Is the HEAT SHIELD a *secret* technology?

[ace5]

Lets suppose that you want to buit a reentry vehicle. Is it the heat shiel a secret technology? Its composition and design?<br />I dont think so, but some friends doesnt agree with me.<br />What do you members think?

 

[drwayne]

Depending on exactly what its nature is, it could conceivably have warhead implications, which could put it in the regime of concern.<br /><br />Wayne <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p>"1) Give no quarter; 2) Take no prisoners; 3) Sink everything."  Admiral Jackie Fisher</p> </div>

 

[mikejz]

Why are you asking?<br /><br />I would say that in all odds there are some high temperature composites and alike that are classified, however, there are other materials that I assume you should buy.<br /><br />For example, AFAIK Dow Chemical sells an ablative agent that could be used as a heat shield.

 

[vogon13]

The Soviets, less constrained by weight concerns, used plywood.<br /><br />I'm not sure how classified that sort of thing would be.<br /><br /><br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#ff0000"><strong>TPTB went to Dallas and all I got was Plucked !!</strong></font></p><p><font color="#339966"><strong>So many people, so few recipes !!</strong></font></p><p><font color="#0000ff"><strong>Let's clean up this stinkhole !!</strong></font> </p> </div>

 

[vogon13]

Homeland Security Dept. might wonder what you're up to at some point . . . . .<br /><br /><br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#ff0000"><strong>TPTB went to Dallas and all I got was Plucked !!</strong></font></p><p><font color="#339966"><strong>So many people, so few recipes !!</strong></font></p><p><font color="#0000ff"><strong>Let's clean up this stinkhole !!</strong></font> </p> </div>

 

[vogon13]

I know I am.<br /><br /><br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#ff0000"><strong>TPTB went to Dallas and all I got was Plucked !!</strong></font></p><p><font color="#339966"><strong>So many people, so few recipes !!</strong></font></p><p><font color="#0000ff"><strong>Let's clean up this stinkhole !!</strong></font> </p> </div>

 

[ace5]

I was thinking, just in theory, about building a reentry vehicle for space microgravity retrieval. Like the russian Photon and Nauka vehicles of the 70-80-90´s.<br />No warhead objectives.

 

[vogon13]

Stick to that story.<br /><br /><img src="/images/icons/wink.gif" /><br /><br /><br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#ff0000"><strong>TPTB went to Dallas and all I got was Plucked !!</strong></font></p><p><font color="#339966"><strong>So many people, so few recipes !!</strong></font></p><p><font color="#0000ff"><strong>Let's clean up this stinkhole !!</strong></font> </p> </div>

 

[ace5]

"stick to that story"<br /><br />sorry, I am not American, so I am not acquainted to what may be a joke.<br />What did you mean?<br /><br />I just wonder if the reentry heat-shield materials can be bought. Simple.

 

[JonClarke]

<i>The Soviets, less constrained by weight concerns, used plywood. </i><br /><br />As far as I know the Russians never used a wood-based heat shield. The Chinese used oak on the FSW recovery capsules. The US used cork for the MER heat shields. Wood is an excellent ablator.<br /><br />Jon<br /><br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><em>Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars</em>  Arthur Clarke</p> </div>

 

[vogon13]

Sorry, it was a joke.<br /><br />You aren't likely to be interrogated by the minions of Prez Bush in the Homeland Security Forces.<br /><br />btw:<br /><br />Stuff they make the throats for SRBs would probably work too. (might be lighter material)<br /><br /><br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#ff0000"><strong>TPTB went to Dallas and all I got was Plucked !!</strong></font></p><p><font color="#339966"><strong>So many people, so few recipes !!</strong></font></p><p><font color="#0000ff"><strong>Let's clean up this stinkhole !!</strong></font> </p> </div>

 

[vogon13]

I stand corrected, I recalled someone using the arboreal product.<br /><br /><br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#ff0000"><strong>TPTB went to Dallas and all I got was Plucked !!</strong></font></p><p><font color="#339966"><strong>So many people, so few recipes !!</strong></font></p><p><font color="#0000ff"><strong>Let's clean up this stinkhole !!</strong></font> </p> </div>

 

[drwayne]

Well, as I pointed out earlier, this is getting into a gray area with regards to security, certainly with respect to export control, so even taking for granted that you are completely on the up and up - the question is being asked in a public forum.<br /><br />Wayne <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p>"1) Give no quarter; 2) Take no prisoners; 3) Sink everything."  Admiral Jackie Fisher</p> </div>

 

[vogon13]

Anyone ever try a sheet of the fibreglass bathroom board?<br /><br />I suppose if it was thick enough, most anything would (PUN!) work. But where is the trick in that?<br /><br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#ff0000"><strong>TPTB went to Dallas and all I got was Plucked !!</strong></font></p><p><font color="#339966"><strong>So many people, so few recipes !!</strong></font></p><p><font color="#0000ff"><strong>Let's clean up this stinkhole !!</strong></font> </p> </div>

 

[propforce]

<font color="yellow">sorry, I am not American, so I am not acquainted to what may be a joke. What did you mean? </font><br /><br />Ace5,<br /><br />I will explain. Please PM me your personal info, address where we can reach you at, to<br /><br />Propforce@counter-terrorism.cia.gov<br /><br />We will have an agent stop by to assist you <img src="/images/icons/cool.gif" /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br />ps-<br />For the record, that was meant to be a joke. Please do not take this seriously!!<br /> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[radarredux]

> <i><font color="yellow">Lets suppose that you want to buit a reentry vehicle. Is it the heat shiel a secret technology?</font>/i><br /><br />Secret in a "government sense", perhaps not. Although, I could see the potential. For example, suppose you develop a ceramic heat shield technology that also happens to be really good at absorbing RADAR waves, then there may be some concerns.<br /><br /><br />Secret in a "commercial sense", however, may use a different level of evaluation. For example, if you are a private company and you build a great new heat shield technology, you may want to keep it secret from competitors. Another approach is to apply for patents, but that is full of land mines.</i>

 

[mlorrey]

<i>**temporarily deleted**</i>

 

[john_316]

Yeah Ceramics will work... <br /><br />When the Iraqis had me working on their nuke program back in the 80's and 90's I used a ceramic nosecone for the nuclear warhead we sold to Pakistan. It was much like the US W-80 nuclear warhead that the chinese bought during the clinton administration. I sued because the ceramics I used were better and were more colorful and I wanted my money.... <br /><br />Sooooo the Pakistanis agreed and payed me up and now they use a ceramic "like" material for there RV's<br /><br /><br />Funny thing is though.... I used to have a lot of terracotta clay pots laying around and for some reason I cant find them...<br /><br /><br /><img src="/images/icons/smile.gif" /><br />

 

[tap_sa]

You find oodles of information on the net if you just google around a bit, heat shield technology is no secret.<br /><br />For instance here's an <i>Iranian</i> paper.<br /><br />But why are Iranians interested in heat shields ... uh oh!

 

[scottb50]

Color is a nice touch. That's not a secret. The problem with ceramics is the weight. If they last multiple flights then it's a lot cheaper and the weight is more acceptable. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

 

[josh_simonson]

I'd think you'd want it to be black so it'd have a high emissivity?

 

[drwayne]

I never worked on a black program. <img src="/images/icons/wink.gif" /><br /><br />Wayne <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p>"1) Give no quarter; 2) Take no prisoners; 3) Sink everything."  Admiral Jackie Fisher</p> </div>

 

[mikejz]

Maybe if they did keep is a secret, I would be not be pay $3/gal

 

[josh_simonson]

>I never worked on a black program. <br /><br />I guess then it'd have low 'emissivity'. <img src="/images/icons/laugh.gif" />

 

[drwayne]

Sounds like a gray area to me....<br /><br /><img src="/images/icons/wink.gif" /><br /><br />Wayne <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p>"1) Give no quarter; 2) Take no prisoners; 3) Sink everything."  Admiral Jackie Fisher</p> </div>