STS-120/(10A) Update

haywood · Oct 11, 2007

You got it! Everyone put your hardhats on...the sky is about to fall.

MeteorWayne · Oct 11, 2007

3 questions come to mind. What are the specific defects? When were they detected? If it was earlier, why was the issue not addressed then? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

3488 · Oct 11, 2007

I too do not fully understand what the problem is. Is it three damaged tiles on the leading edge of the wing? Also would this have not been discovered 7 repaired in the VAB, prior to roll out???? Seems strange. Andrew Brown. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> "I suddenly noticed an anomaly to the left of Io, just off the rim of that world. It was extremely large with respect to the overall size of Io and crescent shaped. It seemed unbelievable that something that big had not been visible before". Linda Morabito on discovering that the Jupiter moon Io was volcanically active. Friday 9th March 1979.http://www.launchphotography.com/ http://anthmartian.googlepages.com/thisislandearthhttp://web.me.com/meridianijournal </div>

Testing · Oct 11, 2007

From the status report "In this case, engineers already knew about three RCC panels - 9 right, 13 right and 12 left - that had small areas of coating degradation. Going into Discovery's launch campaign, the leading theory for the cause of the degradation was a slow process of oxidation. Using a technique known as thermography, engineers showed that the areas of concern were stable and had not worsened over the two most recent flights. Based on that, along with past experience with the panels and other test data, the orbiter project and wing leading edge subsystem engineers concluded in August that Discovery could safely be launched as is. The groups repeated that recommendation today." <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

MeteorWayne · Oct 11, 2007

Nice man up, S_G. It's nice to see someone admit when they were wrong, or at least crabby. We all have days like that. {add +1 to S_G respect level} <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

thereiwas · Oct 11, 2007

I worry every time I hear this "it never failed before" talk from NASA.

3488 · Oct 11, 2007

Cheers shuttle_guy. Andrew Brown. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> "I suddenly noticed an anomaly to the left of Io, just off the rim of that world. It was extremely large with respect to the overall size of Io and crescent shaped. It seemed unbelievable that something that big had not been visible before". Linda Morabito on discovering that the Jupiter moon Io was volcanically active. Friday 9th March 1979.http://www.launchphotography.com/ http://anthmartian.googlepages.com/thisislandearthhttp://web.me.com/meridianijournal </div>

bobblebob · Oct 11, 2007

If they fly, we all know what the story from the media will be throughout the mission A real shame aswell <img src="/images/icons/frown.gif" />

bobblebob · Oct 11, 2007

"The defects are hairline cracks in 3 RCC panels which have been analysised and found acceptable for flight. The flew on the last Discovery mission and they came back unchanged" I understand what you're saying about the analysis etc, but surely they should have replaced them before rollout, just to be on the safe side. And more so after Columbia

shuttle_rtf · Oct 11, 2007

Thanks Dave, I was only upset about it because of the respect I have for you, via my time here, gaining more of an understanding - as I'm sure you all are here - via your answers to my newbie questions before I started NASASpaceflight.com, and your support for me starting it. Apology accepted with thanks. Chris.

kimmern123 · Oct 12, 2007

What's the price for an RCC-panel? I guess they're quite expensive, like most parts on the shuttle.

turbopause · Oct 12, 2007

If you have to ask you can't afford one

Testing · Oct 12, 2007

Wrong question. What is the lead time? <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

racer7 · Oct 12, 2007

<blockquote>In reply to:<hr />You don't understand what L2 is. We would never put anyone at risk of this, as it is explained in the intro sections of that area of the site. We're picking up the ball PAO's dropped, we're not publishing anything SBU, ITAR, Export Controlled etc.etc. <hr /></blockquote>I don't want to further derail this thread, but I also don't want to be accused of doing a drive-by and leaving. Chris, I remember when you were posting here and considering building NSF. I'm amazed at how fast your site took off and grew. You deserve a lot of praise for what you've done. I do occasionally read your articles when big events are going on (tile damage, Falcon 1 failure, etc.). I find them to be informative and accessible. There is none of the "sky is falling" stuff that exists with the main stream media. Great job! That said, I really don't care for your forums. More specifically, it's the posters. Some of what I dislike is just the attitude. For example, you'll have someone ask a slightly off topic question. Even if it's a good question, it will be followed by a pile on of about six other posters telling them to stick to the topic. Really, who causes the bigger distraction there? It gets annoying just trying to follow a thread. Granted, I'm talking about the L1 forums, so maybe it's better on L2? I'm sure you're careful in regards to what is actually published. I still expect that a time will come that someone posts too much or comments about something they shouldn't. Showing that they have the most inside information seems to be in the nature of some of your posters. So please, accept a honest congratulations from me on the success of your site, but realize that at least your forums aren't for everyone. I'll happily stay here and read what shuttle_guy and a some of the others have to say.

shuttle_rtf · Oct 12, 2007

Thanks, I very much appreciate your comment, Racer, especially on my news articles, as that's my main role with the site. I also understand the nature of forums and how certain forums are more suited to certain posters etc.etc. In fact, I wouldn't of wanted to create a clone of this site, we did aim to be different, and there's room for both, with crossover (we don't do those monster threads on the MERs for example, we're very specific to launch vehicles). I would also be the first person to say that you're in great hands here with Shuttle Guy, as I know only too well from the time I was here (more regularly). Again, thanks for your kind words and I'll also end it at that to allow this to stay on track with 120. Looking like there's a good chance of a launch in a week and a half! <img src="/images/icons/smile.gif" /> Best, Chris.

thereiwas · Oct 12, 2007

I understand that the cracks are just in the top coating. Can this coating be reapplied without manufacturing a whole new panel? If there are spares, I would have replaced the cracked ones with the spares, then get the old ones recoated, if that can be done. NASA's statements that "this has never been a problem before" came out with both the Challenger and the Columbia disasters. As Richard Feynman said in his excellent report on Challenger (paraphrasing) if it is not working as expected, something is wrong

bobblebob · Oct 12, 2007

The main argument for repair seems to be that what the engineers thought was causing this slight damage, is infact not the cause. So basically they dont know whats causing it so have no real way of knowing if it will get worse

bobblebob · Oct 12, 2007

Great if they do, but i really cant be bothered with another media frenzy throughout the mission again

bpcooper · Oct 12, 2007

For what it's worth: "On Tuesday and Wednesday, a program-level flight readiness review was held at Kennedy. Space Shuttle Program managers concluded the review with a recommendation to proceed toward a targeted launch on Oct. 23. An agency-level review will take place on Oct. 16 at Kennedy, where an official launch date will be decided." http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/shuttle/news/status-20071012.html <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> -Ben </div>

halman · Oct 14, 2007

shuttle_guy, Have you heard any explanation as to why the safety group did not make its conclusions known prior to this? In my opinion, the safety group represents the ultimate bias towards safe operations, while the launch and operations management are the people who look at risk and decide what is reasonable risk. Not the opposite of maximum safety, but putting mission goals, launch dates, payload status, crew personnel, and a 100 other things together to decide what is best. But there is a record of a dissenting opinion, just in case. It has been acknowledged, and examined, unlike during the Columbia mission. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> The secret to peace of mind is a short attention span. </div>

MeteorWayne · Oct 14, 2007

News Conference Announcement: 10.11.07 Katherine Trinidad Headquarters, Washington 202-358-3749 katherine.trinidad@nasa.gov George Diller Kennedy Space Center, Fla. 321-867-2468 george.h.diller@nasa.gov MEDIA ADVISORY: M07-129 NASA ANNOUNCES NEWS CONFERENCE ON STATUS OF NEXT SHUTTLE LAUNCH CAPE CANAVERAL, Fla. - NASA managers have scheduled a news conference at the Kennedy Space Center, Fla., no earlier than 3 p.m. EDT, Tuesday, Oct. 16, to discuss the status of the upcoming space shuttle mission. The news conference will begin after the conclusion of the Flight Readiness Review, or FRR, which is chaired by NASA's Associate Administrator for Space Operations Bill Gerstenmaier. A two-day preliminary review to assess preparations for shuttle Discovery's mission, designated STS-120, was held Oct. 9-10. Space Shuttle Program Manager Wayne Hale chaired that meeting and will provide a summary to the Oct. 16 executive-level FRR. The Oct. 16 review is expected to include the selection of an official launch date for Discovery's voyage to the International Space Station. The current targeted launch time is 11:38 a.m. on Oct. 23. Briefing participants are: - NASA Associate Administrator Chris Scolese - Associate Administrator for Space Operations Bill Gerstenmaier - Space Shuttle Program Manager Wayne Hale - Space Shuttle Launch Director Mike Leinbach The briefing will be broadcast live on NASA Television and the agency's Web site. Media may ask questions from participating NASA locations. Reporters should contact their preferred NASA center to confirm its participation. For NASA TV streaming video, downlink and scheduling information, visit: http://www.nasa.gov/</safety_wrapper <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

rocketwatcher2001 · Oct 15, 2007

Would they have rolled the stack out to the beach if they thought that the FRR would send them back to the VAB or OPF? I would think that FRR is an ongoing evaluation during several phases of shuttle preperation, not just a few days before launch. <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> </div>

bobblebob · Oct 15, 2007

What is the point of the safety group if management can just overrule them? Im not saying its a wrong decision, but it makes the safety group almost pointless if their recommendations can be ignored

jimfromnsf · Oct 15, 2007

"I would think that FRR is an ongoing evaluation during several phases of shuttle preperation, not just a few days before launch." FRR is the "final" major program review (a side from the LRR/L-2 reviews). It is not a "process" in itself. It is part of the COFR processes and there are other lower level reviews that feed into it.

MeteorWayne · Oct 16, 2007

15 minutes till the NET time for the FRR News Conference..... <div class="Discussion_UserSignature"> But the Krell forgot one thing John. Monsters. Monsters from the Id. I really, really, really, really miss the "first unread post" function </div>

STS-120/(10A) Update

haywood

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