New Horizons Mission Update Thread (Part Two)

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h2ouniverse

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Ixion and Quaoar are not reachable for NH post Pluto imho. They are "behind" Pluto (West from it) so NH would have to brake and orbit Sun in reverse for the tangential component of its velocity vector!<br />The target(s) between 35 and 45AU should be ahead of Pluto in 2015 (East).<br />I think it's an issue that NH's crossing will correspond to the "Milky Way center gap", for it will limit the choice among discovered TNOs... <br /><br />Best regards.
 
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3488

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Hi Joel,<br /><br />I was not clear (nothing unusual there), I really meant if it was possible for the LORRI<br />camera to obtain light curves of both from a distance?<br /><br />I was aware that New Horizons could not closely encounter them, just<br />my woolly headed way of thinking not being clear.<br /><br />Andrew Brown. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080">"I suddenly noticed an anomaly to the left of Io, just off the rim of that world. It was extremely large with respect to the overall size of Io and crescent shaped. It seemed unbelievable that something that big had not been visible before".</font> <em><strong><font color="#000000">Linda Morabito </font></strong><font color="#800000">on discovering that the Jupiter moon Io was volcanically active. Friday 9th March 1979.</font></em></p><p><font size="1" color="#000080">http://www.launchphotography.com/</font><br /><br /><font size="1" color="#000080">http://anthmartian.googlepages.com/thisislandearth</font></p><p><font size="1" color="#000080">http://web.me.com/meridianijournal</font></p> </div>
 
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h2ouniverse

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That's OK. Mine is not very accute either at that time...<br /><br />The most urgent improvement for a TNO light curve imho is for EL61! (but it is very far too, not at all in the same quadrant). as discussed, it seems doubtful that the current lightcurve interpretation (a trixial ellipsoid "relaxed" !!!!)) is OK. I would place Varuna second, for the same reasons (rotational period in doubt)
 
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jmilsom

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On the issue of KBOs, we discussed that same issue on the original thread in June 2005, centsworth_II posted some of Alan Stern's comments from unmannedspaceflight.com. As follows:<br /><br />Alan Stern Mar 1 2005 <br />A lot of work has gone into KBO flyby planning. NH1 can probably only get <br />to 1 or maybe 2 KBOs, and those will be small, i.e., Eros-sized or a bit <br />smaller. This is because after we leave Pluto-Charon, we can only <br />maneuver 100 m/s or so off this course, which means turning only ~0.1 deg. <br /><br />(NH2 can hit a large KBO because we can target it from Jupiter or Uranus <br />as the "substitute" first target for Pluto.) <br /><br />We will not choose the first NH1 target KBO until about 2012, because <br />we will have much better knowledge of KBOs by then in general, and <br />the possible targets along our trajectory in particular. <br /><br />---so there will be some intense scanning for KBOs in the area accessible by NH1 starting 2012. Let's hope they find some useful targets!<br /><br />_______________<br /><br />This is pretty cool. Behold, the first image of Pluto using the high-resolution mode on the New Horizons Long-Range Reconnaissance Imager (LORRI)!!!!<br />IMAGE HERE<br /><br />Mission elapsed time: <br /><br /><font color="orange">Days 736 Hours 04 Minutes 52</font><br /><br /><b>Time since</b> Jupiter closest approach <br /><br /><font color="orange">Days 331 Hours 18 Minutes 08</font><br /><br />Pluto closest approach!!!! <br /><br /><font color="orange">Days 2726 Hours 12 Minutes 06</font>/safety_wrapper> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>
 
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3488

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Cheers jmilsom,<br /><br />Very interesting update. I only checked the New Horizons site earlier on, & the<br />latest image update was the Io & Europa crescent pair.<br /><br />So must have literally been posted.<br /><br />So the LORRI aboard NH is expected to split Pluto & Charon in 2010. Some interesting<br />light curves should be possible by then.<br /><br />On Sunday 8th June 2008, New Horizons will cross the orbit of Saturn, being only the <br />fifth spacecraft ever to venture beyond Saturn.<br /><br />Andrew Brown. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080">"I suddenly noticed an anomaly to the left of Io, just off the rim of that world. It was extremely large with respect to the overall size of Io and crescent shaped. It seemed unbelievable that something that big had not been visible before".</font> <em><strong><font color="#000000">Linda Morabito </font></strong><font color="#800000">on discovering that the Jupiter moon Io was volcanically active. Friday 9th March 1979.</font></em></p><p><font size="1" color="#000080">http://www.launchphotography.com/</font><br /><br /><font size="1" color="#000080">http://anthmartian.googlepages.com/thisislandearth</font></p><p><font size="1" color="#000080">http://web.me.com/meridianijournal</font></p> </div>
 
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h2ouniverse

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Thanks jmilsom.<br /><br />My concern is that the area accessible to NH1 seems to coincide quite well with the Milky Way gap, which is still preventing astronomers from discovering TNOs in that angular sector. (Area +/-15° from galactical plane is generally discarded by tnos-hunters). I'm not even sure that Pan-Starrs will be able to make it.<br /><br />
 
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centsworth_II

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Alan Stern's latest comments on unmannedspaceflight.com, Jan. 18, 2008:<br /><br /><b>"...John Spencer pointed out to me that I'd oversimplified the original reply I made <br />on when we will search for KBOs: In essence, Pluto doesn't really clear the <br />galactic center star fields until 2012, but to quote John and give you a little more <br />detail about why we begin in 2011: "Our advantage waiting till around 2011 to <br />resume the search is that the search area is MUCH smaller than it was in 2004, <br />so we can hit each spot with a lot more images to subtract the background <br />stars." 2012 just gets better, of course, as the search area decreases more and <br />PLuto is then clear of the dense star fields."</b><br /><br />See the THREAD for further discussion by forum members.<br />Stern's comment is post #1010. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>
 
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comga

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Alan Stern Mar 1 2005<br />... after we leave Pluto-Charon, we can only maneuver 100 m/s or so off this course, which means turning only ~0.1 deg. <br /><br />That as written almost a year before launch. Since then, the extremely precise launch and subsequent trajectory correction maneuvers should have resulted in a better fuel budget. This will increase the maximum possible "turn" and increase the accessible volume.<br /><br />Does anyone know the current estimate of propulsion limited turn (vs ~0.1 deg) or delta-V (vs ~100 m/sec)?
 
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Philotas

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http://pluto.jhuapl.edu/gallery/sciencePhotos/image.php?gallery_id=2&image_id=83 <br /><br />Latest picture of Pluto.<br /><br /><font color="yellow">New Horizons was still too far from Pluto (3.6 billion kilometers, or 2.2 billion miles) for LORRI to resolve any details on Pluto’s surface – that won’t happen until summer 2014, approximately one year before closest approach. For now the entire Pluto system remains a bright dot to the spacecraft’s telescopic camera, though LORRI is expected to start resolving Charon from Pluto – seeing them as separate objects – in summer 2010.</font>/safety_wrapper> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>
 
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MeteorWayne

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<p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Indeed. Means that it is going to reach Saturn's orbit soon. Posted by h2ouniverse</DIV></p><p class="boldFeature">Next up: Saturn </p><p>New Horizons' next checkpoint comes on June 8, 2008, when it passes the orbit of Saturn.</p><p><table border="0" width="150"><tbody><tr><td width="150"><font face="Arial" color="#006699"><strong>Mission Elapsed Time</strong></font><br />797 Days
 
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brandbll

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<p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Next up: Saturn New Horizons' next checkpoint comes on June 8, 2008, when it passes the orbit of Saturn.Mission Elapsed Time797 DaysPluto Closest Approach2664 Days <br />Posted by MeteorWayne</DIV><br /><br />Jesus, i'm already getting antsy over this Pluto encounter and i still have to wait another 2,664 days!</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>And in regards to the Uranus encounter, yes it would have been nice had they sent another craft to orbit Uranus.&nbsp; Personally, I really wish they'd get going on a Neptune mission as it is one of my favorite planets.</p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font size="3">You wanna talk some jive? I'll talk some jive. I'll talk some jive like you've never heard!</font></p> </div>
 
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MeteorWayne

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<p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Jesus, i'm already getting antsy over this Pluto encounter and i still have to wait another 2,664 days!&nbsp;And in regards to the Uranus encounter, yes it would have been nice had they sent another craft to orbit Uranus.&nbsp; Personally, I really wish they'd get going on a Neptune mission as it is one of my favorite planets. <br />Posted by brandbll</DIV></p><p>&nbsp;</p><p><br /><img src="http://sitelife.space.com/ver1.0/Content/images/store/9/1/29ee99a9-95a6-4b9d-a106-6d540f6722f4.Medium.jpg" alt="" /></p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080"><em><font color="#000000">But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id.</font></em> </font></p><p><font color="#000080">I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function</font><font color="#000080"> </font></p> </div>
 
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3488

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<p><strong><font size="2">Cheers MeteorWayne for the update. </font></strong></p><p><strong><font size="2">After Sunday 8th June 2008, New Horizons will be only the fifth spacecraft to have gone further than the orbit of Saturn.</font></strong>&nbsp;</p><p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'><font color="#ff0000">Jesus, i'm already getting antsy over this Pluto encounter and i still have to wait another 2,664 days!&nbsp;And in regards to the Uranus encounter, yes it would have been nice had they sent another craft to orbit Uranus.&nbsp; Personally, I really wish they'd get going on a Neptune mission as it is one of my favorite planets. <br />Posted by brandbll</font></DIV></p><p><strong><font size="2" color="#000000">Hi brandbll. If New Horizons 2 had gone ahead, it would have encountered Jupiter & Uranus, then go to encounter a large KBO with a moon: (47171) 1999 TC36 .</font></strong></p><p><strong><font size="2" color="#000000">The Jupiter encounter would have been similar to the one that New Horizons carried out, though the giant Galilean moons would have been in different positions, Io would have been seen again, thus giving us another snapshot of this volcanic world at a different time, plus likewise with Jupiter's storms.</font></strong></p><p><strong><font size="2" color="#000000">Then in 2015, an encounter with the Uranus system, with the potential of&nbsp;very close passes with Oberon, Titania, Umbriel, Ariel&nbsp;& Miranda, using the LORRI camera on them, would have yielded images of similar resolution to many of Jupiter's & Saturn's moons returned by Galileo & Cassini, as well as modern instrumentation&nbsp;trained on Uranus itself. </font></strong></p><p><strong><font size="2">It would have been wonderful to see the scarps & coronae on Miranda in their entirety, search for further evidence of cryovolcanism on Ariel & Titania, the mountains & cryovolcanic flooded craters on Oberon & more detailed views of cratered Umbriel, not to mention, viewing their previously unimaged hemispheres.</font></strong></p><p><strong><font size="2" color="#000000">Worth mentioning, it was the Uranus equinox last year, so this encounter would have happened only&nbsp;8 years afterwards, thus the Uranus system presenting a more sidewise view, rather than the dart board view presented to Voyager 2, which could only image one hemisphere of each body in detail.<br /></font></strong></p><p><strong><font size="2" color="#000000">Afterwards, New Horizons 2 would go onto to encounter the large 470 KM wide KBO (47171) 1999 TC36, with its 140 KM wide moon.&nbsp;</font></strong></p><p><strong><font size="2" color="#000000">It was a real tragedy, that the mission was cancelled, due to Plutonium supply & budgetary issues.</font></strong></p><p><strong><font size="2" color="#000000">A Uranus orbiter would be of immense scientific value. Neptune AFAIK, has long term plans anyway, that's partly the reason why Uranus, the Cinderella of the outer solar system was considered instead, for a potential New Horizons 2 encounter, plus the bonus of (47171) 1999 TC36.</font></strong></p><p><strong><font size="2">Orbit of (47171) 1999 TC36.</font></strong></p><p><font size="2" color="#000080"><strong>http://ssd.jpl.nasa.gov/sbdb.cgi?sstr=1999TC36;orb=1;cov=0;log=0#orb</strong></font></p><p><font size="2"><strong>Andrew Brown.</strong></font></p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080">"I suddenly noticed an anomaly to the left of Io, just off the rim of that world. It was extremely large with respect to the overall size of Io and crescent shaped. It seemed unbelievable that something that big had not been visible before".</font> <em><strong><font color="#000000">Linda Morabito </font></strong><font color="#800000">on discovering that the Jupiter moon Io was volcanically active. Friday 9th March 1979.</font></em></p><p><font size="1" color="#000080">http://www.launchphotography.com/</font><br /><br /><font size="1" color="#000080">http://anthmartian.googlepages.com/thisislandearth</font></p><p><font size="1" color="#000080">http://web.me.com/meridianijournal</font></p> </div>
 
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3488

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<p><font size="2" color="#000000"><strong>Whilst trolling around I found a German language website about the cancelled New Horizons 2 mission.</strong></font></p><p><font size="2" color="#000000"><strong>Details below.</strong></font></p><p><font size="2" color="#000000"><strong>New Horizons 2.<br /><br />Launch: Friday 21st March 2008.<br />Jupiter Encounter: Wednesday 12th August 2009.<br />Uranus Encounter: Wednesday 7th October 2015.<br />1999 TC36 Encounter: Tuesday 15th September 2020.<br />2002 UX25 Encounter (possibly) Sunday 16th July 2023.<br /><br />Below: New Horizons 2 route.</strong></font><font size="2" color="#000000"><strong><br /><img src="http://sitelife.space.com/ver1.0/Content/images/store/8/13/a81018b7-f188-4e3c-bd8e-c36ff857f3bb.Medium.gif" alt="" /></strong></font></p><p><font size="2" color="#000000"><strong>New Horizons 2 Uranus enounter.</strong></font><font size="2" color="#000000"><strong><br /><img src="http://sitelife.space.com/ver1.0/Content/images/store/13/1/5db8a35d-99a2-46dc-9123-5576b9934f8c.Medium.jpg" alt="" /></strong></font></p><p><font size="2" color="#000000"><font color="#000000"><strong>The same site said that New Horizons 2 would have been 25% more massive than New Horizons that has been launched due to the 71,400 KM Jupiter pass, having to pass through Jupiter's immense radiation belts. The extra mass being the radiation shielding. A close pass of Io would have been possible (crap it did not happen) & then the sling shot to Uranus would be completed. <br /><br />Then in September 2020 the close encounter with (47171) 1999 TC36 & possibly in an extended mission, onto KBO (55637) 2002 UX25 a large 681 KM wide KBO with a small 15 KM wide moon, in July 2023.<br /><br />The site even mentioned a possible New Horizons 3, that would have swung by Jupiter & Neptune, though this is the first I had ever heard of it.<br /><br />Andrew Brown. </strong></font><br /></font></p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080">"I suddenly noticed an anomaly to the left of Io, just off the rim of that world. It was extremely large with respect to the overall size of Io and crescent shaped. It seemed unbelievable that something that big had not been visible before".</font> <em><strong><font color="#000000">Linda Morabito </font></strong><font color="#800000">on discovering that the Jupiter moon Io was volcanically active. Friday 9th March 1979.</font></em></p><p><font size="1" color="#000080">http://www.launchphotography.com/</font><br /><br /><font size="1" color="#000080">http://anthmartian.googlepages.com/thisislandearth</font></p><p><font size="1" color="#000080">http://web.me.com/meridianijournal</font></p> </div>
 
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jmilsom

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<p>A new PI's update was released today. NH1 has been in hiberbation since Feb 21 and will stay that way until Sep 2. The NH1 team is in full swing planning for the Pluto encounter as they have to reduce their budget after 2009. They need to complete the near-encounter sequence design and testing within a year, so that a full rehearsal can be conducted on New Horizons in mid-2009.</p><p>Full report here: http://pluto.jhuapl.edu/overview/piPerspectives/piPerspective_current.php</p><p>Mission elapsed time: </p><p><font color="#993300">Days 833 Hours 04 Minutes 05<br /></font><br /><strong>Time since</strong> Jupiter closest approach <br /><br /><font color="#993300">Days 428 Hours 17 Minutes 21 <br /></font><br />Pluto closest approach!!!! <br /><br /><font color="#993300">Days 2629 Hours 12 Minutes 53</font></p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>
 
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brandbll

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Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>A new PI's update was released today. NH1 has been in hiberbation since Feb 21 and will stay that way until Sep 2. The NH1 team is in full swing planning for the Pluto encounter as they have to reduce their budget after 2009. They need to complete the near-encounter sequence design and testing within a year, so that a full rehearsal can be conducted on New Horizons in mid-2009.Full report here: http://pluto.jhuapl.edu/overview/piPerspectives/piPerspective_current.phpMission elapsed time: Days 833 Hours 04 Minutes 05Time since Jupiter closest approach Days 428 Hours 17 Minutes 21 Pluto closest approach!!!! Days 2629 Hours 12 Minutes 53 <br />Posted by jmilsom</DIV><br /><br />Is NH in Jupiter's orbit right now getting ready to slingshot or is your closest Jupiter approach wrong or neither?&nbsp; Because i thought NH already got fairly close to Jupiter? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font size="3">You wanna talk some jive? I'll talk some jive. I'll talk some jive like you've never heard!</font></p> </div>
 
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billslugg

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<p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Is NH in Jupiter's orbit right now getting ready to slingshot or is your closest Jupiter approach wrong or neither?&nbsp; Because i thought NH already got fairly close to Jupiter? <br /> Posted by brandbll</DIV></p><p>NH shot past Jupiter about a year ago. See where the heading says "Time since..."?&nbsp;</p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p> </p><p> </p> </div>
 
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MeteorWayne

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Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>NH shot past Jupiter about a year ago. See where the heading says "Time since..."?&nbsp; <br />Posted by billslugg</DIV><br /><br />It will be passing Saturn's orbit (but nowhere near Saturn itself) in early June. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080"><em><font color="#000000">But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id.</font></em> </font></p><p><font color="#000080">I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function</font><font color="#000080"> </font></p> </div>
 
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brandbll

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Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>It will be passing Saturn's orbit (but nowhere near Saturn itself) in early June. <br />Posted by MeteorWayne</DIV><br /><br />I know it won't be appraoching Neptune(due to my dissappointment in that fact) but is it suppose to get any decen pictures of Uranus? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font size="3">You wanna talk some jive? I'll talk some jive. I'll talk some jive like you've never heard!</font></p> </div>
 
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3488

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<p><BR/>Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'><font color="#ff0000">I know it won't be appraoching Neptune(due to my dissappointment in that fact) but is it suppose to get any decen pictures of Uranus? <br />Posted by brandbll</font></DIV></p><p><strong><font size="2">Hi brandbll, </font></strong></p><p><strong><font size="2">No I'm afraid not. In fact the next close up images scheduled of another object is Pluto's moon Nix (should fill a LORRI frame, just prior to closest approach to Pluto itself).</font></strong></p><p><strong><font size="2">There is a chance of course that a Centaur body may be found before then that New Horizons may pass by & there is a very slim possibility of&nbsp;a Neptune trailing Trojan may be encountered.</font></strong></p><p><strong><font size="2">However there will be very DISTANT observations of Uranus & Neptune to be made, but nothing nearly as detailed as from Voyager 2 or the Hubble Space Telescope.</font></strong></p><p><strong><font size="2">Really its going to be quite a boring cruise for much of the time leading up to Pluto.</font></strong></p><p><strong><font size="2">If New Horizons 2 had gone ahead, then&nbsp;Jupiter & Uranus encounters would have been possible (see my post earlier in this thread).</font></strong></p><p><strong><font size="2">Andrew Brown.</font></strong></p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080">"I suddenly noticed an anomaly to the left of Io, just off the rim of that world. It was extremely large with respect to the overall size of Io and crescent shaped. It seemed unbelievable that something that big had not been visible before".</font> <em><strong><font color="#000000">Linda Morabito </font></strong><font color="#800000">on discovering that the Jupiter moon Io was volcanically active. Friday 9th March 1979.</font></em></p><p><font size="1" color="#000080">http://www.launchphotography.com/</font><br /><br /><font size="1" color="#000080">http://anthmartian.googlepages.com/thisislandearth</font></p><p><font size="1" color="#000080">http://web.me.com/meridianijournal</font></p> </div>
 
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brandbll

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Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>If New Horizons 2 had gone ahead, then&nbsp;Jupiter & Uranus encounters would have been possible (see my post earlier in this thread).Andrew Brown. <br />Posted by 3488</DIV><br /><br />That's were my confusion came from.&nbsp; However, i thought that a NH2 project would have been directed towards Neptune... <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font size="3">You wanna talk some jive? I'll talk some jive. I'll talk some jive like you've never heard!</font></p> </div>
 
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efron_24

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<p>Any plans for going to&nbsp;Triton and Neptune ?</p><p>They&nbsp;deserve a Huygens-Cassini couple !</p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>&nbsp;</p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>
 
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MeteorWayne

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Replying to:<BR/><DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Any plans for going to&nbsp;Triton and Neptune ?They&nbsp;deserve a Huygens-Cassini couple !&nbsp;&nbsp; <br />Posted by efron_24</DIV><br /><br />Not anytime soon :( <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080"><em><font color="#000000">But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id.</font></em> </font></p><p><font color="#000080">I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function</font><font color="#000080"> </font></p> </div>
 
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MeteorWayne

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<p>Coming up on June 8th, New Horizons passses the orbit of Saturn.</p><p>It is 10.00 AU from the sun today!<br /><img src="http://sitelife.space.com/ver1.0/Content/images/store/1/1/f101debb-0c2a-486d-b1ce-8ddb08b77f72.Medium.jpg" alt="" /></p> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <p><font color="#000080"><em><font color="#000000">But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id.</font></em> </font></p><p><font color="#000080">I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function</font><font color="#000080"> </font></p> </div>
 
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