Phoenix surface mission

MeteorWayne · Jul 31, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Since it looks like they may finally have delivered enough material in the latest attempt, I'm hoping for confirmation that the oven is full, and maybe even results of a preliminary heating that show if any ice remained.One can hope.  http://www.unmannedspaceflight.com/index.php?s=&showtopic=5332&view=findpost&p=121840 Posted by centsworth_II</DIV> That would be my hope as well. Only a bit more than 2 hours to go.... <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

3488 · Jul 31, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Since it looks like they may finally have delivered enough material in the latest attempt, I'm hoping for confirmation that the oven is full, and maybe even results of a preliminary heating that show if any ice remained.One can hope.  http://www.unmannedspaceflight.com/index.php?s=&showtopic=5332&view=findpost&p=121840 Posted by centsworth_II</DIV>Cheers centsworth_II, lets hope that turns out to be true. The image you posted looks very promising.Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>That would be my hope as well. Only a bit more than 2 hours to go.... Posted by MeteorWayne</DIV>Only 19 minutes to go.Andrew Brown.  <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> "I suddenly noticed an anomaly to the left of Io, just off the rim of that world. It was extremely large with respect to the overall size of Io and crescent shaped. It seemed unbelievable that something that big had not been visible before". Linda Morabito on discovering that the Jupiter moon Io was volcanically active. Friday 9th March 1979.http://www.launchphotography.com/ http://anthmartian.googlepages.com/thisislandearthhttp://web.me.com/meridianijournal </div>

nimbus · Jul 31, 2008

A witch hat and the "I'm melting" routine.. Too bad he looked so nervous. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

3488 · Jul 31, 2008

Weather Summary Sol 1 - 63. <img src="http://sitelife.space.com/ver1.0/Content/images/store/13/11/7da85def-cdcb-462c-8b97-a7c96fd7934c.Medium.jpg" alt="" />  Hi Res 360 deg Mission Success Panorama. <img src="http://sitelife.space.com/ver1.0/Content/images/store/9/10/09218ec1-d3b0-48b2-8a0e-de83ffa006aa.Medium.jpg" alt="" />  Andrew Brown.  <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> "I suddenly noticed an anomaly to the left of Io, just off the rim of that world. It was extremely large with respect to the overall size of Io and crescent shaped. It seemed unbelievable that something that big had not been visible before". Linda Morabito on discovering that the Jupiter moon Io was volcanically active. Friday 9th March 1979.http://www.launchphotography.com/ http://anthmartian.googlepages.com/thisislandearthhttp://web.me.com/meridianijournal </div>

MeteorWayne · Jul 31, 2008

<div id="post-249967" class="postcolor">Today's Headlines... Water ice confirmed by TEGA in sample with 1-3% water ice (delivered to Oven 0). Heat of melting sublimation at 0 degrees C means it can only be water ice. TEGA analysis of gases also confirmed water. Sample was mostly soil with a bit of ice from ice/soil interface. Mission extended to end of fiscal year Sept 30. For only $2 million more, very cheap IMHO. To Sol 124. Full Stereo Panorama completed, took 30 days to accomplish. ~ 100 MB of data, or 15 full days of relay capability (out of 63 or so). Now working on Super Pan, reimaging at higher resolution. Imaging interesting targets first since we don't know how long the mission will last. New targets for extended mission (BTW through SOl 124) Atmospheric pressure decreasing as CO2 condenses in southern hemisphere, effect still can be measured in northern arctic. Scribblenotes later. MW </div> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

MeteorWayne · Jul 31, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>A witch hat and the "I'm melting" routine.. Too bad he looked so nervous. Posted by nimbus</DIV> To clarify, the site of the sample was named "Wicked Witch" in honor of the Hansel and Gretel story where the witch was shoved in the oven.However, Bill Boynton suggested it should have been named (Hey, he named it) Wicked Witch of the West for her line"You cursed brat. Look what you have done! I'm Melting....."MW <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

3488 · Jul 31, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Today's Headlines...Water ice confirmed by........................ Posted by MeteorWayne</DIV>Cheers Wayne,Looking forward to your excellent Scribblenotes, always of a high professional standard.Mission Success Pan in a polar view. <img src="http://sitelife.space.com/ver1.0/Content/images/store/5/3/b56d03d5-4e9a-4300-835c-bbe8fa270b5b.Medium.jpg" alt="" />  New dig areas. <img src="http://sitelife.space.com/ver1.0/Content/images/store/8/2/78eef068-94e5-4d6e-b23b-409681ca2b94.Medium.jpg" alt="" />  Andrew Brown.  <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> "I suddenly noticed an anomaly to the left of Io, just off the rim of that world. It was extremely large with respect to the overall size of Io and crescent shaped. It seemed unbelievable that something that big had not been visible before". Linda Morabito on discovering that the Jupiter moon Io was volcanically active. Friday 9th March 1979.http://www.launchphotography.com/ http://anthmartian.googlepages.com/thisislandearthhttp://web.me.com/meridianijournal </div>

efron_24 · Jul 31, 2008

"Atmospheric pressure decreasing as CO2 condenses in southern hemisphere, effect still can be measured in northern arctic." decrease would mean getting less ? That is amazing... that things at the South pole effect the northpole this much <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

Mee_n_Mac · Jul 31, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>"Atmospheric pressure decreasing as CO2 condenses in southern hemisphere, effect still can be measured in northern arctic." decrease would mean getting less ? That is amazing... that things at the South pole effect the northpole this much Posted by efron_24</DIV> The Vikings measured a yearly 2-3 millibar difference.  Quite a bit for an 9 mB atmosphere ! <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> -----------------------------------------------------Ask not what your Forum Software can do do on you,Ask it to, please for the love of all that's Holy, STOP ! </div>

3488 · Jul 31, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>The Vikings measured a yearly 2-3 millibar difference.  Quite a bit for an 9 mB atmosphere ! Posted by mee_n_mac</DIV>Yes that's very true. I expect that we will see the same trend with Phoenix. It'll be interesting when the decreasing pressure drops. Wonder if Phoenix will last long enough? I hope so, as that means the atmosphere will be migrating back north & the first CO2 frosts start appearing. Looking 'down' on Phoenix. <img src="http://sitelife.space.com/ver1.0/Content/images/store/8/0/18c0e376-4cc5-4827-a03f-c6edbe05f257.Medium.jpg" alt="" />  LIDAR movie near 'midnight' low sun using Green Filter. <img src="http://sitelife.space.com/ver1.0/Content/images/store/13/12/8d844dde-da40-4ecb-8c66-be2267613e84.Medium.jpg" alt="" />  Mission Success panorama movie. <img src="http://sitelife.space.com/ver1.0/Content/images/store/0/13/00130a4f-02eb-4f76-ad72-8a1bbf548f9d.Medium.jpg" alt="" />  Weather Report Sol 60. <img src="http://sitelife.space.com/ver1.0/Content/images/store/7/5/c76e3c53-d031-4a18-9521-94e2b5a755d1.Medium.jpg" alt="" />  Weather Summary sol 51 to Sol 61. <img src="http://sitelife.space.com/ver1.0/Content/images/store/2/4/d25919d5-7489-458d-84f0-77d3b45457d0.Medium.gif" alt="" />  Andrew Brown.  <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> "I suddenly noticed an anomaly to the left of Io, just off the rim of that world. It was extremely large with respect to the overall size of Io and crescent shaped. It seemed unbelievable that something that big had not been visible before". Linda Morabito on discovering that the Jupiter moon Io was volcanically active. Friday 9th March 1979.http://www.launchphotography.com/ http://anthmartian.googlepages.com/thisislandearthhttp://web.me.com/meridianijournal </div>

nimbus · Jul 31, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>To clarify, the site of the sample was named "Wicked Witch" in honor of the Hansel and Gretel story where the witch was shoved in the oven.However, Bill Boynton suggested it should have been named (Hey, he named it) Wicked Witch of the West for her line"You cursed brat. Look what you have done! I'm Melting....."MW Posted by MeteorWayne</DIV>Thanks, I should have specified that

a_lost_packet_ · Aug 1, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Today's Headlines...Water ice confirmed by TEGA in sample with 1-3% water ice (delivered to Oven 0). Heat of melting sublimation at 0 degrees C means it can only be water ice. TEGA analysis of gases also confirmed water. Sample was mostly soil with a bit of ice from ice/soil interface.Mission extended to end of fiscal year Sept 30. For only $2 million more, very cheap IMHO. To Sol 124.Full Stereo Panorama completed, took 30 days to accomplish. ~ 100 MB of data, or 15 full days of relay capability (out of 63 or so). Now working on Super Pan, reimaging at higher resolution. Imaging interesting targets first since we don't know how long the mission will last.New targets for extended mission (BTW through SOl 124)Atmospheric pressure decreasing as CO2 condenses in southern hemisphere, effect still can be measured in northern arctic.Scribblenotes later.MW Posted by MeteorWayne</DIV>Finally.Water ice.From Mars.Real water.Does anyone else feel like smoking a cigarette? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> I put on my robe and wizard hat... </div>

nimbus · Aug 1, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Finally.Water ice.From Mars.Real water.Does anyone else feel like smoking a cigarette? Posted by a_lost_packet_</DIV>Aye.  One with a few million pounds of thrust. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

Smersh · Aug 1, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'> ... Does anyone else feel like smoking a cigarette? Posted by a_lost_packet_</DIV>Please don't encourage me!But yes, this is tremendous news! The mission has been extended as well, because of this discovery:RELEASE : 08-195 NASA Spacecraft Confirms Martian Water, Mission Extended TUCSON, Ariz. -- Laboratory tests aboard NASA's Phoenix Mars Lander have identified water in a soil sample. The lander's robotic arm delivered the sample Wednesday to an instrument that identifies vapors produced by the heating of samples. "We have water," said William Boynton of the University of Arizona, lead scientist for the Thermal and Evolved-Gas Analyzer, or TEGA. "We've seen evidence for this water ice before in observations by the Mars Odyssey orbiter and in disappearing chunks observed by Phoenix last month, but this is the first time Martian water has been touched and tasted." Full story: http://www.nasa.gov/home/hqnews/2008/jul/HQ_08_195_Phoenix_water.htmlIt's a shame that the forums are on a go-slow again. I'm sure a lot of people would like to read /post about this.  <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <h1 style="margin:0pt;font-size:12px">----------------------------------------------------- </h1>Lady Nancy Astor: "Winston, if you were my husband, I'd poison your tea." Churchill: "Nancy, if you were my wife, I'd drink it."Website / forums </div>

JonClarke · Aug 1, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Jon,Here's a thought, to account for the unusual behaviors observed so far with the attempts to scoop up the highly hydrated soil....I am speaking as a chemist and not a geologist, so I don't know if my very speculative hypothesis is possible in soil chemistry, or in ice/soil mixes.  But I do know what can happen in reaction flasks.What is the possibility that the ices/soils contain a buffered solution of silicic acid?  Silicic acid polymerizes between pH 7-8, if I recall correctly, and especially as the water evaporates.  And this was the pH measured for the soils.  Polymerized silicic acid can be quite sticky to materials which have polar groups, and especially hydroxyl groups decorating their surfaces.  Silicic acid polymers can thus cause soil particles in which the soil contains hydroxyl groups, or metal oxides, to adhere to each other and clump.  And I suspect silicic acid polymers can adhere pretty well to metal surfaces, if those metal surfaces have a coating of oxide  (since the top surface of any oxide coat in a hydrated environment contains pendant hydroxyl groups)...what is the surface of the scoop made of?  Silicic acid can also polymerize to form tiny nanoparticles and colloids in water, in the right conditions.  These nanoparticles then gradually clump up to form larger masses.  When they substantially dry, silicic acid polymers become white friable silicate powders. Posted by silylene</DIV>Sorry for the slow response, i have been uploading Woomera photos in the aviation section.  Although for the lack of interst I might has well have been here!Your suggestion is intriguing.  Would these polymere still be sticky at Mars temperatures?Jon <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars Arthur Clarke </div>

JonClarke · Aug 1, 2008

With a melting temperature of zero degrees that ice must be very pure.  That's interesting for a whole lot of reasons.  Could it be buried snow or glacial ice?I notice that while there have been two MECA wet cell experiments the results of the second run have not been released.  There are hints that there was something unexpected found.  I wonder what?Jon <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars Arthur Clarke </div>

silylene old · Aug 1, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Sorry for the slow response, i have been uploading Woomera photos in the aviation section.  Although for the lack of interst I might has well have been here!Your suggestion is intriguing.  Would these polymere still be sticky at Mars temperatures?Jon Posted by jonclarke</DIV> I don't know, but I suspect so. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature" align="center">- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - </div><div class="Discussion_UserSignature" align="center">I really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function. </div> </div>

silylene old · Aug 1, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>With a melting temperature of zero degrees that ice must be very pure.  That's interesting for a whole lot of reasons.  Could it be buried snow or glacial ice?I notice that while there have been two MECA wet cell experiments the results of the second run have not been released.  There are hints that there was something unexpected found.  I wonder what?Jon Posted by jonclarke</DIV>Yes, there was that very curious comment /question at the press conference about 'need to inform the presidential science advisor' (if I paraphrased that correctly - perhaps someone has the transcript), presumably about the results of the second MECA experiment.  I wonder what this referred to? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <div class="Discussion_UserSignature" align="center">- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - </div><div class="Discussion_UserSignature" align="center">I really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function. </div> </div>

franontanaya · Aug 1, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>There are hints that there was something unexpected found.  I wonder what?</DIV>Asparagine aminoacids... that would be fun.AFAIK, they can detect molar masses up to 150-160. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

centsworth_II · Aug 1, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>With a melting temperature of zero degrees that ice must be very pure. Posted by jonclarke</DIV>That strikes me as strange in light of speculation that the soil stickiness may be caused by brine. We have to remember that only about one percent of the sample was ice, so as a sample it certainly wasn't pure ice.  Maybe there are individual crystals of pure ice present as well as a brine layer on the soil grains.  Is this a physical possibility?  <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

derekmcd · Aug 1, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Finally.Water ice.From Mars.Real water.Does anyone else feel like smoking a cigarette? Posted by a_lost_packet_</DIV>I think it is safe to say that this mission has been 120% successful despite having to work through a few glitches here and there.  What a tremendous effort be everyone involved!!!  ... And they're not done yet.  <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> <div> </div> <div>"If something's hard to do, then it's not worth doing." - Homer Simpson</div> </div>

3488 · Aug 1, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>That strikes me as strange in light of speculation that the soil stickiness may be caused by brine. We have to remember that only about one percent of the sample was ice, so as a sample it certainly wasn't pure ice.  Maybe there are individual crystals of pure ice present as well as a brine layer on the soil grains.  Is this a physical possibility?  Posted by centsworth_II[/QUOTE]Could well be Centsworth_II. It would make a lot of sense & which salts would be present? NormalSodium Chloride, Epson Salts, sulfates, etc?There is a hint of something very interesting & important, hense the team being 100& sure before announcing anything. Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>I think it is safe to say that this mission has been 120% successful despite having to work through a few glitches here and there.  What a tremendous effort be everyone involved!!!  ... And they're not done yet.  Posted by derekmcd</DIV>Absolutely Derek & thank you for your consideration.Phoenix has been an enormous success. Being involved personally in the campaign to save Phoenix, I for one, do not feel disappointed or cheated or feel like, well that campaign was a waste of time & energy. In fact, the very opposite is true, Phoenix is worth every dollar & more.For such a low budget mission, Phoenix has & is continuing to deliver results that are far greater in value & are part of the increasing investment on the long term future of mankind.Also you are correct, they are not done & I even think, the mission will surpass Sol 124, provided Phoenix is still delivering. I'm still hoping that we will see the commencing of CO2 frosts. At this point, TEGA, the RA & MECA will be inoperable, but as long as the SSI & the weather equipment is still operational & that Phoenix can still communicate, the mission should still continue IMO.Andrew Brown.  <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> "I suddenly noticed an anomaly to the left of Io, just off the rim of that world. It was extremely large with respect to the overall size of Io and crescent shaped. It seemed unbelievable that something that big had not been visible before". Linda Morabito on discovering that the Jupiter moon Io was volcanically active. Friday 9th March 1979.http://www.launchphotography.com/ http://anthmartian.googlepages.com/thisislandearthhttp://web.me.com/meridianijournal </div>

JonClarke · Aug 1, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>Yes, there was that very curious comment /question at the press conference about 'need to inform the presidential science advisor' (if I paraphrased that correctly - perhaps someone has the transcript), presumably about the results of the second MECA experiment.  I wonder what this referred to? Posted by silylene</DIV>Rampant speculation on my part1 Unexpectedly high levels of nitrate and/or ammonium (indicators of microbial activity on Earth)2 Strongly reduced material (indicative of organics on Earth)3 Very high salinity (unexpected so close to low salinity)4 Very low pH (unexpected so close to high pH)5 Chemical activity noted in wet cell (changes in pH, Eh, salinity, ionic ratios, temperature) indicating unexpected chemical activity.I wonder if there is a link to the chemical activity observed in Viking soils? Jon <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars Arthur Clarke </div>

JonClarke · Aug 1, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>That strikes me as strange in light of speculation that the soil stickiness may be caused by brine. We have to remember that only about one percent of the sample was ice, so as a sample it certainly wasn't pure ice.  Maybe there are individual crystals of pure ice present as well as a brine layer on the soil grains.  Is this a physical possibility?  Posted by centsworth_II</DIV>As water freezes it expells salts, so perhaps there are salts on the outside of the grains.  But those salts will still depress the feezing point I think, which is why we add salt to ice.  So I think this stuff really is very low in salt.Jon <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> Whether we become a multi-planet species with unlimited horizons, or are forever confined to Earth will be decided in the twenty-first century amid the vast plains, rugged canyons and lofty mountains of Mars Arthur Clarke </div>

centsworth_II · Aug 1, 2008

Replying to: <DIV CLASS='Discussion_PostQuote'>1 Unexpectedly high levels of nitrate ... Posted by jonclarke</DIV> Has there ever been any nitrate detected on Mars?  If not, then any amount detected would be (very) noteworthy.  Carbonates also would be noteworthy. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

Phoenix surface mission

MeteorWayne

Guest

3488

Guest

nimbus

Guest

3488

Guest

MeteorWayne

Guest

MeteorWayne

Guest

3488

Guest

efron_24

Guest

Mee_n_Mac

Guest

3488

Guest

nimbus

Guest

a_lost_packet_

Guest

nimbus

Guest

Smersh

Guest

JonClarke

Guest

JonClarke

Guest

silylene old

Guest

silylene old

Guest

franontanaya

Guest

centsworth_II

Guest

derekmcd

Guest

3488

Guest

JonClarke

Guest

JonClarke

Guest

centsworth_II

Guest

Similar threads

TRENDING THREADS

Latest posts

Share this page