Obama withdraws funding for constellation

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evolveraudio

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Re: So thats it...no more humans in space

Sad day for NASA. Since I was a boy I watched NASA do some great things, go to the moon, build shuttles, deploy probes to other planets. But since about 1985 I've seen NASA just get bogged down with the same old low earth orbit science. The best things that NASA was ever going to do have already been accomplished. We did the moon in 1969, now look at the world, we've lost the grand vision, if it doesnt fit in 8 years it gets killed in congress, that simple. NASA is now irrelevant as a government funded organisation, thus the only way we'll ever see interplanetary manned travel is if private enterprise gets on board, such as a big minning company. Imagine a large minning entity gets a cash injection from the government or assistance to develop craft in exchange for access to raw materials, I can see the moon being mined in that instance. But for now, NASA and much of the world has lost sight of anything big, we dont know how to think big anymore, just buy votes.
 
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unclejoe101

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Re: So thats it...no more humans in space

To those who like to use fear and panic to sway people's opinion: sorry, wrong crowd. Your "sky is falling" routine--good grief, I've heard it all before, and, guess what? The sky is still there.

Thank goodness, President Obama has the brains to cancel the Constellation program!!!!!!! It was a major dead-end that just kept getting worse every year. Constellation had no vision and, by the way, no money. It was sucking the life out of NASA.

LEO should be given over to private industry--I really like that for many reasons, but it's also a very sound financial and economic reason. It will CREATE jobs in the PRIVATE sector, where there is ACCOUNTABILITY. Too many government jobs do not have the accountability necessary.

More importantly to me, however, is that we should task NASA to take on missions of serious risk. LEO has been done, done, and done. There are terabytes of flight data available. Soon enough, high school students will be competing to create rocket designs with that data.

The LEO risks PALE in comparison with an intricate, sophisticated mission to an NEO, such as an asteroid, or to the moons of Mars. These are the new landmark missions that will define NASA in this century.

So, for you "sky is falling" idiots, please take your Valium medication. Human Space Flight is about to take an awesome and inspiring leap forward.

Finally, let me close with a quote from SwampCat that I particularly admired:

Swampcat":2ynwzl6f said:
For me, the most important part of the article was the last paragraph. The fact is, that for all practical purposes, politicians have a disproportionate influence in areas that should be the purview of engineers. The Constellation program was a monument to pork. I doubt that will change very much with any new programs, but it's somewhat heartening to see the President doesn't agree with the status quo.

Thank you, good sir!
 
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marsin2010

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Re: So thats it...no more humans in space

"Human Space Flight is about to take an awesome and inspiring leap forward."

Exactly.
 
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menellom

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Re: So thats it...no more humans in space

Thank you Joe.

Despite what the hysteria from people in this thread and a lot of recent articles would have us believe, human spaceflight most certainly is NOT ending.

Yes, if plans to return to the Moon are delayed I will be disappointed. But let's go over the facts for a moment.

- So Ares will be scrapped. So what? Most of us have been calling for the end of Ares for months if not years! If recent meetings at NASA are any hint, a new rocket series not dissimilar from the Jupiter series proposed by DIRECT will take Ares place. By focusing on a system that recycles significantly more shuttle technology, NASA can have a new rocket completed years before Ares I ever would have been.

- So we have to share LEO with the private industry. Don't waste time competing, use the private industry to our advantage. Money saved by letting someone like SpaceX take over the tedious task of ISS supply runs is money NASA can put towards a heavy launch vehicle to take us way beyond LEO!

- So the return to the Moon will have to wait a few years. With the latest rumors suggesting Obama's plan may follow a similar course to the Flexible Path option supported by the Augustine Commission, that means missions to asteroid like Apophis, maybe even missions to Mars' moons! Manned missions to new, more distant destinations in the solar system might be just what we need to (finally) rekindle the public's excitement and interest in the space program!
 
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COTU

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Re: So thats it...no more humans in space

That IS it, no more humans in space. I did read the entire article with comprehension. You are all intelligent people. Why do I have to spell this out? You can’t see the forest? This is not about human space travel, step back it is about money. We just got done having three republican administrations and three wars in the Middle East over oil profits. None of you did not know decades ago that we would never go back to the moon or beyond? Really? Then let me break it down for you. Unless we find oil on the moon or selenites who we can arm, and then in turn arm their enemies aka Iran vs. Iraq there will be no return to the moon or anywhere else. Face it for the near term future we are stuck here and will remain so until our relationship to money changes or it becomes profitable. Before you reply I AM a conservative.
 
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Valcan

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Re: So thats it...no more humans in space

As many here have said.

CHILL OUT :x

Stop over reacting for a sec i hope Nasa gets this as a get your act together type of thing and stops the BS. Dont find it likely, burocrats are notoriously hard to remove when dug in without force (ask the chinese).

I like the fact that Nasa is taking Direct seriously. If it can be done cheaper and faster than Ares V do it. Sound like they really have there sh*t together and have looked at the needs and issues.

I still believe for lighter needs we should stick with commercial.

And for the love god stop with the George bush did it its his fault and the Evil wars in iraq BS. And also quit freakin out about obama. He is a chicogo politician while i dont like or trust him i do support him in this ONE decission.

Remember you cant trust politicians.

So lets stop with the political BS i know we are all guilty but seriously.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"......BTW if you count all the natural gas, oil, and such the US has far more than anyone else"

"haha don't make me laugh... typical USA ego that think that are the best in everything in the world...everybody know that USA still the first economy in the world HOWEVER about natural recourses(gas,oil,natural gas,iron and others...) USA it's NOT the first resourceful country in the world......."

:roll: Accually if you include all the resources we have available as far as ENERGY producing like oil, natural gas, coal etc. Yes we are that isnt ego just a fact of life. Get over yourself its not a "WE ARE LIKE SO AMAZING!!!" just something that is.
Also the vast magority isnt trapped in some place like siberia. In the others im not sure. Maybe i know we are far up there and have the know how to do it and if we can get it restarted the industrial base (which would vastly help our unemployment problem) to meet the needs.

As for china i dont know. China is in some ways very unstable. In other stagnant. Also extordinarily corrupt. Believe me we have nothing on china in that category. Also add in that so much its energy needs are presently comming from foregin powers they may come to the same place as us one day soon.

Of course then theres all those pesky human right violations from both india and china ;)
 
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lumpyinjasper

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Re: So thats it...no more humans in space

So that's it, no more humans in space. Well, back to our caves could be another option open to choice. But even our predecessors who lived in those same caves we may return to someday came out at night long ago to look up at the full moon. All probably terrified, all probably in wonderment. But they still came out of those caves, they still looked up, they questioned, and they desired to go. Despite all they feared, they overcame all their instincts and misunderstandings of the unknown. From there they evolved, according to one theory.

Theories aside, what truly matters is the "human" race may move on towards the Moon, to Mars and hopefully to the stars at some point in our alleged evolution. It will be our choice. Whether it's NASA, the Russians, the Chinese, the private companies or a band of chimpanzees with really ambitious intentions to evolve and move on and get there first, race creed or color won't matter. What matters is it must be done for all mankind regardless.

Life will be lost. Graves will be dug and memorials will be established. Memories will be cherished, by those who truly care. As with any truly worthy adventure from the exploration of the Himalaya's, the Arctic, or the Antarctic, men, women, humans will die. So will the lifeforms we choose to take with us for experimential purposes expire at the sake of furthering our knowledge. The crossings of the oceans only few mere hundred years ago might make us all recall why the name of the ship Captain Kirk was in the command of was called the Enterprise when Star Trek first debuted.

Tonight is a full Wolf Moon, one of, if not the, bighest of 2010. Good viewing all, as always Per Ardua Ad Astra.
 
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gawin

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Re: So thats it...no more humans in space

OK all this doom and gloom in here about no more maned space flight and no more this and no more that... the sky is falling.... stop and think for 1 min. The man who wants to cut this only has 3 years left before he has to get re elected. That gives you and every other NASA supporter 3 years to get out there and make sure you field a candidate that will support NASA rather then cutting it.

The way his first year has gone i would not be surprised to see a democrat candidate run against him.

So it is NOT the end of the world. only a 3 year set back.
 
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SpaceKiwi

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Re: So thats it...no more humans in space

The United States will be back to Luna with bells on just as soon as the Chinese, Russians or Indians look like making the trip. None of them currently do so Constellation gets the axe. Those "cost-cutting" designs were looking more like the proverbial dogs with fleas so I can't say I'm entirely disappointed.

It's just another speed bump on the road out of LEO.



SK
 
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marsin2010

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Re: So thats it...no more humans in space

"So it is NOT the end of the world. only a 3 year set back."

There is patently NO 3 years setback and the title of this thread is still absurd. There is a giant step forward getting rid of 'the stick' and the old unaffordable Ares V. We will be gaining a very capable, flexible and upgradable Heavy Launch Vehicle family. This is very good. We will be bootstrapping upon existing assets, already paid for, from the Space Shuttle Program. Existing Solid Rocket Boosters (4 segment, 5 segment...no matter). External tank tooling and work force skills. A prepaid stockpile of 17 Space Shuttle Main Engines. We will use the existing crawler/transporter and the existing crawler way. We will use an existing Mobile Launcher. We will build the first 4 flight vehicles with (mostly) existing parts and, maybe, some blueprints from the past: think National Launch System which had passed Preliminary Design Review before it was stopped by lack of Congressional support in the early '90s. Best of all, this new Saturn V class vehicle can be IN FLIGHT TEST in less than three years. Under the old Program of Record, the Ares V would probably not have flown before 2020. All in all, the NASA budget to be released on Monday may turn out to be the best thing to happen for NASA since May 25, 1961.
 
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menellom

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Re: So thats it...no more humans in space

Thank you for your optimism and more importantly your rationality marsin.

Now, let me clear up three things for the Chicken Little crowd on this thread.

#1 NASA'S BUDGET IS NOT BEING CUT
Quite the contrary, it sounds like NASA will be receiving a billion dollar a year increase to its budget. Not the three billion we were hoping for but NASA will still be better off than it was.

#2 CONSTELLATION/ARES WOULD HAVE GOTTEN THE AXE ANYWAYS
Let's just face facts, Constellation and the 'Vision For Space Exploration' were nothing but an underfunded boondoggle the last administration threw together to silence all the people criticizing their 'anti-science' stance. The outline and goals were rushed and there was no attempt to actually follow through with the plan. Ares will be dropped for a cheaper, faster alternative (most likely Jupiter or something similar) which will be flying closer to 2013 than 2018, and the vision or lack thereof for space exploration will be revise.

#3 DELAYING THE RETURN TO THE MOON =//= THE END OF HUMAN SPACEFLIGHT
I don't think I should have to explain this but assuming I'm wrong, guys we're talking a delay of a couple years. We'll land on the Moon within 15, and in the interim we'll do a lot of other cool stuff from manned missions to asteroids to sending astronauts to land within (almost literally) a stone's throw of Mars.
Seriously guys... I don't know about you but if waiting a couple years extra to break ground on that lunar base gives us a chance at making this a reality:
MarsPhobos.gif

Fine by me.
 
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quatermass

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Re: So thats it...no more humans in space

Seriously, Space Cadets, it's time to stop taking the Happy Pills and see what's happening. When Constellation / Ares are cancelled, there will be nothing - repeat, nothing - to replace it. There's nothing even being seriously proposed. Direct, Delta, Taurus... this is all pure speculation and you can bet the farm on the fact that none of these paper exercises will ever get to the point of cutting metal. Obama is not a fan of space. Go back and see his pre-election statements. He's getting his wish, and can blame it all on the "economic crisis". You guys are running a trillion dollar deficit - how difficult do you think it will be for him to justify cutting spending on a space programme - especially one that just puts us back into LEO? As for the pretty graphics and Powerpoint presentations - that's all they are, and all they will be. It may not be the end of human spaceflight, but it certainly amounts to nothing more than stagnation for at least the next 15 years, because there just isn't the political will to do anything about it. The skilled people in NASA will leave or retire, the education system isn't producing enough well qualified engineers, the public support for space is lacking, the political will isn't there... it's hopeless!

It's a crying shame, I agree, but seriously... hands up anyone who can see a manned vehicle on top of a Delta, or something similar, inside the next tens years. And anyway, where does that get you - a tiny tin capsule on top of a missile, headed for LEO - I think we've already been there and done that. Missions to the Moon, Mars and asteroids are dead - so the only destination left is the ISS, which will be done and dusted, and probably at the bottom of the Pacific Ocean by 2020. As for having something flying by 2013... that's only three years away! It'll take that long to have a review, report the findings, debate it to death, trim it, get it passed, and then cancelled as underfunded and utterly pointless - again. Seriously guys, this whole machine is fundamentally broken, and trying to stick capsules and missiles together to cobble together a space programme is a wholly futile dead end.

Last time I looked, Chinese, Indians and Russians were human too - they seem to be able to put together a coherent plan; what do they know that the US does not?
 
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stargazer0619

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Re: So thats it...no more humans in space

So the US will probably not be doing a whole lot of exploration, human or otherwise, which sucks. I agree with several of the posters, China, Russia, and India will likely take over. Apparently the American people are too busy watching the lives of other people (fictional or not) on our big flatscreens to care about these things. We would rather support bankers who spend our bailout money going to resorts and people who decide it is better to live off of the government than to get jobs and support themselves. We would rather pay for wars and rebuild countries that would prefer to wipe us off the map. Sad, but true. People have to want these things. Maybe if they realized that their computers, cell phones, tvs, satellite dishes, microwaves, calculators, microprocessors, and most of the conveniences in our lives today have ties to the space program, they would change their minds. Until then, we will sit on the sidelines and watch other nations do the science. And the American people wonder why all the jobs are being sent overseas.....

At the same time, NASA has not always been the most fiscally responsible group of people. How much money did we spend developing a pen that could write in zero gravity? The Russians used pencils....
 
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bluegrassgazer

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Re: So thats it...no more humans in space

trailrider":rbmxb6pg said:
Depending on what comes out of the White House and the Congress, someone needs to point out to that bunch that if they really want to stimulate the U.S. economy, one way to do it is to keep our aerospace & defense people employed!

Are you saying we should keep up government spending on the military just to keep people employed? Isn't this what Eisenhower warned us against?
If we are going to pay people government money to be employed, I would rather have the money spent on failing bridges, roads, sewers, electrical grid, and power plants - stuff we really need.
I am all for manned space exploration, but if there is no way to pay for it, and with taxes such a dirty word right now, I don't see it happening. Maybe we could cut funding for some other program to pay for more manned space exploration; I can think of one program right now.
 
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Windbourne

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Re: So thats it...no more humans in space

quatermass":1906v54b said:
Seriously, Space Cadets, it's time to stop taking the Happy Pills and see what's happening. When Constellation / Ares are cancelled, there will be nothing - repeat, nothing - to replace it. There's nothing even being seriously proposed. Direct, Delta, Taurus... this is all pure speculation and you can bet the farm on the fact that none of these paper exercises will ever get to the point of cutting metal. Obama is not a fan of space. Go back and see his pre-election statements. He's getting his wish, and can blame it all on the "economic crisis". You guys are running a trillion dollar deficit - how difficult do you think it will be for him to justify cutting spending on a space programme - especially one that just puts us back into LEO?

...
Last time I looked, Chinese, Indians and Russians were human too - they seem to be able to put together a coherent plan; what do they know that the US does not?

Amazing.
All the none political reports (and many of the blogs in the know) indicate that Ares will be dead, but that NASA will get an INCREASE in money. That money will go into pushing private space. According to these reports, the money will be used to help private space get off the ground. That does mean SpaceX, and Tarus. It also seems to be for Bigelow so that we (i.e. the west) can have multiple locations for vehicles to head to with these private vehicles. BA's units are being designed not just for Space, but also for landing on the Moon and Mars.
So, where else will the money go towards? According to the CREDIBLE reports, it will be used to help private space get the Direct or some other version off the ground. According to the Direct ppl and a number of NASA engineers, this can be done in under 3 years. The reason is that it is the same plan that NASA had back under reagan. It was pushed through a number of planning groups and only needed funding from reagan to go. reagan choose to not do that. While that was part of a long string of bad choices, the work was laid down for this. We have the production lines in place for all of this. Supposedly all of the current companies involved with the shuttle are backing this. It will likely take 2 years before the first test launch of the smaller single stage version. Then in one more year to put it into full launch. That means in 3 years, we will have the ability to launch 70 MT of cargo AND humans into LEO. That is about 2.5 x what is currently available. According to the early estimates, it will cost 130 million for for that launch (not including the RD costs). Then within another 2 years after that, would be the second stage. That version is not close to being set, but it will put up over 100MT.
That will mean that America will have multiple launchers of varying sizes, with possibly multiple space station destinations. And yet, you say that we do not have a plan?

Let me point out that the above is all supposition. But, then again, so was your statement. You had NOTHING to base it on, except a bunch of negative blogs and Faux News.Yet, mine is based on groups that are known for being credible, while yours comes from groups that are known for FUDings. In the end, both of our thoughts could be very far from reality. That is why many of us have been suggesting that ppl should not be too wild (either positive or negative) in their posts.

Now, as to your final statement.
Let me point out that Russia is still working with what is mostly early 70's tech. They have not changed. They have thrown up MANY ideas to see what will stick and to try and get EU or America to pay. America already paid for most of their ISS efforts, and we are in worst financial situation then they are. IOW, we are not likely to pay for that. You say that Russia has a plan? Not even close to there. You say that ESA or UK has a plan? Again not even close. Look at how ESA has fought to get the Galileo system up there. And THAT is an easy one. The reason is that all the real RD was done by America for them.
India is slowly coming along, as it Brazil. As one who is married to an India Indian, I enjoy watching India make strides with their space program. I doubt that they will actually launch a human in 6 years, but they are getting there.
Japan is also making strides with their space program. Again because of my personal connections to Japan, I enjoy watching that as well.
And I have to say that I am disgusted by many of the remarks here against Japan, South Korea, India, etc. These are countries that are either considered Western (UK, EU, SK, Japan), or at least neutral towards the west (India, mostly Russia, Brazil).
China is the exception. China has shown over and over that they view all of the west as enemies. I do not mean CHinese ppl. I mean Chinese gov. They encourage theft of commercial and high-tech information. As one that has been in a position to see it, I can attest that it aggressive and designed to do us a LOT OF HARM. This is not just commercial theft. They are seeking systematically a military edge over the west. I would not care if they opened up about what they are up and it became apparent that they were doing defensive measure. That is how both USSR and the west were. BUT, they are not. Most of their systems are designed for an offense. And that is just the ones that we know about. In addition, their attitude on the Commercial front is obviously designed to kill the west. They have legal obligations per their agreement with Clinton and WTO that they refuse to honor. They were to free their money and have not done so. They were to drop their trade barriers and quit dumping, quit subsidizing, and allow exports of resources. Instead, they have stepped it up with the opposite actions. They have fixed their money to the dollar and then allowed the dollar to plummet. Likewise, they DID drop their trade barriers for 2 years, then raised many many more to much higher degrees. They subsidize their energy and even their products directly. They are caught dumping on the western markets constantly. In the DOD/Intel world, they have stepped up spying all over like never before. Even USSR did not have such an extensive spy network into here. Even their space program (funded and controlled by their military) is based on stolen tech from Russia, ESA, AND America.

That is the reason why I do not want to see China into any of these space programs. It is not about being against CHinese ppl, but about a gov that is obviously gearing up for a hot war with the west. The more items that they can obtain (steal, buy such as magnequench) from here, the faster that war will come.
Even now, CHina's space program is NOT designed for exploration, but for for their military. That is the difference with the west.
 
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Windbourne

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Re: So thats it...no more humans in space

stargazer0619":1our4yn9 said:
...
At the same time, NASA has not always been the most fiscally responsible group of people. How much money did we spend developing a pen that could write in zero gravity? The Russians used pencils....

Zero.
 
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cas190

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Re: So thats it...no more humans in space

The Constellation program and it's goals and funding were a complete fantasy, and designed for an excuse to increase funding for the contractors, without any real goal of producing a useable and affordable launch system. Why we would spend twice as much money as STS and produce a vehicle with a fifth of the usefullness of STS is only explainable if you assume it was and is just an attempt to satisfy NASA's contractors. STS should NOT be cancelled. We are losing a national treasure!. Constellation is a joke and we do not need to send men back to the moon. The ten billion wasted on it with no Congressional mandate in favor of the program and with no executive approval should have gone into the STS extension until at least 2016. I'm sick of NASA wasting money on this program. NASA's budget should be halved and all future vehicle research cancelled. We were lucky radiation did not kill Apollo astronauts, much less Mars travellers. This idea that men are supposed to explore outer space is
FANTASY!, You people are sick, fantasising about these dreamy scenarios. Did any of you see the Augustine testimony?. It can't be done safely. LEO access, however is critical to national security, and STS is the way for this access. We need the shuttle and we need to put the fantasy business, the contractors and politicians in Wash. out of work. Private contractors will never make a vehicle either, there is no profit to be made from sending men into LEO or beyond. No need = no profit.
STS was Never unsafe, the accidents were management failures.
 
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menellom

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Re: So thats it...no more humans in space

quatermass":1k7sme8p said:
Seriously, Space Cadets, it's time to stop taking the Happy Pills and see what's happening. When Constellation / Ares are cancelled, there will be nothing - repeat, nothing - to replace it. There's nothing even being seriously proposed. Direct, Delta, Taurus... this is all pure speculation and you can bet the farm on the fact that none of these paper exercises will ever get to the point of cutting metal.

So we're the delusional one's because we're not buying into the pessimistic 'the end is nigh' baloney? :lol:

You're still missing the simple fact that Constellation/Ares was unsustainable from the start. The lack of additional funding since the program began meant NASA was already years behind on a plan that required them to build a new rocket series from scratch, not just continue but expand on all their activities in LEO, and launch a Lunar mission on top of it all. Short of tripling NASA's budget (which they certainly deserve but won't find more than a dozen congressmen to support), there's simply no way for NASA to do all that.

NASA's best option is turning to the private sector to shoulder some of its LEO burden, letting NASA focus on an HLV. And our private alternatives are far from idle speculation. The Falcon 9 rocket is done, it's on the proverbial (and literal) launch pad.
 
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ppatton

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Re: So thats it...no more humans in space

I'm very skeptical of Obama's notion of turning over crew transport to the space station to private enterprise. If there were many companies capable of launching astronauts to LEO, thus creating a competitive market to drive down prices, such a thing might be reasonable. However, this is not our current situation. No company currently has the capability to launch astronauts into orbit, and our tax dollars will be used to give one or two companies that ability. American taxpayers will then be beholden to a private for-profit monopoly to launch people into space. That sounds more like a corporate handout than a way to cut costs. Unfortunately, so called democrats seem to have adopted the dubious Reaganite notion that privatization is a kind of panacea cure-all. What we need is a strong NASA with its own corp of highly knowledgable engineers with the capability to be tough and demanding on its contractors. Privatizing yet more of NASA's functions won't create that. It would nice if when we voted in an election, we could choose between two parties with two different governing ideologies. Instead we have a choice between two pro-corporate parties both committed to budget cuts, privatization, and corporate handouts at home and war mongering abroad.
 
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menellom

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Re: So thats it...no more humans in space

ppatton":2b7vlstk said:
No company currently has the capability to launch astronauts into orbit

Currently as in 'right this second'? No. But Falcon 9 launches in a month, and while their Dragon capsule still needs some work, the Falcon 9 Heavy could easily be adapted to carry the nearly finished Orion capsule.
 
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marsin2010

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Re: So thats it...no more humans in space

"According to the Direct ppl and a number of NASA engineers, this can be done in under 3 years. The reason is that it is the same plan that NASA had back under reagan. It was pushed through a number of planning groups and only needed funding from reagan to go. reagan choose to not do that."

That is not quite historically accurate. The space shuttle derived "Shuttle-C" concept studied intermittently during the Reagan and Bush I administrations under several variants would basically have replaced the shuttle orbiter with an expendable cargo pod hanging on the side of a standard production shuttle external tank and powered by 3 SSME on the base of the new pod. Stock 4 segment SRB's would have completed the vehicle. Those design studies were followed by ones for an inline launch vehicle based upon an ET derived core stage with several expendable variant SSME on the boat tail of the tank. Standard 4 segment SRB'S would have been used. This latter concept was called the National Launch System which morphed to the Advanced Launch System when the Air Force objected to the initial name. This design progressed all the way to passing it's Preliminary Design Review early in the Clinton years and then ran out of steam when Congress refused additional funding. The Direct concept was inspired by the work on ALS, definitely not Shuttle-C which it turns out would be more expensive to design, manufacture, and, most significantly, operate. There seems to be considerable enthusiasm developing in certain agency quarters for the cost, production, manpower, and facilities synergies that the so-called "Jupiter" launch vehicle family will give the U.S. human spaceflight program. That is particularly why so much of the tooth gnashing in this thread is totally unwarranted. Even if the commercial LEO vehicles do not pan out, pretty unlikely considering the probable contestants, the fast to build from existing hardware "Jupiter" proof of concept vehicle will be easy to declare "man-rated" and available to function as a ISS/LEO launcher almost from the start.

Chill out people. This is not the end...it could truly be the beginning of the second "Golden Age".
 
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ralphwiggum

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Re: So thats it...no more humans in space

Maybe in the long run it well be better that private business take over, leaving the govt. to other things it is better suited for.
 
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menellom

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Re: So thats it...no more humans in space

ralphwiggum":29wux55b said:
Maybe in the long run it well be better that private business take over, leaving the govt. to other things it is better suited for.

Private businesses aren't 'taking over' space. Rather the public and private sector are going to cooperate in space towards larger goals.
 
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