Why haven't we found intelligent alien civilizations? There may be a 'universal limit to technological development’

[Admin]

Why haven’t we found signs of advanced alien life? Scientists ponder the heavy question.

Why haven't we found intelligent alien civilizations? There may be a 'universal limit to technological development’ : Read more

 

[fj.torres]

Instead of fretting over a natural upper limit on technological development why not try to quantify the *floor* for the emergence of technological species.

AKA, the rare Earth theories.
The more we learn about Earth, the Sun, and the exoplanets, the less likely *we* are. The Drake equation factors keep getting smaller and smaller over time, especially when time is factored in.

It is increasingly likely that what we see (and don't see) is all there is today.

 

[mok.monster]

We need to look beyond our 3 dimensions. Advanced civilizations will know how to access and utilize those further dimensions, especially to space-travel

 

[weedonald]

These type of articles are so anthropomorphic, short-sighted and provincial , they defy explanation. The known universe alone is comprised of 100 billion galaxies. The yet to be discovered or examined universe may contain as many as 200 billion galaxies or even far more. The furthest we can see so far using our best satellite telescopes is about 13.32 billion years ago. Given that we have barely "explored" or even marginally mapped less than 1% of our visible universe and that the furthest galaxy yet seen is now 13.32 billion years older than what we see, then it is sheer hubris, arrogance and narcissism to pretend we "see" or "know" anything about what is going on in star systems that are 10 to 100 times older than us and whose potential for harbouring intelligent life is possibly the same as our tiny solar system's is, then by all means let us continue the search but here are some things to consider:

1) Maybe we haven't discovered other civilizations because they don't want to reveal themselves to us,
2) Maybe we are looking in the wrong places, or in the wrong ways, or even maybe in the wrong time.
3) Also, perhaps we have, in our delusional arrogance, totally missed all the subtle signs that alien intelligence knows we are here and has decided to stand back and watch from a distance.
4) Finally, there is a strong possibility that we are already known and found to be a dull, ignorant, violent, immoral and unethical collection of brutes not worth a true scientist's interest or examination because there are better alternatives out there.

 

[billslugg]

The paper is citing the Euro's inability to produce fuels from wind and solar, and their inability to mainstream the latest medical techniques, as evidence that society is topping out. We came to America to get away from those people. You cite us, not them. Society is doing just fine.

The paper posits but one possible reason, there are many.

 

[mok.monster]

These type of articles are so anthropomorphic, short-sighted and provincial , they defy explanation. The known universe alone is comprised of 100 billion galaxies. The yet to be discovered or examined universe may contain as many as 200 billion galaxies or even far more. The furthest we can see so far using our best satellite telescopes is about 13.32 billion years ago. Given that we have barely "explored" or even marginally mapped less than 1% of our visible universe and that the furthest galaxy yet seen is now 13.32 billion years older than what we see, then it is sheer hubris, arrogance and narcissism to pretend we "see" or "know" anything about what is going on in star systems that are 10 to 100 times older than us and whose potential for harbouring intelligent life is possibly the same as our tiny solar system's is, then by all means let us continue the search but here are some things to consider:

1) Maybe we haven't discovered other civilizations because they don't want to reveal themselves to us,
2) Maybe we are looking in the wrong places, or in the wrong ways, or even maybe in the wrong time.
3) Also, perhaps we have, in our delusional arrogance, totally missed all the subtle signs that alien intelligence knows we are here and has decided to stand back and watch from a distance.
4) Finally, there is a strong possibility that we are already known and found to be a dull, ignorant, violent, immoral and unethical collection of brutes not worth a true scientist's interest or examination because there are better alternatives out there.

Archaeology e.g. nazca lines and the precision cut and laying of massive stone blocks is beyond our comprehension of the abilities of our forebears. So many documented instances of large beings with conical heads that I am now back to Eric von Danicken's ideas. It is possible that an advanced civilization communicated with our ancient ones and knew how to leave only subtle, cryptic traces of their visits

 

[billslugg]

We know how the ancients quarried, dressed, moved and erected monoliths. Nazca lines are made locally, from the ground. Cone shaped heads? I cannot prove a negative. Could be.

 

[sgtcook1]

What have we actually accomplished since the late 50’s moving forward? We went to the moon how long ago? To our detriment, we are hogtied by the all mighty dollar, but we’re also handicapped by our thinking. We look at stars through our experience. Our planet however, is a baby in comparison to others in our galaxy. An intelligent alien civilization could be using technology we can only dream about.

 

[Unclear Engineer]

What this line of thought suggests to me is high probability that societies elsewhere have not ever developed the ability to travel through space at the speed of light, much less multiple times the speed of light. So, that may be the actual "ceiling" that is preventing us from being visited by the menagerie of extraterrestrial societies envisioned by Hollywood fantasies.

It seems that there is a separable question about whether highly technological societies survive for very long periods of time. The complexity/fragility issue is a significant consideration, as is the reduction in redundancy as multiple mostly isolated cultures have combined and become interdependent, so that if the whole system collapses, there is no other competing system elsewhere on the planet to take its place and continue to advance technologically.

As I have posted here many times before, I think that humans are in danger of a technology-limiting, catastrophic population collapse if we do not soon learn how to control ourselves, so that our overpopulation does not cause our global society to collapse from stresses on ourselves and the Earth's ecosystem.

 

[KellyVanHouten]

This is the closest I've seen anyone get to my own hypothesis. Interesting.

 

[Macmanjim]

Two words: Luis Elizondo. Watch his interview with John Batchelor.

 

[Dave]

This is fast becoming the worst kept secret. The DOD and the Pentagon has kept the truth from the public for decades. Now bipartisan members of congress continue to work together to determine why enormous amounts of money are spent on the reverse engineering of spacecraft of other intelligent lifeforms. Congress will probably be the bridge, of informing the public of what is happening. NHI's (non human intelligence) are flying in our skies doing as they wish and their intent is still unknown. They continue to show they are no threat and yet flight safety is still being regarded as the prime concern. It was always the motive of the military to keep these very rare events a secret and now they will have to deal with the backlash. They obviously do not want to deal with that. An advanced species is becoming more 'aware to the public' due to the increased rate of the sightings, by mainly military personnel. Whistleblowers are becoming a common occurrence and video evidence continues to come forth. Increasingly what is being seen is spacecraft that to our science, defies the laws of physics.

 

[Unclear Engineer]

Where is the physical or video evidence of government (or anybody) actually doing any "reverse engineering of spacecraft of other intelligent lifeforms"?

Conspiracy theory promotors keep insisting on that, but all they actually have to show is grainy flight videos or sensor data that we do not understand.

Show me the alien spacecraft that we are supposedly reverse engineering.

Talk is cheap. Posting conspiracy theories on the Internet is actually profitable (by getting monetized "shares").

 

[George²]

We need to look beyond our 3 dimensions. Advanced civilizations will know how to access and utilize those further dimensions, especially to space-travel

What is "dimensions"? How you will prove that exist something different than this which we can observe?

 

[Dave]

What we have observed is only the tip of the iceberg. There is a continued effort to find advanced civilizations and earth's twin should be found in our lifetimes.

There are no conspiracy theories only facts. What a credible witness observes can be considered a factual event. What hundreds of credible witnesses have seen over decades are spacecraft that defy the laws of physics. Facts. There are those who wish to turn a blind eye to facts, it is their choice. The people involved in reverse engineering can face severe penalties for coming forth with the truth. The name of the project is the Immaculate Constellation. The reverse engineering of non human spacecraft. Bipartisan members of congress are very concerned with the money being spent for these secret wings of the military. The true facts about UAP's, well there is only one true source the DOD and the Pentagon, and they do not release information. Good luck, looking for the truth.

The public does deserve to know the truth. Or if you are on the side of the DOD and the Pentagon then it is a simple understanding, the public does not deserve to know the truth.

 

[Dave]

People who make money off this topic are a very real problem. False claims and conspiracy theories are simply put, providing the wrong information. 'Spoofing' is a very real problem and only adds to the confusion surrounding this topic.

 

[billslugg]

"What a credible witness observes can be considered a factual event." - Dave

It can be considered a fact that a witness is considered to be credible.
It can be a fact that a witness said they saw something.
That's about as far as it goes.

 

[George²]

Speaking of a credible witness, less than a week ago, one morning I observed many orbiting objects moving in various directions. West-east, north-south and moving with any other inclinations relative to the equator. However, not one accelerated, slowed, changed direction, or blinked (so they probably weren't airplanes, there were two airplanes at the time I was watching and they were distinct enough with their marker lights and even had a turn on their course .It was early in the morning, about an hour before dawn.

 

[Dave]

One report that needs to be watched closely is BLC-1. In 2021, a signal was detected from the Proxima Centauri star system the signal lasted a short while, then disappeared completely. It was thought to be electronic interference from earth and was deemed another false alarm. However, recent analysis of the data reveals an unusual pattern in the initial signal. Teams from both the United States and China are working on interpreting the data.

 

[Unclear Engineer]

Dave, do you have a link that describes the "unusual pattern in the initial signal"?

 

[Dave]

Further information on BLC-1 can be found on 'you tube' under Exoplanet-sci: Alien announcement imminent two groups of scientists find.

 

[COLGeek]

Further information on BLC-1 can be found on 'you tube' under Exoplanet-sci: Alien announcement imminent two groups of scientists find.

Lots of similar channels/sources with zero evidence beyond stated claims. Not really a definitive source.

Still, we shall see. I would not start holding my breath in anticipation of something earth shattering.

 

[Unclear Engineer]

OK, I'll wait for the actual announcement. No sense wasting my time listening to some long-winded non-scientist tell us that some actual scientists maybe are going to announce "something".

 

[Dave]

Many wait for the headline that is greater than every headline before it.
INTELLIGENT LIFE HAS BEEN FOUND! AND WE ARE MAKING CONTACT! It will be the story of the millennium.

However, our smug and arrogant ways are contrasted only by our ignorance. Our science knows next to NOTHING about the Proxima Centauri star system. It does not transit us. for all we know a thriving advanced species lives on this world. Give Proxima b a stronger magnetic field along with a faster spin on its axis, and you have a world that is not only similar in size to earth, but sitting right smack in the middle of its habitable zone. It could have one moon or perhaps a hundred. The truth is, we don't know what we don't know.

Even if, this were not true, look again at our incredible good fortune. The closest star system to us has a triple star system. The energy resource of the Alpha Centauri system is off the scales. Two yellow stars and a red dwarf could be used as a gateway to the entire galaxy. If there is one message to give humanity it is to open your eyes and your minds to the greatness of your potential. It is okay for humanity to bask in its greatness.

 

[COLGeek]

Many wait for the headline that is greater than every headline before it.
INTELLIGENT LIFE HAS BEEN FOUND! AND WE ARE MAKING CONTACT! It will be the story of the millennium.

However, our smug and arrogant ways are contrasted only by our ignorance. Our science knows next to NOTHING about the Proxima Centauri star system. It does not transit us. for all we know a thriving advanced species lives on this world. Give Proxima b a stronger magnetic field along with a faster spin on its axis, and you have a world that is not only similar in size to earth, but sitting right smack in the middle of its habitable zone. It could have one moon or perhaps a hundred. The truth is, we don't know what we don't know.

Even if, this were not true, look again at our incredible good fortune. The closest star system to us has a triple star system. The energy resource of the Alpha Centauri system is off the scales. Two yellow stars and a red dwarf could be used as a gateway to the entire galaxy. If there is one message to give humanity it is to open your eyes and your minds to the greatness of your potential. It is okay for humanity to bask in its greatness.

...or not.

I don't agree with the smugness, arrogance, and other self-centered behavior you harp on.

Here, where you share your thoughts, you are addressing a group of smart, experienced, open-minded folks. Most share the thought that life exists elsewhere in the Universe.

However, few agree that this life has visited us, or is still doing so. Aside from assumptions and anecdotes, there is zero verifiable evidence this is true.

So, rather than assume some great conspiracy exists to hide the "truth" and insult others who don't agree with you, that we wait and see where the science takes us.

...or not.