post so that I know

Ta ! greg
 
J

Jerromy

Guest
Re: Matter / Antimatter

Yes, I see your pictures now...

The only difference I could imagine as to why matter and mirror image matter would decay at different rates would be the atomic rotation spinning with the rotation of the universe or against it.

Matter and antimatter as well as mirror matter and mirror antimatter would annihilate due to the opposite rotation and attraction of opposite charges causing a chain reaction... normal matter and mirror antimatter wouldn't annihilate? I have never read anything confirming that...
 
D

Danggali

Guest
Re: Matter / Antimatter

Jerromy":23wz1p91 said:
Yes, I see your pictures now...

The only difference I could imagine as to why matter and mirror image matter would decay at different rates would be the atomic rotation spinning with the rotation of the universe or against it.

Matter and antimatter as well as mirror matter and mirror antimatter would annihilate due to the opposite rotation and attraction of opposite charges causing a chain reaction... normal matter and mirror antimatter wouldn't annihilate? I have never read anything confirming that...
The Lee-Yang experiment with cobalt at extremely low temp and surrounded by an intense magnetic field in ... ummmm .... guessing early 60's late 50's ?? ... showed clearly that there is a difference between north and south poles ... This was also confirmed at almost the same time by Lederman and another ... I think eventually they all got Nobel prizes.

In theory, all four forms of matter can exist

Matter and Anti-Matter do annihilate ....

But Matter and Mirror-Image anti-matter do not interact according to Feynman .... Neither does matter interact with Dark Matter or Dark Energy ... This is what led Feynman to propose this solution. If you think about it (IMO ... not Feynman) that the mirror image anti matter would behave exactly the same way as matter in the Lee Yang experiment ... and therefore they would not annihilate as they would not be opposites.

Thanks for your reply ... enjoyed.

cool bananas ... greg
 
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