When are we going to Mars??

fatal291 · Mar 7, 2007

I just turned 18.. I see we can't even seem to track harmful astroids.. or harmful astronauts.. but anyways when do you guys expect people to go to Mars?? I've been trying to keep updated with Space in general.. but its a lot to keep up with. So anyway around when? Like I said I'm 18 now and I'd love to go there. Do you think we will go in my life time? What do you think it would take to actually be part of the team to Mars? I see most astronauts were in the NAVY or Military.. I'd rather not go that route are my chances any good? Well I hope to go to Mars even if it is a 1 way trip.

trailrider · Mar 7, 2007

Thirty-eight years ago (1969), when Apollo 11 landed on the Moon and returned safely to Earth, I would have said, "In 20 years or so!" In mid-1972 I might have said that in view of the cancellation of Apollo 18, 19 and 20, it would take another 30 years to get to Mars. With our national lack of will, resulting in Congress being unwilling to support much more than a replacement for the Shuttle to support International Space Station (ISS) operations, with a POSSIBLE return to the Moon by 2025, I'd hesitate to predict UNLESS we either become more enthusiastic about human space exploration OR someone else (China and/or India) scare the dawg out of us, and get us back on track! There are a LOT more problems associated with going to Mars, especially regarding human physiology in zero-g and cosmic radiation, than was once believed. Some of the data we need to insure the health and safety of Mars astronauts will HAVE TO BE obtained on the Moon. Thus, we have to establish permanent human-tended outposts ON the Moon to obtain the data. While it is true that most astronauts (pilots) HAVE BEEN military, there are quite a number who have been mission or payload specialists, having advanced degrees, but not necessarily military pilots. In the future, I would see opportunities for specialists on the commercial side, once the fledgling commercial space efforts get going. Eventually, these efforts MUST come up behind the NASA-run EXPLORATION programs or space exploration will not be sustainable! History has shown this about Earthly exploration. Since you say you have just turned 18, what are you doing about college? If you want to have a CHANCE of going to Mars or even the Moon, you are going to have to have an education in some field that will be needed. This can cover specialties from engineering to medicine, geology, physics, biology, and a host of other things. Even support personnel who stay on Earth will have to have a lot of diff

holmec · Mar 8, 2007

You might want to look at the Mars Society to get an idea of what people are thinking about Mars. And for space in general check out Planetary Society as well as this forum Dont forget NASA and ESA and RSA info Its a lot of reading. And besides manned missions there's a host of unmanned space craft all with their own web page. If you want to check out the solar system JPL has a neat simulator. The best thing about it is that its current. Enjoy. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> "SCE to AUX" - John Aaron, curiosity pays off </div>

brellis · Mar 8, 2007

Fascinating question and excellent reply! Your question can be interpreted in different ways: When are we going to Mars? When we cross the hurdles of longterm manned spaceflight. When we figure out a way to finance a risky enterprise. A U.S. taxpayer-funded manned Mars program would be prohibitively expensive, so financing must be outsourced. If the risks are too high for a publicly-funded attempt to put a man on Mars, we must devise a system of longterm cooperation between successful government-funded R&D programs with the open-minded sense of adventure that can only be paid for by wealthy supporters with a good gambling sense. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> I'm a recovering optimist - things could be better. </div>

holmec · Mar 8, 2007

Ask NASA how to become an astronaut: http://www.nasajobs.nasa.gov/astronauts/default.htm <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> "SCE to AUX" - John Aaron, curiosity pays off </div>

JonClarke · Mar 8, 2007

The best thing you could to is study a branch of science, medicine or engineering that will enable you to work on either an actual space missions or data from them. You should also join a chapter of the Mars society near you and get involved in education and outreach to create the political environment needed for Mars missions to occur. You could also use the many facilities of the Mars Society to develop and test scientific, medical, and engineering concepts relevant to Mars missions. I hope will be heading to Mars in 25 years. You will be 43 by then, a good age to go. Jon <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars Arthur Clarke </div>

qso1 · Mar 8, 2007

Trailrider: Thirty-eight years ago (1969), when Apollo 11 landed on the Moon and returned safely to Earth, I would have said, "In 20 years or so!" In mid-1972... Me: In 1976, I was banking on a 1986 and writing a story about it at the time. By 1978, I could see a 1986 landing was not to be...even 1996 looked bleak from 1978. I again wrote a story about humans on mars a couple years back and optimistically decided on a 2024 landing which is also predicated on the finding of microbiological life on mars. Hopefully some combination of private industry effort and NASA will make possible, a first mission in the late 2020s. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> My borrowed quote for the time being:There are three kinds of people in life. Those who make it happen, those who watch it happen...and those who do not know what happened. </div>

no_way · Mar 8, 2007

"We are going to Mars" when it becomes affordable and worthwhile to do so, for us. Everything depends on what do you mean by "We" Governments could afford it right now, but nothing justifies the expenditure. Big corporations could afford it right now, but again, nothing justifies the expenditure. Small corporations, research and science organizations, and individuals ( except for Bill Gates ) cant afford it right now, and have to wait until spaceflight comes down in price, or until they come up with a really worthwhile reason that justifies the expenditure. Its that simple.

bpfeifer · Mar 8, 2007

We will go to Mars when one of the two following situations exist: A: Some nation (USA possibly) sees a national security/defence need to go to Mars. B: When businessmen discover an economic incentive to go to Mars. You are young enough to become part of either project. You can dedicate your life to earning billions of dollars and contolling large corporations. These corporate bodies will posess the muscle needed to go to mars when an economic interest becomes viable. Instead you could go the military pilot/test pilot route, which you are already disinclined to do. You could also train in multiple advanced science an engineering disciplines and persue the civilian side of becoming a NASA astronaut. Whatever you choose to do, it will require a lifelong dedication. I hope that you enjoy your journey and reach your destination. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Brian J. Pfeifer http://sabletower.wordpress.com The Dogsoldier Codex http://www.lulu.com/sabletower </div>

fatal291 · Mar 8, 2007

Thanks for the replies. I already know most of the landmarks & features on the Moon and Mars, thats more than over half of my generation can say. With the majority of them lost to Music & Next Gen video Game Consoles, its becoming harder and harder to get anything done with space. In my area there is NOTHING. I'm from Richmond Virginia and we do have the Virginia Science Museum but that place is an out of date JOKE. They do have an Astronomy club but they hardly cover major events. Even in school I'd ask my science teachers about certain things related to space and they'd just stare at me like their waiting for the punch line or something. I've talked to several NASA reps, however so far they seem "stuck up" to me. I've made long distance calls just to get some info on the internships and I was told "It's on our site". So I've talked to some on the internet and they all just seem to want to point you to someone else. I don't understand why they complain about not having enough money/help yet they do not attempt to reach out, at least where I am. I'm just forced to study on my own and watch tons of Discovery Channel specials

baktothemoon · Mar 8, 2007

There is another option if you want to learn more about the space program and some idea of what you can do to get to NASA. You could go to the space camp in Huntsville, AL. I went there three months ago and not only did I learn more about the Space Program than any Discovery Special could ever teach me, but the camp is almost basic astronaut training complete with a zero-G tank, full scale sims, Muti-Axis trainers, centerfuges, and you also do full simulated MISSIONS. The camp is a week long and well worth it, you also get some college science credits for going. Occasionally NASA astronauts drop in to talk to us trainees. I highly recommend going, if you have any more questions then PM me, I also have pictures. Here's the link to the site: http://www.spacecamp.com/

fatal291 · Mar 8, 2007

Yeah I've looked into that too, I've been looking through the window at NASA since the third grade. I've pretty much done everything, I just am sick of the "clubs" and "organizations" I want to get on board now and make it by the Mars deadline

Boris_Badenov · Mar 8, 2007

If you want to go to Mars give up on NASA. Private industry is going to pick up the ball on Solar System colonization within the next 2 decades. NASA will still have a function, that will be in unmanned probes that will pave the way for colonies, search for resources & develop & test new technologies. Take a look at this; Should Google go Nuclear? An Interview with Dr Robert Bussard The US government could have had us on Mars 20 years ago. We could have sent probes to the very outer reaches of the Solar System by now, but we have not for purely political reasons. The technology is available, we have the will, the Solar System awaits. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <div align="center">. </div><div align="center">Never roll in the mud with a pig. You'll both get dirty & the pig likes it.</div> </div>

mithridates · Mar 8, 2007

It's my opinion that people interested in space should be interested in the world economy, development and education as a whole as well. Considering that still only a few countries are able to fund space development, the best way to advance it in the long term is to try to improve countries that are nearing a stage of development that they can begin to think about such things. South Africa is an example of a country that has a small space agency and a fairly developed economy, but enough serious remaining problems that prevent it from realizing its true potential. I started a thread on this subject a few months ago and bumped it up a few times but received few responses - it doesn't seem that many have thought about space development in the real long-term; that is, that in order to have step d (space development) first we need a (basic education and literacy) plus b (elimination of poverty in most cases) and c (a good, non-corrupt government). Once people have that sort of leeway in their lives where they don't have to worry about where to get food for their table for the day, that's when they can start to think about space. That's why I think working in international development might actually provide more of a boost to space development in the long term than just looking for a job in the field. At the very least, a popular blog/community can always help. The best ones get featured in mainstream papers from time to time and that can help get your voice heard. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> ----- http://mithridates.blogspot.com </div>

vulture2 · Mar 9, 2007

Human spaceflight will be practical when the cost can be substantially reduced. Unfortunately the VSE will not accomplish this. The space shuttle was intended to accomplish this; unfortunately it was much more expensive than predicted. This doesn't mean reusable spacecraft are impractical. The cost of the fuel required for a space shuttle launch is less than 1% of the cost of the mission. Almost the entire cost is unforseen maintenance and operations cost. In the L-5 Society we looked for ways that many people could experience space, not just a few. If this is ever going to occur, we need new technology. Regrettably we will not get it with VSE. Solid fueled rockets designed forty years ago won't reduce the cost of human spaceflight significantly below the cost of the shuttle. But until we recognize that currently human spaceflight is simply to expensive to be practical, at least in the US, we will lack even a reason to find a practical answer. There are some bright spots. The COTS contract may yield some new technology. The X-33, X-34, DC-X and X-37 could have done far more, In the "old days" we would have fixed the problems immediately.

six_strings · Mar 9, 2007

Hope I’m not intruding, but, I read a couple news articles,(can give some links if necessary) maybe not very accurate, I’m prolly not one to say, but, I’ve heard estimates ranging from $170 billion (Nasa) upwards of $1 trillion (Discovery magazine, don’t recall their source at the moment, and another reported by CNN) to get the job done… I love space exploration as much as the next amateur cosmologist, but, a trillion? Whoa… $170 billion, sure ok if it’s spread out. Having trouble prioritizing a trillion though… NASA is definitely known to run over budget, but, still, whoa! <img src="/images/icons/smile.gif" /> What do y’all think? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

JonClarke · Mar 9, 2007

If you want to go to Mars give up on NASA. Private industry is going to pick up the ball on Solar System colonization within the next 2 decades. Utter nonsense. Private industry is not interested in colonisation. Private industry is only just capable of butting people onto a ballistic flight to the edge of space. To say that they will go from this to solar system colonisation shows that you have absolutely no grasp what so ever of the realities of spaceflight. commerce or NASA. The US government could have had us on Mars 20 years ago. True We could have sent probes to the very outer reaches of the Solar System by now, but we have not for purely political reasons. We have done this. The technology is available, we have the will, the Solar System awaits. The solar system may await but the will is not yet there. Jon <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars Arthur Clarke </div>

qso1 · Mar 9, 2007

IMO, the $170 billion is closer to what it actually would probably cost. On the trillion figure...being that the source is Discovery Magazine, I guess that depends on who quoted that figure. The cost would also be determined by the approach taken. The Zubrin class missions were estimated by Zubrin to be doable for as little as $20 billion. NASA modified the Zubrin plan into a plan that was a little more realistic and priced at $50 billion. Inflate that with the usual cost overuns and inflation in general and it could run within a range of between $100-150 billion. Even NASAs most exorbitant estimate (The 1990 Bush lunar mars plan) was estimated to be only half a trill. Only half a trill being relative of course. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> My borrowed quote for the time being:There are three kinds of people in life. Those who make it happen, those who watch it happen...and those who do not know what happened. </div>

JonClarke · Mar 9, 2007

The L5 society shot themselves in the foot by utterly unrealistic assuptions. Human spaceflight is practical now and has been for nearly 50 years. VSE will get us to Mars provided funding is maintained. Whether that funding can be maintained in the face of the strident hostility of some remains to be seen. Jon <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars Arthur Clarke </div>

JonClarke · Mar 9, 2007

Yeah I've looked into that too, I've been looking through the window at NASA since the third grade. I've pretty much done everything, I just am sick of the "clubs" and "organizations" I want to get on board now and make it by the Mars deadline Have you enrolled in a degree that will get you a job in a space related field? Have you joined an activist organisation like the Mars, Planetary or National Space Societies and got out there and lobbied for space? Unless you have done these things you haven't done everything. Jon <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars Arthur Clarke </div>

astronaut23 · Mar 9, 2007

There is only one reason we aren't already on Mars yet. Lack of vision. People want to gut the space program to take care of all our "Earthly problems". They say why should they be going up there when we got all our problems down here. Problem is if we wait to fix everything here we arent' ever going because we aren't ever gonna fix the problems here on Earth thats plaqued man since forever. I don't know about anyone else but I like how all that funding cut from the Apollo program has eliminated poverty and homelessness here on Earth.

qso1 · Mar 9, 2007

If you have seen previous posts I've done on NASA budgets, thats one of the very things I mentioned. Specifically that NASA was funded at 2-4% GDP during Apollo. Post Apollo cuts dropped that to just under 1% GDP where its been every since. No evidence that Apollo budget cuts ever went to solving earthly problems. Disease for example. Since the Apollo cuts, we've gotten new diseases and well known diseases that have developed resistence to vaccines. And of course, that big budget cut of 1973-74 didn't eliminate poverty or homelessness. The worst part. People actually thinking that if NASA money were cut, that the government would actually redirect it towards these otherwise noble causes. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> My borrowed quote for the time being:There are three kinds of people in life. Those who make it happen, those who watch it happen...and those who do not know what happened. </div>

themanwithoutapast · Mar 9, 2007

Back to the original question on "when are we going to Mars" - let's look at it this way. NASA's current budget plans involve first sortie missions to the moon by 2020 and an inhabitable moon base by 2025. Realistically speaking a Mars mission has at least a 10 year lead time in planning. Real resources will only free up once you only have operating costs for your lunar base (which will be substantial in any event). That means an international (and it certainly will be an international effort) Mars mission might be launched at some point in the late 2030s, if we are lucky and everything until then goes according to plan.

no_way · Mar 9, 2007

<blockquote>In reply to:<hr />question on "when are we going to Mars" - let's look at it this way. NASA's current budget plans<hr /></blockquote> My question is, if people ask about Mars, why does everyone start talking about NASA budget ? NASA is just one agency, and its not been very inspiring or capable during the last decades. NASA does not equal space. There are other governments, other organizations, and other businesses that could go to mars, so why all the handwringing about your old athritic agencys budget that is mainly allocated by pork-barrel politicians anyway ?

mithridates · Mar 9, 2007

Thank you; I was just about to make the very same point. NASA this, NASA that. The US only has about a fifth of the world's GDP, and most other countries with space agencies are able to do the same things NASA can with much less money anyway. I really think there's an odd fixation with NASA, and not nearly enough awareness of the world as a whole when it comes to space. The world is about 99% wasted potential because most of it isn't developed to the point where people can begin caring about space, and I really think the first job of a person who has a real interest in progress should be the development of countries that are just about to make it to the point where they can start contributing. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> ----- http://mithridates.blogspot.com </div>

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